Ask my current boss to do a recommendation call
Recently, I interviewed for an opportunity to work with a developer that I have never come across before and the opportunity they have is a perfect fit in what I've been looking for over these past 5 years. All around the interview went great, we went over absolutely everything and I was clear with my story and what move I was trying to make. I thought I had it in the bag and it sounded like an offer would be waiting in the wings. However, late last night my interviewer responds back to my thank you email with some hesitations and says it's not going to be with them. He does cite more specifically where he is hesitating and hopes to stay in touch.
I want to push back and tell him I am capable of being a top performer and show him there is nothing to hesitate on. I am also thinking of talking to my boss asking him to serve as a referral on this. This seems a little risky, but I've been working with this boss for more than 5 years now in brokerage and asset management, and early on I expressed to him that going into development is a goal of mine. About a year and a half ago, I even asked him to write a letter of rec for some mred programs I had been applying to and he was happy in doing so. So he knows my foot has been partially out the door at this point, but hasn't fired or let me go early because of that, especially since he knows I put off attendance in 2020.
I'm a little unsure though in asking him right now, but am curious if any of you had something like this done before and how did it turn out?
I think in this case the answer is a clear no. Not sure how much your current boss would be able to sell you into a rejection. A reference call is a bit different than what you would expect him to do, I think? A reference call in our business is a phone call to HR or an automated system where the dates and titles are confirmed. That's it.
Asking your current boss to turn around an existing rejection is a tough one, especially because it is unclear how much it would help you land that new job. Chances are, it wouldn't work and you'd still sit next to your boss and keep going. He wouldn't be able to plan with you in the long run.
This reference call I am thinking of would be more of a recommendation call. It's not necessarily about him turning around the rejection, it's more about using him to paint a better picture of who I am to my interviewer, so there's better confidence in me as a candidate.
Why risk getting fired from your current job to reverse a rejection? There will always be another opportunity - onto the next one!
.
Be patient. If he indicated that he would like to stay in touch, then the opportunity could be there before you know it. Continue to build in rapport with him and demonstrate your value, while also working on the skills he may have had concerns about.
The "stay in touch" part really throws me off, other rejections seem more closed-ended. It makes me think he is "testing" me and wants to see how much I truly want it. What he hesitates on is not really a skill, but more of a quality, and I think the fact that he puts it out there, is my last chance to push back. Is it worth it to try and convince him, leaving the recommendation call out of it for this instance; or just remain patient like you said?
I would stop over analyzing this and move on. It happens to all of us. There will be another opportunity out there. I had 4 in person interviews, asked for references, sent me back a two paragraph response to me how much they liked me and in the end, I didn’t get an offer for a job one time. The “stay in touch” is not him testing you. If they wanted to make you an offer, they would. I’m sure there’s hundreds of candidates who want that job. Likely just means If there’s any other openings that you may be a fit for in the future.
On to the next one. And please do not ask your boss to try and reverse a rejection.
Yeah, don’t over think the stay in touch price. He likely being sincere not testing you. If he is testing you, then stay in touch and make sure you’re top of mind. Perhaps the “test” is seeing how committed you are to this role/ company over the course of months/year and staying in touch will demonstrate that. But, again, you’re over thinking it as disappointing as it may be.
So honestly, it is not a reasonable expectation for a prospective employer to want to speak with a current manager/boss. About the only thing acceptable is confirming your current employment (usually through the HR office, stuff like title and start dates), and this occurs in the background check phase after you have a signed offer of employment.
I get you are trying to use this to rebut a rejection, but personally, I wouldn't go this route. If I were on the receiving end of the recommendation from a current boss, I would find it weird to be honest.
Best people to serve as references are former employees at your current job, past bosses/co-workers. Second best are professors, people you know from industry associations (like served on a NAIOP project/task force, etc.), etc.
Sometimes a peer at your current firm can be a reference, but really, that should be for the after-the-fact reference check, meaning you have a signed offer, but they want to speak with someone for due diligence purposes (not common, but not as unreasonable).
I think it is fine to address the hesitation via email (that is what interviewing is all about anyways), but wouldn't add in a recommendation from anyone.
If I wrote back... I'm passing because I'm hesitant on xyz, and you responded with something thoughtful that might make me reconsider. If you responded by offering a recommendation from your current employer, I would think that is weird.
Yeah, I feel that since he puts the hesitation out there, it's my opportunity to address it. If I come back with something thoughtful and compelling that can successfully convince him to reconsider, it's worth something right? If he doesn't take it, then that's fine too. It's a closed case at that point. They are not interviewing lots of people for this role and it's is not widely publicized, so I think I don't lose much with trying that. The interview process to me just seems more of a sales pitch, you don't have everything they want; you sell to them what you do have and why you can do the job.
I am for sure throwing out the boss as a recommendation thing out.
I think you try to make a concise/thoughtful response and then leave it alone.
In one of my past interviews as an analyst, I know the big concern wasn't skill set, but did I want to be in the job long term/would I be okay moving cities. I could tell because of the questions that I got from multiple people through rounds.
So I made sure to address it in what I thought was my final interview (ended up doing a fly up lunch a week later, so it didn't end up being my final). But the interviewer was happy that I addressed those things head on (as I would be as well), because that was the big hesitancy in hiring me (the other candidates were local). I ended up with the job and stayed there for 6 years + some of my best friends were made during that job.
It doesn't hurt if you go back once and resell yourself, but you should leave it alone after that.
At best, they are interviewing other people and have you on the hook as a backup. I would just take it as a rejection and move on.
OP here; I thought I'd give this an update of where things left off.
So I ended up pushing back on the rejection giving them counterpoints to work off of. My mindset was basically, there's nothing to lose. So it's worth a shot. I sent that out within 24 hours of their original rejection email. It was the middle of the week, so I figured give it time and maybe the weekend. Monday comes around and it's quiet, no email/call back. I contemplate being even more aggressive and calling, but I holdout cause I think to myself Monday is typically a busy day for everyone so I don't want to be a pest.
However, that monday evening the interviewer gives me a call and says "hey, we caught your email response last week and see that your tone is different, in a good way. we talked about it over the weekend and really want to reopen this conversation." At that point its basically another impromptu interview round to clear up hesitancy on their side. I wasn't quite out of the woods yet. They called me into their office for another interview to work on a more hands-on type of project, not a modeling test, but a case study more focused on the pieces involved in a development.
At this stage I felt pretty close to receiving an offer, and this last step was more of a process to see how well I could handle the project management side of development. My interviewer stressed he doesn't expect a right answer from me but understand how do I think about all these pieces cohesively. After several hours, i did have to explain to my interviewers how I linked everything together and what I could understand of it. I had two interviewers and both were very pleased to where I received an offer later that evening, such a huge relief. The only thing I let my boss know of days later was my two weeks notice.
Now, in my experience would I advise everyone to try this? No. The only reason I felt the drive to respond back was because I felt there was a strong interest in me as their candidate, and I was hungry for this role. The way their rejection came back to me, initially, was very open-ended and kind of detailed, so it felt like there was a bit of an invitation there. They had some hesitation, and it's as if they wanted me to clear that up without actually asking it. I do think if you send a response back there often isn't much to lose especially if its direct to the interviewer(s). It should really make sure to address those hesitations and I think there should have been good dynamic between you and the interviewer. There have been other interviews I've been on where I wouldn't do something like this because the right dynamic was not there. It would just feel awkward.
TLDR: responded back to rejection email, reopened conversation, did another interview/case study to complete and finally received an offer
King shit
Great story. Good to provide detail around the situation so we don’t have a bunch of interns following up with HR to protest their rejection
Nothing ventured, nothing gained! Awesome story! Persistence can work great!
Very interesting and bold. I didn't necessarily agree with your tactics, but ultimately you won so congrats. Big take away for everyone is understand the comment about "tone". So important. You clearly had all the tech skills they desired but were "offtone" so to speak. Maybe too aggressive. maybe not aggressive enough? Who knows (other than them).
I think we all need to do a better job of reading the room (yes including the virtual room) and getting a sense of not just what, but who they want to align with. Always remember you're not just interviewing for the current job posting. Most seniors are sizing you up for future roles and impact. Could you lead an internal team? Could you be trusted with a client relationship? Do they view you as a long term solution? Do they want a long term solution?
This is the soft skill stuff you hear about and it's really important in every business.
In my case, I was not aggressive enough first time around. Second time around, came in strong with a good pitch that they liked. More of a hustler approach was needed here.
It's funny that you mention the longer-term outlook when firms interview people. It's a smaller shop and finding someone who could step up and lead was key in what they were looking for. I'd say the technical chops were still important, but almost secondary because most of it is can always be learned and gained as you get more experience.
Et iure sed ut sunt sequi cum. Exercitationem odio beatae autem aspernatur id voluptas enim. Amet voluptates natus magni in.
Eligendi eum ducimus dolorum blanditiis unde maxime ad. Odio aut sapiente est blanditiis reiciendis quasi.
Facere qui aut perspiciatis dolore iusto voluptas. Sunt error et enim ullam maxime dolorem harum. Magni in reiciendis eum et laboriosam delectus.
Vel quasi officia id. Ea saepe veniam autem sunt quia aperiam sequi. Voluptatibus aut voluptas eos at qui non fugiat nobis. Ut adipisci explicabo quaerat.
See All Comments - 100% Free
WSO depends on everyone being able to pitch in when they know something. Unlock with your email and get bonus: 6 financial modeling lessons free ($199 value)
or Unlock with your social account...
Consequatur ullam consequatur voluptatem hic eaque non. Ab laudantium vel molestiae at recusandae. Quo quibusdam et est amet. Eos at ut atque cum deleniti provident quis. Et dolor repudiandae quisquam. Repellat et nostrum voluptatem sunt sint. Sit corporis amet sed enim earum sit.
Impedit beatae placeat aut tenetur odio delectus quae. Occaecati vero commodi voluptatem incidunt alias. Magni error qui molestias et est neque. Eum praesentium corrupti repellat officiis in quod. Quibusdam qui quod quidem officia.
Dignissimos dolore error facere magnam maxime. Eos ad qui minus et aut esse commodi. Sit dolores qui non quam qui. Voluptatem minus non et est. Rerum est velit nostrum quidem facilis velit.