The Recent Graduate Abyss
I'm a 2009 graduate from a top-five US target who has just completed an Oxbridge master's degree in the social sciences (not econ, though). Due to an interest in international political economy which only really began in the second half of my undergrad career, I'm now applying to jobs in i-banking, equity research, and consulting. I've spent the last two years studying a hot topic (political economy of oil), and ideally I'm looking for a position where I can work in energy or commodities-related investment or risk management.
The problem, however, is threefold. First, I never had a finance or consulting internship as an undergrad, and second, my undergraduate degree was in history and political science (though I threw in a smattering of econ courses). Instead, my undergraduate internships were policy- and journalism-related. Although I can spin these internships as giving me a strong communications background and experience in a time-sensitive environment, it's been a huge weakness in applying to finance/consulting positions. I made it to final-round interviews with BarCap IBD and Bernstein (equity research) last winter in London, and though I performed well and managed to establish a rapport with my interviewers, I was ultimately rejected due to my lack of a "quantitative background." Mind you, the BarCap interview was for an summer analyst position, and needless to say I was a bit discouraged afterwards since I had spent a great deal of time learning about investment banking and the basics of balance sheets and investment analysis to prepare for the interview.
Now that I've finished the degree, I'm back applying to jobs, and now I face a third problem. How does finance recruiting work for recent graduates? In London, NYC, and elsewhere the only options seem to be for MBAs or current undergrads, and I feel like I'm now in a "black hole" demographic that recruiters pay little attention to. I have a pretty decent network of financial contacts both in the UK and Stateside, and though most of them want to help, they tell me that they can't find any entry-level opportunities right now because of hiring freezes.
Any ideas from the WSO crew on applying to finance/consulting jobs as a recent graduate with a non-traditional background? Or will I have to go to law school or b-school to get an opportunity to apply for entry-level positions in these sectors again?
1) don't write fucking novels for your first post, most people won't read them
2) don't think you are special, many are dislodging cocks from their asses these days, stay persistent
3) "an interest in international political economy"= World Bank, IMF, Federal Reserve not IB/ER/Consulting
4) can't do shit about a hiring freeze, keep networking
5) if "lack of quantitative background" really is the problem (not sure that it is), you can always take some online/community college stats/adv. calc/ etc courses to beef up the resume while you're not doing anything
6) Give up on finance and find employment in another industry. There's a big world out there.
The main entry-points into finance are undergrad OCR and MBA OCR. Outside of those, your chances are slim to none. Your time would be better spent elsewhere and you will probably be happier doing something you are actually interested in.
Good luck.
Yeah, that was what I was afraid of. And while I'm on Doostang and a few other search sites, most of the positions available require the training/modelling skills that one can really only acquire at a major firm. I'll keep networking and sending out e-mails, but I've come to accept that I'll have to look for alternatives.
Sorry if my opening post came out a bit naive, but I just thought I'd check with WSO to see if there was some recruiting channel I was missing.
keep hustling. Steve schwarzman only had calc 1 and that was in high skl. he studied ballet or some shit in college
^^Yes, true. Consulting industry likes egg heads. Your academic profile should work to you advantage in MC.
The OP is a very strong candidate for MBB consulting given his background. Plus I think he will enjoy it more than banking, which is mind numbing work for the most part.
My understanding was that those who graduated college 2 years ago can get access to OCR, or am I wrong about that? In general though, the above poster is correct. College and MBA OCR is the golden key to breaking into finance, especially banking. Once you get that first job you can leverage that into future gigs.
Over the last ten months, I've come to realize this as well. Several of my friends in banking haven't particularly enjoyed it, not because of the long hours but just because of the material itself. Even a contact of mine who is a fairly well-known oil analyst and an MD at DB told me that he couldn't believe the type of work that the first-year analysts get stuck with. He encouraged me to do what he did instead, by starting at the IEA in Paris and then moving into energy consulting before leveraging that into an IB job.
What I'm really interested in for the present is gaining analytical experience. Ultimately, I want to focus on the risks facing energy/commodity-related investment and/or in developing management or investment strategies to overcoming that risk. Said risk could be geopolitical (which is more in line with my research background), or reflective of macroeconomic or short-term market movements. I first thought IB or consulting would both be great ways to gain experience to move towards that goal, but lately I've been moving more in the consulting direction. But I'll take any experience I can get to leverage towards a good role.
why don't you find a way into research/consulting then use that as your gate to IB if you really want?
Join a commodities trading firm. Your background will actually be useful (provided you studied on your own rather than listened to what your professors theorized about from their ivory tower) and should you be decent (not hard since most commodities firms are so low profile nobody from Oxbridge applies) you will get to trade VERY fast, and potentially make 2-4x the money you'd make in i-banking.
When I was in your position all I cared about really was the money and from the way you write I recognize myself a few years back. That's why I would have taken i-banking over consulting, for example. Hope this solves your dilemma. It's the wrong thing to look for, but you've heard that before. At least in commodities you won't be working 20 hour days, and you will add real value, eventually, perhaps, if you have some balls and street smarts on top of being able to understand politicians.
Interesting. I thought most of these places were extraordinarily competitive to get into. I applied for a London-based risk management role at Glencore a few days ago, and I'm working on one now for Trafigura. If you work at either firm and happen to know someone in London, or if you have any particular pointers about applying to commodities trading firms, shoot me a PM.
Also, go to Switzerland. You just missed grad recruiting (our new ones are coming next month). But you can always phone the HR dept and see if they have some space for a temporary internship from which you can earn a position on the next programme. Maybe some of the firms from whom we have poached analysts/traders/operations guys recently will have openings.
Because Glencore went public, and Trafi advertises like crazy on everything from efinancialcareers to jobup (Swiss version) and even Asian jobs forums.
Name the top 5 firms in oil & gas, and the top 5 in agriculturals. Bet you can't. Nor can most Ivy/Oxbridge folks.
Correct me if I'm wrong, but isn't it Vitol, Glencore, Trafi, Gunvor, and Mercuria for oil/gas? For agriculturals, I know ADM, Bunge, and Cargill are up there, but not sure if I can name the other two.
Still though, while you're right about the low profile these places have, it doesn't make getting a job there any easier. Friend of mine managed to get a pretty good position trading grain in KC with Cargill (with prospects for moving to Minneapolis), but that was after 3 months of non-stop searching.
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