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Wall Street Oasis » Forums » I-Banking Bullpen
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Why does everyone think banking is mindless?
 

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aceofspadestrader's picture
aceofspadestrader
      IB
 
(Monkey, 61
 
Points)
 on 1/7/11 at 6:00am
mindless.gif

I keep seeing posts where people say that banking just involves running models and copying charts into powerpoint. While I do understand that formatting is mindless and a big part of banking, I don't understand why anyone would think valuation or advisory is mindless.

If you actually know what you are doing, valuation is extremely detailed and requires a ton of thought. Moreover, telling a company how it should spin off an unprofitable division or restructure billions of dollars in overdue debt to save it from liquidation seems like it would require some cognitive thinking. So why do people say that banking is mindless for analysts? Maybe they are either too caught up in the stupid formatting? Maybe they just do what their superiors tell them without thinking? Maybe they actually don't know finance and don't know what they are doing so their superiors have to tell them what to do?

Please shed some light for someone that hasn't been in IB before.

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Tags:
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  • Banking
  • I-Banking Bullpen
cahellfire8's picture

Hahaha...because as an

cahellfire8
      ST
 
(Monkey, 46
 
Points)
 on 1/6/11 at 7:55pm

Hahaha...because as an analyst you will very rarely be doing anything BUT mindless crap...but will most likely still find a way to walk around and act like you are the next Moelis. There are always exceptions but at a BB this will almost certainly be the case. The perception of glamour and prestige that was created a long time ago in order to draw Harvard grads into entrepreneurial cutting edge firms, still hasn't faded even though all those same Ivy grads are just fighting and clawing to pack into what will most likely be a soul crushing/brainwashing experience, like sardines.

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HFFBALLfan123's picture

If you work at a BB the

HFFBALLfan123
      PE
 
 
(King Kong, 1,370
 
Points)
 on 1/6/11 at 8:09pm

If you work at a BB the formats are already built, you are just plugging in numbers. Please tell me at an analyst level what requires cognitive though on a valuation? Everything is a formula except maybe creating the comp set (what I should be doing right now instead of being on this forum), i am not saying analysts are dumb by any means. The fact is you are just not given that much latitude on your valuations at the very junior levels. Anything that has any big of subjectivity will almost certainly be handed down from your higher ups.

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CaptK's picture

Haha oh college students. So

CaptK
      PE
 
 
(Neanderthal, 2,341
 
Points)
 on 1/6/11 at 8:12pm

Haha oh college students. So bright eyed, bushy tailed, and full of visions of front page deals and big swinging dicks. All of the things you mentioned in your post are things that your FIRM will be doing. 10% of the time, you might get to help. The rest of the time however, you will be doing all of the dogshit that has to happen behind the scenes so stuff that makes the Wall Street Journal can happen. That includes mindless/pointless research, changing the color of an arrow just because your MD doesn't like the color green, or redoing a month of said mindless work in a single night on a VP's whim.

And the modeling. Oh, your model shows a valuation of 7.3x? The client is expecting to see 8.5x at least or we won't win the deal, so you'd better tweak your inputs so it spits out something higher than that.

But keep that idealism going, that's how we get you to sign the offer letter :)

- Capt K -
"Prestige is like a powerful magnet that warps even your beliefs about what you enjoy. If you want to make ambitious people waste their time on errands, bait the hook with prestige." - Paul Graham

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aceofspadestrader's picture

HFFBALLfan123 wrote: If you

aceofspadestrader
      IB
 
(Monkey, 61
 
Points)
 on 1/6/11 at 8:20pm
HFFBALLfan123:

If you work at a BB the formats are already built, you are just plugging in numbers. Please tell me at an analyst level what requires cognitive though on a valuation? Everything is a formula except maybe creating the comp set (what I should be doing right now instead of being on this forum), i am not saying analysts are dumb by any means. The fact is you are just not given that much latitude on your valuations at the very junior levels. Anything that has any big of subjectivity will almost certainly be handed down from your higher ups.

This "set" model you speak of - are you saying it has over a 1000 inputs? Unless it does, there is absolutely no "set" model you can plug into that will give you a correct valuation. Every company is different and has many different valuation issues.

That is, of course, if you are actually trying to get the right valuation. Are you saying that the right answer isn't what they want?

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N.R.G.'s picture

aceofspadestrader wrote: If

N.R.G.
     
 
(Orangutan, 293
 
Points)
 on 1/6/11 at 8:27pm
aceofspadestrader:

If you actually know what you are doing, valuation is extremely detailed and requires a ton of thought. Moreover, telling a company how it should spin off an unprofitable division or restructure billions of dollars in overdue debt to save it from liquidation seems like it would require some cognitive thinking.

That's not something that analysts or associates do. The MD's are the advisors. Companies don't pay millions of fees to get 100 PP slides with graphs telling them info they can find out themselves. If I'm a CEO, why should I pay so much money for an analysis that I can get by hiring an accounting graduate, enrolling him in a valuation course and paying him 50k per year. Companies pay your MD's to act as agents and to provide expertise based on years of experience. Your presentations and 'analyses' are just marketing materials to help your MD play his role of a salesman. Excel/PPT/financial analysis skills are commodities. Relationships and experience add value.

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HFFBALLfan123's picture

Are you reinventing WACC or

HFFBALLfan123
      PE
 
 
(King Kong, 1,370
 
Points)
 on 1/6/11 at 8:31pm

Are you reinventing WACC or CAPM? Didn't think so, ok so you may have to re write a few things and delete some cells, real tough. I am always doing valuations on our portfolio companies and am at the mercy of my bosses, some of the stuff i do requires in depth analysis but it is not my valuations. All my valuations are tweaked a million times by my bosses, i certainly don't come up with growth expectations or days of expected receivables. Quit being a d-bag, you asked a question and you got an answer. I was not being a sarcastic little pric like yourself, so go get some insight and then return with a valid arguement.

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aceofspadestrader's picture

So in team meeting

aceofspadestrader
      IB
 
(Monkey, 61
 
Points)
 on 1/6/11 at 8:54pm

So in team meeting discussions of helping the client get through their problem/task, would a very very good ibd analyst ever be able to assist or at least ask constructive questions (even though the md/vp probably already took them into account)? Would this change at a BB versus a boutique?

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TNA's picture

Keep telling yourself that

TNA
      O
 
 
(Human, 13,467
 
Points)
 on 1/6/11 at 9:02pm

Keep telling yourself that banking requires anything more than a high school diploma lol

MSF Website
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bfin's picture

ANT wrote: Keep telling

bfin
      CF
 
(Neanderthal, 2,770
 
Points)
 on 1/6/11 at 9:18pm
ANT:

Keep telling yourself that banking requires anything more than a high school diploma lol

hahaha only you ANT only you

The answer to your question is 1) network 2) get involved 3) beef up your resume 4) repeat -happypantsmcgee

WSO is not your personal search function.

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N.R.G.'s picture

aceofspadestrader wrote: So

N.R.G.
     
 
(Orangutan, 293
 
Points)
 on 1/6/11 at 9:21pm
aceofspadestrader:

So in team meeting discussions of helping the client get through their problem/task, would a very very good ibd analyst ever be able to assist or at least ask constructive questions (even though the md/vp probably already took them into account)? Would this change at a BB versus a boutique?

Look, CEO's or CFO's are not some hopeless idiots that got into their positions by accident. It's not like their 20+ years of experience are so useless that they need to pay a bank several millions in fees just to have some nice chat with 22-year-olds who will ask them questions that will suddenly make them realize how to solve their problems. Even if that's the case, as a CEO, why would I pay your bank so much money when I can hire you for a fraction of that amount and your job will be to ask me questions all day. Or I can get that for free by making my wife at home ask me questions and help me 'think through issues'. As I said, you are not there to provide some insightful analysis that the companies can't do by themselves. I'm pretty sure that most CFO's have learned something about valuation at some point in their careers and they can figure out their company's value without your help. You are there to support your MD to help someone buy or sell something for as little/much as possible. In other words, you are there to do the annoying supporting paperwork that your boss will use as an aid in order to convince someone to buy/sell something for a certain amount. It's that simple.

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TNA's picture

Dude, they are outsourcing

TNA
      O
 
 
(Human, 13,467
 
Points)
 on 1/6/11 at 9:35pm

Dude, they are outsourcing banking to India. I have come across a bunch of shops that have all the modeling done over seas. This shit isn't rocket science. Why do you think they take liberal arts graduates for banking positions. If you can figure out excel and sleep only 5 hours a night you will do fine in banking.

Hardest easy job to get

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Penn11's picture

I think there is a lot of

Penn11
      IB
 
(Senior Chimp, 26
 
Points)
 on 1/6/11 at 9:36pm

I think there is a lot of cynicism on this forum with regards to an analyst's role. I think the experience can be quite varied from being dull and boring crunching numbers, models and comps for your associate to being in the negotiation room with clients helping them think through the most appropriate offer structure and hedging and financing solutions. Certainly, I was fortunate enough to experience the latter, while the former is part and parcel of every analyst's life cycle at a bulge bracket. I think sometimes as an analyst you have to find ways to add value and not underestimate what a bit of lateral thinking and a fresh perspective can add to a deal. While you are initially expected to just crunch numbers (I'm talking perhaps most of your first and second years) the value of your grasp over the detail is generally never underestimated by the MD and / or the client. When you're in the drawing room with the client and you ask a smart question, that can sometimes be the trigger to initiate a discussion between the MD and the client, potentially resulting in a solution. Being the junior guy, you have the advantage of being able to ask a question without looking like you don't know what you're doing. Your VP or MD may not have the same luxury.

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techfit's picture

i call troll.

techfit
      IB
 
(Monkey, 53
 
Points)
 on 1/6/11 at 9:39pm

i call troll.

Veritas

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ambition56's picture

this thread is great prep for

ambition56
      ST
 
(Gorilla, 601
 
Points)
 on 1/6/11 at 9:47pm

this thread is great prep for the question: "why do you want to do trading instead of banking?"

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TNA's picture

The why banking is the

TNA
      O
 
 
(Human, 13,467
 
Points)
 on 1/6/11 at 10:11pm

The why banking is the hardest question in the world. You have to be able to lie through your teeth, with a straight face, while both people know it is for the money.

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rebelcross's picture

ANT wrote: The why banking is

rebelcross
      IB
 
 
(King Kong, 1,466
 
Points)
 on 1/6/11 at 10:23pm
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CaptK's picture

It's fascinating how many

CaptK
      PE
 
 
(Neanderthal, 2,341
 
Points)
 on 1/6/11 at 10:41pm

- Capt K -
"Prestige is like a powerful magnet that warps even your beliefs about what you enjoy. If you want to make ambitious people waste their time on errands, bait the hook with prestige." - Paul Graham

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wamartinu's picture

N.R.G. wrote:

wamartinu
      IB
 
(Baboon, 135
 
Points)
 on 1/6/11 at 11:01pm
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robes's picture

then why do all the top hedge

robes
      IB
 
(Baboon, 106
 
Points)
 on 1/6/11 at 11:20pm
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CaptK's picture

robes wrote: then why do all

CaptK
      PE
 
 
(Neanderthal, 2,341
 
Points)
 on 1/6/11 at 11:25pm

- Capt K -
"Prestige is like a powerful magnet that warps even your beliefs about what you enjoy. If you want to make ambitious people waste their time on errands, bait the hook with prestige." - Paul Graham

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HarvardOrBust's picture

Penn's got a great

HarvardOrBust
      PE
 
(Senior Gorilla, 972
 
Points)
 on 1/6/11 at 11:41pm
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happypantsmcgee's picture

Look, this is the third time

happypantsmcgee
      O
 
 
(Almost Human, 9,621
 
Points)
 on 1/6/11 at 11:45pm

If I had asked people what they wanted, they would have said faster horses - Henry Ford

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boutiquebank4life's picture

CaptK wrote: robes

boutiquebank4life
      IB
 
(Senior Gorilla, 927
 
Points)
 on 1/6/11 at 11:46pm
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robes's picture

boutiquebank4life

robes
      IB
 
(Baboon, 106
 
Points)
 on 1/6/11 at 11:49pm
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Warhead's picture

Banking is mindless. We just

Warhead
      IB
 
(Senior Baboon, 245
 
Points)
 on 1/7/11 at 12:05am
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CaptK's picture

boutiquebank4life

CaptK
      PE
 
 
(Neanderthal, 2,341
 
Points)
 on 1/7/11 at 12:16am

- Capt K -
"Prestige is like a powerful magnet that warps even your beliefs about what you enjoy. If you want to make ambitious people waste their time on errands, bait the hook with prestige." - Paul Graham

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N.R.G.'s picture

robes wrote: then why do all

N.R.G.
     
 
(Orangutan, 293
 
Points)
 on 1/7/11 at 12:23am
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CaptK's picture

robes wrote: the HFs hiring

CaptK
      PE
 
 
(Neanderthal, 2,341
 
Points)
 on 1/7/11 at 12:24am

- Capt K -
"Prestige is like a powerful magnet that warps even your beliefs about what you enjoy. If you want to make ambitious people waste their time on errands, bait the hook with prestige." - Paul Graham

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N.R.G.'s picture

-

N.R.G.
     
 
(Orangutan, 293
 
Points)
 on 1/7/11 at 1:02am
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ivoteforthatguy's picture

In a nutshell: you are just

ivoteforthatguy
      O
 
(Neanderthal, 2,210
 
Points)
 on 1/7/11 at 8:25am
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afroman23's picture

Whilst I agree with your

afroman23
      IB
 
(Monkey, 65
 
Points)
 on 1/7/11 at 8:34am
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Simple As...'s picture

CaptK wrote: Everyone's a

Simple As...
     
 
(Senior Gorilla, 848
 
Points)
 on 1/7/11 at 8:42am
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HFFBALLfan123's picture

Agree with CaptK, everyone is

HFFBALLfan123
      PE
 
 
(King Kong, 1,370
 
Points)
 on 1/7/11 at 10:18am
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N.R.G.'s picture

I think the problem lies in

N.R.G.
     
 
(Orangutan, 293
 
Points)
 on 1/7/11 at 12:16pm
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leveredarb's picture

N.R.G. wrote: I think the

leveredarb
     
 
(King Kong, 1,227
 
Points)
 on 1/7/11 at 2:10pm
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craigmcdermott's picture

aceofspadestrader

craigmcdermott
      IB
 
 
(Senior Baboon, 227
 
Points)
 on 1/7/11 at 2:24pm
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serial monkey's picture

that's why I work in a

serial monkey
      IB
 
(Senior Monkey, 69
 
Points)
 on 1/7/11 at 2:54pm
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sherborn's picture

I'm a current banker, and my

sherborn
     
 
(Monkey, 52
 
Points)
 on 1/7/11 at 4:04pm
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nontarget's picture

that's why I want to work at

nontarget
      O
 
(Orangutan, 320
 
Points)
 on 1/7/11 at 5:29pm
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SAC's picture

Its more about detail

SAC
      HF
 
(King Kong, 1,171
 
Points)
 on 1/7/11 at 5:45pm

Learn Financial Modeling
Interview Guides
Resumes

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Bondarb's picture

robes wrote: then why do all

Bondarb
      HF
 
 
(Neanderthal, 2,261
 
Points)
 on 1/7/11 at 6:41pm
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ILOVENYGUY's picture

well people like to hire

ILOVENYGUY
     
 
(Orangutan, 341
 
Points)
 on 1/8/11 at 4:57pm
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leveredarb's picture

ILOVENYGUY wrote: well people

leveredarb
     
 
(King Kong, 1,227
 
Points)
 on 1/8/11 at 6:19pm
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acidtest2012's picture

There is no correct answer in

acidtest2012
     
 
(Monkey, 45
 
Points)
 on 1/8/11 at 6:40pm
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SHORTmyCDO's picture

ILOVENYGUY wrote: well people

SHORTmyCDO
      IB
 
(Gorilla, 738
 
Points)
 on 1/8/11 at 8:31pm
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GutShot's picture

ANT wrote: Dude, they are

GutShot
      ST
 
 
(King Kong, 1,249
 
Points)
 on 1/8/11 at 11:44pm
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acidtest2012's picture

Yeah, every shop has analysts

acidtest2012
     
 
(Monkey, 45
 
Points)
 on 1/9/11 at 5:59am
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TheSquale's picture

Read Monkey Business and you

TheSquale
      AM
 
(Senior Orangutan, 380
 
Points)
 on 1/9/11 at 8:50am
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abacab's picture

The outsourcing part of it

abacab
      IB
 
(Senior Gorilla, 852
 
Points)
 on 1/9/11 at 1:52pm
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ILOVENYGUY's picture

SHORTmyCDO wrote: ILOVENYGUY

ILOVENYGUY
     
 
(Orangutan, 341
 
Points)
 on 1/9/11 at 9:32pm
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  • Notwithstanding anything to the contrary contained herein, using or attempting to use any engine, software, tool, agent or other device or mechanism (including without limitation browsers, spiders, robots, avatars or intelligent agents) to navigate or search this Web Site other than the search engine and search agents available from the Company on this Web Site and other than generally available third party web browsers (e.g., Netscape Navigator, Microsoft Explorer).
  • Attempting to decipher, decompile, disassemble or reverse engineer any of the software comprising or in any way making up a part of the Web Site.
  • Aggregating, copying or duplicating in any manner any of the materials or information available from the Web Site.
  • Framing of or linking to any of the materials or information available from the Web Site.

User Information.

When you register for the Web Site, you will be asked to provide the Company with certain information including, without limitation, a valid email address (your "Information"). In addition to the terms and conditions that may be set forth in any privacy policy on this Web Site, you understand and agree that the Company may disclose to third parties, on an anonymous basis, certain aggregate information contained in your registration application. The Company reserves the right to offer third party services and products to you based on the preferences that you identify in your registration and at any time thereafter; such offers may be made by the Company or by third parties. Please see the Company's Privacy Policy below for further details regarding your Information.

Registration and Password.

You are responsible for maintaining the confidentiality of your information and password. You shall be responsible for all uses of your registration, whether or not authorized by you. You agree to immediately notify the Company of any unauthorized use of your registration or password.

The Company's Liability.

As a condition to your use of this site, you release the Company (and our agents and employees) from claims, demands and damages (actual and consequential, direct and indirect) of every kind and nature, known and unknown, suspected and unsuspected, disclosed and undisclosed, arising out of or in any way connected with such disputes. If you are a California resident, you waive California Civil Code d1542, which says: "A general release does not extend to claims which the creditor does not know or suspect to exist in his favor at the time of executing the release, which if known by him must have materially affected his settlement with the debtor."

We are under no legal obligation to, and generally do not, control the information provided by other users which is made available through the Web Site. By its very nature, other people?s information may be offensive, harmful or inaccurate, and in some cases will be mislabeled or deceptively labeled. We expect that you will use caution and common sense when using this Web Site.

The Material may contain inaccuracies or typographical errors. The Company makes no representations about the accuracy, reliability, completeness, or timeliness of the Web Site or the Material. The use of the Web Site and the Material is at your own risk. Changes are periodically made to the Web Site and may be made at any time.

You acknowledge and agree that you are solely responsible for the content and accuracy of any resume or material contained therein placed by you on the Web Site and you agree to let any users that are identified as recruiters (designated in the sole discretion of the Company) to have access to your resume.

The Company is not to be considered to be an employer with respect to your use of the Web Site and the Company shall not be responsible for any employment decisions, for whatever reason made, made by any entity posting jobs on the Web Site.

THE COMPANY DOES NOT WARRANT THAT THE WEB SITE WILL OPERATE ERROR-FREE OR THAT THE WEB SITE AND ITS SERVER ARE FREE OF COMPUTER VIRUSES OR OTHER HARMFUL MECHANISMS. IF YOUR USE OF THE WEB SITE OR THE MATERIAL RESULTS IN THE NEED FOR SERVICING OR REPLACING EQUIPMENT OR DATA, THE COMPANY IS NOT RESPONSIBLE FOR THOSE COSTS.

THE WEB SITE AND MATERIAL ARE PROVIDED ON AN "AS IS" BASIS WITHOUT ANY WARRANTIES OF ANY KIND. THE COMPANY, TO THE FULLEST EXTENT PERMITTED BY LAW, DISCLAIMS ALL WARRANTIES, WHETHER EXPRESS OR IMPLIED, INCLUDING THE WARRANTY OF MERCHANTABILITY, FITNESS FOR PARTICULAR PURPOSE AND NON-INFRINGEMENT. THE COMPANY MAKES NO WARRANTIES ABOUT THE ACCURACY, RELIABILITY, COMPLETENESS, OR TIMELINESS OF THE MATERIAL, SERVICES, SOFTWARE, TEXT, GRAPHICS, AND LINKS.

Disclaimer of Consequential Damages.

IN NO EVENT SHALL THE COMPANY, ITS SUPPLIERS, OR ANY THIRD PARTIES MENTIONED ON THE WEB SITE BE LIABLE FOR ANY DAMAGES WHATSOEVER (INCLUDING, WITHOUT LIMITATION, INCIDENTAL AND CONSEQUENTIAL DAMAGES, LOST PROFITS, OR DAMAGES RESULTING FROM LOST DATA OR BUSINESS INTERRUPTION) RESULTING FROM THE USE OR INABILITY TO USE THE WEB SITE AND THE MATERIAL, WHETHER BASED ON WARRANTY, CONTRACT, TORT, OR ANY OTHER LEGAL THEORY, AND WHETHER OR NOT THE COMPANY IS ADVISED OF THE POSSIBILITY OF SUCH DAMAGES.

Links to Other Sites.

The Web Site may contain links to third party web sites. These links are provided solely as a convenience to you and not as an endorsement by the Company of the contents on such third-party Web sites. The Company is not responsible for the content of linked third-party sites and does not make any representations regarding the content or accuracy of materials on such third party Web sites. If you decide to access linked third party Web sites, you do so at your own risk.

No Resale or Unauthorized Commercial Use.

You agree not to resell or assign your rights or obligations under these Term of Use. You also agree not to make any unauthorized commercial use of the Web Site.

Limitation of Liability.

The aggregate liability for the Company to you for all claims arising from the use of the Materials is limited to $1.

Termination.

The Company reserves the right, at its sole discretion, to pursue all of its legal remedies, including but not limited to immediate termination of your registration with or ability to access the Web Site and/or any other service provided to you by the Company, upon any breach by you of these Terms and Conditions or if the Company is unable to verify or authenticate any information you submit to the Web Site registration with or ability to access the Web Site.

Indemnity.

You agree to defend, indemnify, and hold harmless the Company, its officers, directors, employees and agents, from and against any claims, actions or demands, including without limitation reasonable legal and accounting fees, alleging or resulting from your use of the Material or your breach of the terms of these Terms and Conditions. The Company shall provide notice to you promptly of any such claim, suit, or proceeding and shall assist you, at your expense, in defending any such claim, suit or proceeding.

General.

The Company makes no claims that the Materials may be lawfully viewed or downloaded outside of the United States. Access to the Materials may not be legal by certain persons or in certain countries. If you access the Web Site from outside of the United States, you do so at your own risk and are responsible for compliance with the laws of your jurisdiction. These Terms and conditions are governed by the internal substantive laws of the State of New York, without respect to its conflict of laws principles. Jurisdiction for any claims arising under this agreement shall lie exclusively with the state or federal courts within New York, New York. If any provision of these Terms and Conditions are found to be invalid by any court having competent jurisdiction, the invalidity of such provision shall not affect the validity of the remaining provisions of these Terms and Conditions, which shall remain in full force and effect. No waiver of any term of these Terms and Conditions shall be deemed a further or continuing waiver of such term or any other term. Except as expressly provided in additional terms of use for areas of the Web Site a particular "Legal Notice," or Software License or Material on particular Web pages, these Terms and Conditions constitute the entire agreement between you and the Company with respect to the use of Web Site. No changes to these Terms and Conditions shall be made except by a revised posting on this page.

PRIVACY POLICY

The Company recognizes that you are concerned about privacy. We are committed to preserving your privacy and safeguarding your sensitive information. The following statement describes the general information-gathering and usage practices of our sites.

Our staff, contractors, Internet service providers and others involved in this site follow this policy or similarly strict policies regarding your Information.

Disclosure

The Company is committed to fully disclosing our policies regarding the collection, use, maintenance, disclosure and security of personal information obtained from users of our site. The term "personal information" includes a name, address, email address, or any other information which could be used to contact you directly or to identify you personally.

Use and Disclosure Limitations

The Company only uses personal information about its Web site users for specific purposes. We do not share user information with third parties except when we have told users about the disclosures, when we have prior consent, or when required by law.

Use Policy: When the Company gathers personal information from users, we ask for permission first. We also disclose, at the time of collection, how the information will be used by us. Personal information is used for activities such as auto-completion of commonly-used forms and helping us contact you when you solicit information from us.

Disclosure Policy: We do not normally disclose personal information to anyone outside of the Company unless we have previously informed users about the disclosures. However, some data may be used from time to time by outside contractors, including auditors or consultants, to assist us in carrying out necessary financial or operational activities. These uses will be consistent with this privacy policy and all contractors using this potential personal information must agree to safeguard it, to use it only for the authorized purpose, and to return it or destroy it upon completion of the activity.

The Company might be required to disclose personal information in response to a valid legal process such as a subpoena, search warrant or court order.

Although unlikely, it is possible that we may have to make certain disclosures to ensure the security of our Web site, to protect its integrity, or to take precautions against potential liability. In any of these situations, we will take any reasonable steps to limit the scope of the data disclosed.

Web Logs: The Company maintains standard Web logs that record basic information about visitors to our Web site. These logs contain: * The Internet domain from which you came to our Web site. * Your IP address. An IP address is a series of numbers which uniquely identifies your connection to the Internet. Although it is possible in some instances, certain types of IP addresses may be used by interested persons to identify users but we do not attempt to identify users in this way. * The type of browser (e.g., Internet Explorer or Netscape) and operating system (e.g., Windows 98) you use. * The date and time you visited the site, and the pages you saw.

We use Web log information to design our Web site, identify popular features, and in similar ways. We do not try to identify individuals from Web logs or to link Web logs to other user information. However, if someone tries to damage our Web site or use it in an unauthorized or illegal way, we may share Web log information with law enforcement agencies. The Company may provide aggregate information such as the number of users who visit particular pages of the site, or the number of people who link to certain external sites from our site, to other parties.

Changes to Privacy Policy

The Company's features and services will change over time and our information-gathering practices and policies may also change.

While our philosophy of protecting user information from inappropriate uses and disclosures will not change, this policy will be updated occasionally to include any change that materially affects the collection, maintenance, use, or disclosure of personal information.

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I used to work with a guy that had everything on the surface, but absolutely nothing inside. The guy was 6 feet tall, good-looking, charismatic, multi-lingual, graduated from a top business school, and had made MD at a bulge bracket investment bank. Yet he couldn’t remember the last time he...
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