I'm 0/10 can anyone beat me?
And why is it suggested that my speech and behavior are inadequate upon learning that I have been rejected so many times in a row? What if society is the problem?
| +56 | Is a 3.6 good enough | 38 | 2h | |
| +25 | What are my options? | 13 | 3d | |
| +20 | Dream Job vs Dream Location | 15 | 2d | |
| +18 | Recently Moved, Not Enjoying it and Wondering How Long to Stay | 2 | 1d | |
| +18 | Didnt Convert Twice - Screwed? | 1 | 16h | |
| +16 | Non-finance post-PE exits | 8 | 6d | |
| +16 | hf recruiting - headhunter or cold outreach? | 4 | 2d | |
| +15 | GPA Non-Target | 6 | 2d | |
| +15 | Value of a math minor? | 5 | 13h | |
| +15 | Struggling to Network for Full-Time IB Recruiting | 6 | 1d |
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If this is the criteria, I've been rejected around 50 times (not exaggerating). Between IB, PE, and Real Estate Finance SA and FT applications, I've applied to somewhere in the neighborhood of 300 positions. It's just tough out there. Admittingly, I bombed my first few IB SA interviews on technicals because I didn't know what I didn't know. After the learning curve, it just came down to there was a better candidate out there. I've also experienced rejections due to poor timing and others for being "overqualified," whatever that means. Just keep your head up and keep refining yourself. I'm on my 5th internship as a May 19' undergrad and have had several years experience from the US Navy and Pharmaceuticals and still don't technically have a FT offer yet, though I am working 2 internships at the moment that have expressed interest in converting to FT. Just keep doing things to make yourself more marketable and network hard.
Society cant be the problem, because society sets the rules of the game. You need to adapt. Like the other guy says, ask for feedback.
The game is rigged
I was 0/40 at some point.
It only takes 1. I was probably 1 for 30 or something like that.
Too many to count.
You need to approach the process with a better mentality. Every failed interview is a chance to learn something. Whether thats something you did wrong, something someone else did right, or even just a unique question you hadn't anticipated.
As others have said, it's a numbers game. This isn't college admission, a lot of the time the process doesn't make sense. Just keep pounding the pavement.
"It gets easier. Every day it gets a little easier. But you gotta do it every day - that's the hard part"
I probably went 0-15 in on-campus first rounds and superdays before landing my FT offer senior year, this with two good summer internships in IBD and an MBS trading desk. And what's funny is that after I got that first offer, I got two more within a week.
Sometimes it's just luck. You very well may have been the best candidate that day with better experience... and then the guy who got offered was a director's nephew. But it's a numbers game. You're bound to break in somewhere as you keep putting in applications and interviewing. Keep your head up.
Just want to say that this thread has really helped me out. I posted above about my current FT experience and lately it has been fairly difficult to keep my head up. Seeing that a bunch of people have gone through the same struggle is certainly uplifting.
Big thanks to OP and the commenters above me.
3/3, Be like me, choose your battles wisely. only interview for jobs you know you will get. -McDonalds Crew Member
A job interview is an outside event, so you have no power over it according to the wise Marcus Aurelius, right? And it is ironic that you say that your communication skills have gotten better but your conversion rate is now worse than it was for SA. Though I do feel your pain, as we may very well have similar difficulties, and hope that you are able to land something.
It is more likely that society is the problem. Let's not forget that this is the same society where there were once slaves, and the same society where immigrants once could not find employment upon arrival in America because they were immigrants. Now we are going to pretend like everything is rosy eh?
The truth is that "diverse" (whatever the fuck that means), LGBT, and female candidates are given preferential treatment in the hiring processes at big name firms. I recently filled out a Goldman Sachs online job application (MD reached out to me after I accepted my current position to interview, but I don't want to join their New World Order culture anyways) and they had a page dedicated to asking whether or not I was a transgender or transsexual. How is this relevant to my capacity/potential to perform a job?
Society is fucked long term because "diversity at all costs" is destroying meritocracy and breeding surging resentment/anger in those that don't benefit from these handicaps. This resulted in the election of Trump. I just listened to Paul Ryan speak at a conference - he opined (and I concur) that this is just the beginning of populism in our country.
If you haven't given up then you haven't lost the war, just a battle or 3.
Keep your head up. I was a non-target that missed the FT recruitment boat and spent years trying to break in through the back door while working pretty brutal hours in another job.
I had several interviews that resulted from networking with MDs/Partners, all of which ended awkwardly at best, and all with no offer. On one occasion, I was told point blank by a low level HR employee at a low-tier MM bank that nobody at the bank would want to hire me with my background, that I was only being spoken to as a courtesy to the MD that recommended me, and that she would have thrown my resume straight in the trash if it was up to her. The conversation ended and I never heard from her or the bank again.
I knew from the beginning that I wasn’t the candidate that doors would easily open for. Even knowing this, it was always a punch in the gut to be told “no” - worse, to be ghosted or avoided by people trying to help me, as if they didn’t think I could handle being told the truth of my inadequacy. It was embarrassing to tell my friends and family I was “looking for a job in IB” as months turned into years and they all moved on to new roles themselves, and people stopped asking. There were times that I felt like a delusional loser, holding onto my dream despite the fact that I had nothing to show for it. There were times where I felt like, and was treated as, a leper. But I never relinquished my conviction that this industry was for me, and that I could excel among my peers, perhaps even be the best of them if I had the chance to apply myself.
Months later I landed a FO analyst job at a bank that was objectively better than the one I was unceremoniously cast out from, and is regarded by many on this board as the best/most prestigious to work at. I never thought this is where my efforts would lead me - indeed I was perhaps the most discouraged right before things finally broke my way. What made me proudest of myself in all of this is that I secured the offer without any sort of recommendation, connection, or gimmick - it was won entirely on the back of hard work, risk taking, and of course (as with all IB offers) a considerable bit of luck, without which nothing would’ve been possible.
My advice to the aspiring people on this board is to never let someone tell you that you’re not good enough. The competition out there is brutal right now, and when you get knocked down you have to dust yourself off and get back in the ring. I held on to this belief through all the headwinds I faced, and while I cannot say it is what got me the job eventually, I can say that without it, I would never have had a chance.
“It is not the critic who counts...”
“I am the Greatest. I said that even before I knew I was.”
Edited
Honestly fuck recruiting.
I went through probably over 60 company interviews (actually talking with a real person), and this doesn’t include the number of rounds I went through. This is my entire undergrad experience.
From sophomore to senior, I would start hunting around September spend my entire year recruiting. Somehow I seem to get “lucky” and get an internship in late April, early May every year but it’s the most draining shit and really knocks your ego down.
Half of these were pretty legit opportunities (IB, S&T at BB, EB, MM). At that point, I was pretty fucking sure that a fair share of people were getting offers from their “real” network. The process was rigged from the start and there’s only so much you can control. Some top students would still find a way to crack it but luck is more important than you would think.
I graduated this dec and came out with 0 offers. I got so sick of this bullshit I studied my ass off to pivot to tech. After 2 dark months of studying non stop, I landed an engineering role at a big 4 tech company. I have to admit, there was some luck involved with the timing. But I worked my ass off to continue having these opportunities.
And guess what? My all in comps exceeds what I would’ve made in finance, working half the hours. Fuck this industry.
It’s funny thinking back and having done 300 info interviews with IB people. Some of them came across as not so bright. I wouldn’t be surprised if they got in because of a strong family background / diversity. Of course they would never mention that and just regurgitate generic advices on how they got in.