Experience at Institutional Developers
Can anyone share what life is/was like (either from current, past, or info shared from others) at institutional dev shops. Namely thinking about Hines, TCC, Tishman, Brookfield, Related.
Thanks!
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Not at the above. But we compete and do mega projects that take years. Life day to day as a development manager is pretty busy. The job is problem solving and every development generally has problems. The real question you need to ask is does your development firm chase deals that are so damn complicated, they are more banging your head against the wall. Or are they chasing developments that, while complicated, are generally (mostly) repeatable processes which help drive scale and allow for the best shot at returns of capital and on capital. Many developers unfortunately get into the habit of seeing big deals and fees and chasing those deals even though they are god awful complicated. Working on those deals is not fun mainly driven by the ridiculousness of a pretzel you need to bend into to make them work.
With that said - the day to day is project management. What are my tasks. who do I need to make sure if on task and who is off task-so I need to figure out how to push them forward. What items do I foresee falling behind and what is my plan to put it back on track. You need to see the full picture. The development manager is the maestro.
As an acquisitions person (if the firm splits responsibilities), you are chasing deals and monitoring the market. Same as at any firm.
Generally, developer hours are better than fund hours. This is because the deal volume is less. Also, while items as the development manager can be a fire drill, (1) it is usually a consultant doing the work and you seeing the output and agreeing or disagreeing or (2) it needs to be Done in the next 72 hours but not 12. Very different timelines.
Great summary - and the comparison to acquisitions is well said. I would just add one note to the fact that Development's fire drills are not as much a grind as Acquisitions... while true, I would argue that the fire drills for development are generally WAY more likely to lead to premature greying!
How do you choose to organize yourself to make sure you’re completing all of your tasks?
I understand some people have a very classic way of organizing themselves using a planner/calendar, but I’m curious whether you have other alternative methods that may have worked for you better as an individual, or methods that are more effective being that you are a real estate developer.
I’m still very green, and I’m also specifically (helping in) handling the project management aspects of projects, so I’d have at least some sense of how to organize myself.
It’s something I find challenging. But I use good old fashion pen and paper and take good notes. I keep an updated list and tally. It’s a problem in the space. You need to be super detail oriented and task orientated. Frankly, it’s why I prefer acquisitions. I would rather ‘sell’ and project manage. It’s less task focused and more abstract
I am at one of the named shops (specifically on the investment/deal side as opposed to being a construction/development manager only handling execution). What are you looking to know?
This is the only RE firm I have been at (although I did some summers at various GCs during undergrad before deciding against that career path), so won't be able to give detailed comparisons to life elsewhere, but I know some of the main ways our firm differentiates to the others listed.
Can mirror the above comment that dev hours are meaningfully better than fund hours (at least when comparing similar size/"reputable" firms), for the same or better pay (though my firm may be an outlier on this based on what I have seen on WSO/elsewhere). Average over the year for most people is gonna hover around 50ish +/- 5 depending on office/product/etc. Obviously there are sprints and fire drills that crank that upwards, but most days it's a 8:30-6:30 gig or better, with plenty of flexibility given to employees to have a life.
Since this is the only firm you’ve been at, have you ever been curious about having an experience at a smaller shop? I understand that there are some pros and cons with going opting for either (institutional vs smaller/family type setup). I’m new to the industry and barely going to be in my second year out of undergrad, but I was wondering where people at these big institutional shops go should they decide to change course. Do they go out on their own? Jump to another institutional shop? Take on a bigger role at a smaller company? It’s still way too early for me to be thinking about leaving my current firm, but I’d like to get exposure to different product types, and (obviously) maximize pay as quickly as possible.
I would never leave my shop for a smaller one unless it was an opportunity I could not turn down or I was starting my own. I think you overestimate how large institutional dev shops are. We only have a few hundred employees across the entire firm, and no one office/market has more than 20-30 people (again, including support staff). At our shop, employees remain with a deal throughout the entire lifecycle from initial pursuit to monetization, so there is no worry of being silo'd outside of some offices where employees are split by product type (but then it means they'll see every deal for that product type, which is multiple per year).
Maybe my shop is more different than I know, but none of the points people raise as benefits to a smaller shop in terms of learning seem to really be true (again, relative to my own firm). At my shop an associate will be involved in every step including zoning, capital raising, leasing, etc. I have even been given enough of a leash to try and source my own deal if something comes to me. The only thing someone in my role won't see is day to day construction management, which is handed off to our development managers for the daily boots on the ground work. My opinion here might be wrong though, as I simply haven't seen the other side at a smaller shop. I have heard that some of the other institutional shops run less lean, and are more silo'd, so take my opinion with a grain of salt.
Also, the access to capital we have is second to none, and we are still able to be nearly full steam ahead right now on Class A projects. I would not have that experience at a less well-capitalized firm.
And then finally, the pay. Anything you have ever seen or read on this forum about dev pay is far below what the reality is at my shop at least. Our senior guys (and there is a clear path upwards as we are stingy on junior hires) make multiples of what someone in IB would. 8-figure paydays happen every single year at my firm (sometimes multiple in the same year), as each team is entitled to a (large) share of all profit they produce. It is entirely possible and has actually occurred a few times in recent years that an associate makes 7 figures or close to it. It would be exceedingly difficult for anyone at our firm to leave and make more money, as even though they would get to keep a larger piece of the pie, they would be doing less and smaller deals, and making less money overall at the end of the day.
Truthfully, no one ever leaves except to retire of being pushed out. The very very few that do leave usually have a specific reason, but almost no one is jumping to another shop. Can't speak to the other firms you mentioned, but I imagine it's similar (although I know a few of those shops have a ceiling on what the top guys can make, so they might have more incentive to leave compared to us where upside is uncapped)
Hijacking this thread but does anyone else look around and see development starts falling off a cliff? If rates or prices don’t stabilize, then there’s going to be a very wonky market by 2025.
There are like 5 other topics on this elsewhere already. Literally, everyone realizes this.
Still don’t regret hijacking
Worked at an institutional student developer. Main job was making maps of comps with color coded pins and calling properties to ask what they rented each floorplan for even though it was clearly listed on their website. Also we sometimes took group polls to decide what color cabinets looked best to go in our apartments (they usually didn't go with what we voted for.)
Fuckin hated development.
Kiiinda sounds like they stuck you in the dunce corner.
Yeah, his experience does not provide a fair assessment of development lol
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