Calling out boarding/prep school kids

It can be easier because the guidance departments can hook you up. However, I know that some elite towns/schools only get a few kids in at each ivy school, so they dont look gentrified, and very often its only the sports people who get in/people who are legacies, with valedictorians being denied.

They place a lot, but from people I know who went to a top 5 public school (comparable to these schools due to their connections within the guidance depts, the fact that rich families move to this town specifically for the school quality/guidance dept quality and how people are recruited in to schools after), the big take aways are what I described.

The people are on average much brighter because of the quality of the school, and the work ethic their parents/teachers push on them/quality of the teachers. Aside from the bunch that goes to the ivy schools, a lot went to good liberal arts schools, and other top schools, but to get in to the top ivy schools you have to be a legacy or an athlete. I know a couple of athletes who are on academic probation though, while the valedictorian was denied from the ivies and is at a good school for what hes studying, but still not top 20. Its bullshit.

My university inflated my prep school gpa 16% just did it out. There are definitely feeder schools like Andover, Exeter, Deerfield. But outside that it definitely helps but its not like everyone gets into ivy/top tier schools. EVERYONE does get into a better school though than if they had the same stats at a public school, but you have to realize private school curriculum is at a much higher level than public schools anyway. The college counseling offices help a shit ton too, they know their shit and have connections.

Of course it is easier but that is primarily because top prep schools act as another level of gatekeepers. For example, a school like Choate only accepts students who have already demonstrated a high level of aptitude and/or potential. Beyond the pure network, academic environment, and connections advantage that most elite private schools provide, they also provide instant credibility to those students who have demonstrated a certain level of proficiency because they are essentially designed to be feeder schools into top universities. Sure, some students may be able to buy or play (through athletics) their way into an elite prep school but the kids who get into the top universities from these schools have generally earned the right. Also, grade inflation has less of an impact in these schools than you would probably expect given the fact that applicants are judged on a wide range of credentials including standardized test scores and the fact that universities know what they are getting from these elite prep schools based on past experience with alumni.

Yes

I went to Deerfield and can clarify this. Deerfield and other elite boarding schools help you get into great schools that are just below the Ivy League (Northwestern, UChicago, Duke--I know people say it's ivy caliber, but everyone at Deerfield chooses ivy over Duke, even Cornell--Georgetown, etc.) If you have the same stats at Deerfield vs a random public school, you have a much better shot at these schools.

Ivy League not so much. The numbers are very misleading. Yes a 1/4 of the kids go to Ivy League schools but you have to keep in mind how ridiculous connected these kids are. For instance, in my graduating year, we had about 10 kids go to Harvard. Out of these 10, 6 of them were something like 4th generation legacies and 2 were recruited athletes. That leaves 2 spots for 50 or so really qualified kids. This literally works its way down like a supply chain. We had 8 kids go to Dartmouth, but 4 of them were committed athletes their junior year. Another 2 were super legacies. In all, only about 16 kids or so really get in through their own personal skills and connections, really not that high of a number.

Also, elite boarding schools don't really inflate GPA. What you get is really just what you get. There are schools like Stanford who really put a focus on GPA, regardless of where you went to high school. Hence, Deerfield kids don't do so great with Stanford admissions. I think we had like 20 apply and only 2 got in.

So everywhere else absolutely, ivy league not so much.

1) Its about the label. People at Deerfield tend to choose Cornell over Duke probably 70-80% of the time and over Georgetown 100% of the time. Georgetown seems to love prep school kids. Some of the stupidest kids at Deerfield got into Georgetown; I have no idea how. 2) Like I said it's about the label. And the difference between HYP and Brown isn't "gigantic". It's very, very minimal. Stat-wise, there is almost no difference between a kid that gets into HYP and a kid that gets into Brown. A Brown grad can also get any job that an HYP grad can get.

It's definitely helpful. A lot of even the brightest kids at my school were demoralized by how much of a joke the public hs we attended was, no discipline, no control, fights, and no real learning. This was supposed to be a top public as well, and I know that other high schools are even worse. Scoring a 2300+ on the SAT and getting a 3.7+ GPA is a much easier feat when attending a good school that gives you the freedom to succeed vs a public that demoralizes you.

At my Ivy, I knew many kids from boarding schools. many kids from Exeter, Phillips, Choate, etc.

My impression was that those kids from boarding school were very intelligent and definitely got into the school by their merit.

I went to prep school for athletics after spending a few years at a top public school, and I can tell you kids at my prep school were much more prepared for the college application process which I'm sure helped them. Another thing - they seemed to be more engaged in their studies and worked harder than at my public high school. And the interesting part is the public school I went to was in a VERY affluent area, these kids were from very successful families too. It convinced me to send my kids to an elite prep simply because they'll learn more and be more motivated to succeed.

It is definitely helpful if you are at a top, well-known boarding school like Andover or St. Pauls,but from my experience (at a mid sized boarding school) I actually ran into some problems getting into some of the larger schools. We had fairly significant grade deflation, so the large schools that didn't want to take considerable time assessing each applicant often dinged quality candidates, but we didn't have any problems getting into comparable LACs (i.e. the NESCAC schools).

The stats in this instance put the cart before the horse. If you get into one of the top boarding schools, it's more likely than not that your family has a very solid network in place that helps your chances of success for the Ivy League.

How any of you guys end up at schools like Vanderbilt?

After spending 3+ years in prison like dormitories... study halls, lights out, room inspection, you deserve to go to ivy league schools

I think people are downplaying public schools here. I went to a small public school in the northeast and ended up having no real problems with college admissions (got into three ivies). I'm positive that thousands of kids that paid tons and tons of money to go to the most elite prep schools did not have as good results. What a joke! Then again I had to figure out everything on my own which was a little painful.

I think the benefit of a private school is to avoid some of the "riff raff" and get better teachers and counselors, not necessarily make it much easier to get into top colleges. In some ways it's even harder because your school is comprised of much relatively much smarter kids that you have to compete against. And you pay a shit ton of money which is a little ridiculous for high school, unless you are just that loaded.

I went to Avon Old Farms and agree with what seabird said. The guidance counselors play a big part in helping you get into the school you want to go to. They have connections and will bust your ass because in the end, that's why you paid the $50k per year to go there. In addition, if you are particularly good at a sport, recruiters from college will look at you much closer. My buddy just matriculated to an Ivy after doing a year in Juniors for hockey and only needed a 1700 on his SAT so it helps. Finally, we don't have a class rank and the kids that come here want to do well too. Chances are, there father or grandfather went to one of the top colleges but that doesn't stop them from working hard. The structure of the schedule (Wednesday's are half days and we go to school on Saturdays for a half day) definitely helps prepare you for college later down the line.

You're obviously there to get good grades, but being in a small school with less than 400 kids means you're part of a community and a brotherhood. I know it sounds cheesy, but there's just something about rolling up to a hockey game with 6 busses of students ready to support their team which adds that extra factor that you don't get from a public school. Those were the best 4 years of my life and I will absolutely send my kid there.

I went to Choate so maybe I can shed some light on this. Yes, there were a ton of athletes that got into top schools but they were insanely good at what they did. Some examples: drafted to the Brewins (Dartmouth) , scouted by the yankees (Harvard) etc. However, I'm convinced that the single easiest way to get into an ivy is to go to prep school and get involved with the crew team. Ivies absolutely love people who do crew and there isn't nearly as much competition in the sport as most schools don't have a program. If you're good at crew, youre in. Those who made it who weren't athletes had very special profiles. They had pretty much straight A's, competed in varsity sports, and got involved on campus. One kid went so far as to learn how to play the organ in order to stand out (he is now at Princeton). In other words, you still really have to work your ass off.

The level of corruption in this world never ceases to amaze me.

While I'm sure there is a great deal of corruption when it comes to college admissions, you can't deny the fact that not all high schools are created equal. Somebody with a 4.0 at a top boarding school is probably a safer bet from an academic point of view than someone from Tumbleweed High. Elite private schools aren't the only ones which rock Ivy admissions, top public schools in the Northeast do so as well. Just look at Boston Latin, the place is a funnel to Harvard. Evidently there's a selection process to get into BLS but there's some of that at most prep schools as well.

Looking at foreign examples can be instructive. In the UK, Westminster and Eton place more people into Oxbridge than any other high school (or whatever they're called). While a lot of that is tradition and nepotism, you can't deny that those schools are probably some of the best in the country from an academic point of view.

Even more telling is the case of high school systems with a nation-wide final exam. In France, you actually get to see the top 3 grades in each subject of the final high school test each year. Invariably, a least half those kids will come from one of the top public schools in Paris. There are a couple public high schools in Paris (Louis-le-Grand and Henri IV) which have a competitive entrance. The exam at the end of senior year is the same for every student in France and yet kids from these two schools will be in the top 3 of each subject every single year. They're clearly working harder and have better teachers than other high schools.

Italy probably makes this case the most obvious. It has been shown with statistical significance that kids from the South of the country do worse on average than kids from the North on their final exam. Are they dumber? Maybe but it probably has to do with the quality of the schools and culture. And prep schools in the US are the closest thing you have culturally speaking to the Ivy League. So maybe there's something there.

In case anyone wondered 'how could affirmative action come to be?'. Part of the reason it was implemented was to counteract the effects of the good ol' boy network that many people have spoken about here. I don't think it has been particularly fair or effective, but I think it's pretty easy to understand why people sought to implement it. The problem is that there are many white people that don't have access to this club either. I find it pretty disturbing that spots are getting taken away from more highly qualified candidates because of parent or school counselor connections.

First, I love this website and after only discovering it a few months ago, I must say I have learned a lot of valuable things from the posts.

I wen't to top prep school in CT in the Founder's League. While it isn't as prestigious as Exeter, Deerfield or Philips (Andover), it is a very good school. I can only speak to my experience, but my school never inflated our GPA's. It didn't matter whether you were taking AP Calc 2 or in some easy earth science class. Because of this, most of my friends had around 3.3 - 3.7. However, all my friends had over a 2050 on the SATs and over a 30 on the ACTs. So, while we weren't the top of applicants in terms of GPA, we did get a lot of looks due to our test scores. In addition, prep schools have the reputation of having hard academics and based on how alumni from my school performed, college admissions would use them as a guide. So if someone from my school had a 3.7 and did really well at MIT, they might judge any applicant off those standards. With regards to Ivy's, most of the people there were legacies or athletes. I think my year we sent 4 kids to Yale for football. You still have to work really hard though. We also had a college counselor assigned to us starting Junior year, with each having under 50 kids from my class. When you have that much help from a counselor it will be an advantage. Also, we have school sponsored test prep starting at the same time.

Given the schools reputation, our alumni, counselors that know our names and work for "us", and test prep for free, we have an advantage due to that. But, I think most kids end up in NESCAC schools who go to prep school, just because of how similar they are to prep schools. Those are the ones that we have the biggest advantage at.

I will say that I know quite a few NE public school kids at a lot of really good schools and had they wen't to my prep school they would have had the same life results (e.g. end up at yale, or harvard, or MIT etc.), they just saved their parents around 200,000 lol. So, maybe it does help maybe it doesn't, I think it just depends how hard you work in high school regardless.

I went to a public high school known nationally for its arts programs with general recognition for its academics. I'd definitely say that we're more of a Juilliard feeder than an Ivy feeder. Regardless, a couple of us manage to make it every year, myself included.

I had no idea that such a rampant prep school culture existed at Ivies until I actually went and saw how many of my peers were from top boarding schools or top private schools. I have no doubt that going to one of those high schools will help you get into an Ivy. It's the same reason why students from Ivies have an easier time picking up job interviews — you've got the brand name.

For what it's worth, I've been unimpressed with the level of intelligence of boarding school students at Wharton. I'm not saying that they haven't had great accomplishments, but it's just important to recognize that boarding school != intelligence.

For what it's worth, some of the smartest kids I met at my school were prep school grads. There was one guy who graduated with a 4.0 GPA in physics/ math from my college, who happens to be an alumnus of a top boarding school. I took stats class with him once which was the hardest course I took at my school being an Econ major, and he would end up getting near perfect scores on all exams all the time that our professor made him TA the course next semester. The guy is working at a top hedge fund now, as a trader, making over 300k a year at 25 years old.

Facebook founder Zuckerburg was an Exeter grad, then went to Harvard, where he dropped out. I think that due to these prep schools having strict admissions criteria, their student body is much more qualified and talented overall compared to regular public schools. I would not see a problem with the system where Ivies give admissions preference to those coming from these schools.

Brady, if that's you, just send your kids to a decent suburban public school.

I do think the Ivies are going to do some reverse discrimination on this. If you have straight 5s on eight APs coming out of Council Bluffs, IA, and you've grown six of the largest watermelons at the Iowa State Fair through your 4H club, you have a background that is likely preferable to a kid from the Hun School or Exeter.

The key here though is that the Ivies are looking for something on the tails. They want to see very good academics. And then they want to see one or two extraordinary things that they don't already have.

"Football captains and valedictorians are a dime a dozen. This more typical/common applicant is a better fit for UIUC."

"Someone ranked fifteenth in a class of 190 at Council Bluffs High School who can grow the largest watermelons in the state of Iowa and still get six 5s on the APs? Hey we don't have that! Better snap him up before Yale does!"

If you REALLY REALLY want your kids into a private school, move somewhere rural and get them into 4H club. And then just make sure they become expert gardeners who can grow 1200 lb pumpkins and 150 lb zucchini that can win state fairs.

Of course, nobody wants to do that.

That's true, but you always want to have fallbacks in whatever you're doing. If you go all in on watermelons in Iowa and don't come out with huge juicy ones, you're SOL and pretty much out of options. It also doesn't hurt to actually like what you're doing...

For the people that went to these top boarding school especially in New England, is it incredibly easy(ier) to get into an elite university/ivy compared to a public school?

You know, I think it depends on the prep school. Deerfield and Andover, definitely. For example, a really smart friend of mine went to the former, had his pick of top liberal art schools, and eventually went to study architecture at a top 20 school. Based on him and his Deerfield friends, I'd say Deerfield is pretty solid.

Choate, from the kids I know, seems like the public school you pay for. Those kids end up going to places like BU/GWU (and some of them couldn't even get into UMiami) and were some of the most vile people I've ever met. They were the kids who could read a book and understand the words in it, but would have had a difficult time piecing together the summary and deeper meaning.

Ivy -- So, your view is that going to a prep school makes it more difficult to get into an Ivy (all else equal)?

$45,000 a year on boarding school and another $50,000 a year on a top notch college sounds insane to me, even if I had more money than I knew what to do with.

When it's all said and done we're talking about spending almost a half a million on education per child between 9th grade and college graduation.

I guess if you're filthy rich, return on investment

I don't think it matters unless it's a top ivy. I went to a good suburban public school which isn't exactly ranked or anything yet plenty of kids went to great LACs and ivies. It doesn't matter where you go to school to be competitive for the top schools outside the ivy, test scores and grades are enough. 2150+ and a 3.7+ gpa in HS will get you into NW, Gtown, Vandy, Emory, etc. regardless of pedigree, or at least be very competitive.

When it comes down to it, I think AP scores matter quite a bit to even the playing field. Plenty of A's are given out in AP classes, but if you don't get a 4 or 5 you have pretty much failed and your grade for that class is very misleading.

Spending 50k for prep school to go to Gtown or that type of school???? Not worth it.

Personally I've found that kids from vanderbilt or duke have much higher quality student bodies than kids from prep school ivy reject schools like Georgetown. Seems like all the prep school kids that couldn't make the ivies ended up at Georgetown, but since those two former schools are in the south a lot of northern preppies don't choose it as much as northern colleges so alot of outstanding kids end up there by choice.

Another thing, I heard the financial aid is really good at a lot if these prep schools. What if you come from a family that's very middle class, do you get the benefits you'd receive from elite units such as need blind admissions and meeting full need.

What about public charter schools? Aren't they the same thing