Day-Trading

I am 20 years old, and have been trading for about 2 years. Skipped college to focus solely on trading and my results so far have been great. I am more of a day trader and usually make 5-10 trades a day. 90% of my system is based off of technical analysis. I notice around here that people rarely talk about using charts and what not. Is it frowned upon? Or are people here more interested in long term investments?

Also, would it be of any benefit to consider working for a prop firm at some point?

 

Ya, day trading is generally looked down upon because people think that short term movements dont tell you anything about the fundamental health of a company or its intrinsic value, and that a lot of the fluctuations are things which you cant rely on their remaining consistent.

These people also tend to look at larger companies that are looking to invest a lot more capital, so investing would be more difficult given that liquidity issues might be constraints. I think that day trading is viable if youre not just using charts, but using both charts and some fundamental analysis to guess where a stock may go, but it would be largely event driven.

Contact shorttheworld. He is the resident prop trader and could give the most insight in to the nature of things.

“...all truth passes through three stages. First, it is ridiculed. Second, it is violently opposed. Third, it is accepted as being self-evident.” - Schopenhauer
 

Hey hows it going guys. I am new to the site, but I am 21 years old and I am trying to get into day trading. I have been doing my research for some time now and I know a pretty wealthy trader who has pointed me in the right direction as to what to study. I understand technical analysis, support and resistance and candlesticks, so I think i can be profitable in trading. I currently have a 9-5, and I want to quit to just trade but I want to get my feet wet first and build up a small account to grab some leverage. I just wanted to know how you guys got into it. I live on my own so I have bills to pay. It seems like this website is the place to get some sure advise thanks.

 

I would recommend working with a day trading arcade or prop desk, most have training and the good trainees often get access to the firms capital with a small deposit 10k or so. A few other tips in the meantime:

  1. Dont quit your 9-5 just yet as you'll just end up broke and blow all your trading capital on living expenses.
  2. You need to know allot more then " how to read Candlesticks" in order to be profitable! I would recommend reading a few books and getting a demo account/paper trade for a while. Find out what type of strategy works for you.
  3. Spend a few hours each day trading or just watching the markets, half the battle is knowing whats going on each day and how it can be applied towards a trade.

Hope that helps.

 

It is frowned upon because 90%+ or more people lose money.

If you think you can sit in your boxers in your basement and beat the top props, banks, and hedge funds, more power to you and go ahead and give it a shot.

 

This was helpful. I do watch the market,everyday, paper trade when i get home, I just started back testing strategies, and I am also learning other world markets, I wish there were some arcades around Maryland. I think for myself all i really need to make right now is 250 a day, which i have been doing consistantly paper trading ( i know its different with real money ) but i just dont want to quit my job until i actually have made some profits. Im thinking about options while im at work. What do you guys think?

 

This was helpful. I do watch the market,everyday, paper trade when i get home, I just started back testing strategies, and I am also learning other world markets, I wish there were some arcades around Maryland. I think for myself all i really need to make right now is 250 a day, which i have been doing consistantly paper trading ( i know its different with real money ) but i just dont want to quit my job until i actually have made some profits. Im thinking about options while im at work. What do you guys think?

 

What you need to understand about paper trading or demo accounts is they often execute trades instantly as soon as you click buy or sell. In reality there is a line of sellers and buyers and you will only get your price if its super liquid or you waited long enough or had your sell/buy order in early before the orders piled up. In day trading the profit taking is so slim and fast that this situation can be the difference of a profitable trade or a losing trade.

Options- are a totally different animal IMO- dont worry about them just yet. Futures might be more interesting for you.

A big mistake new traders make is trying to learn or focus on every market in the world. It doesn't really work out that way. Its great to learn about these other markets but I would not bother to try and trade all of them.

My advice find a few industries max 2-3 that interest you and study only a few stocks in each one... like 10-15 max. After a while you will know these stocks and industries very well and will be able to find opportunities within them.

$250 a day sounds easy enough but its actually pretty hard. If you had 25K in capital that would be a 1% return PER DAY. I wish I could do that every day and I have been trading for 12 years! Then you have to deduct your fees which add up quick, you'll need a broker that can sell stock for way less then the discount brokers do. If you did just 10 trades a day round trip you would spend $200 just in commissions with the discount brokers- e-trade, ameritrade and so on.

So day tradings not easy, dont quit the day job just yet- you need to develop a strategy and save enough money for capital and living costs.

 

Making money in day-trading activities using technical analysis is pure delusion, if you know someone who became rich this way and to follow his example, one day you may wish not having met him at all, rate of success should be contrasted against rate of failure in order to get a sensible conclusion. Unfortunately losers don't tell their strories and in most cases they represent over 80% of the missing picture, so be careful or all this will end up in tears.

 

If you have less than 2 grand in your account, you have a cash account. That means you sell something, you need to wait three days for the funds to clear before you can buy and sell something again. If you have at least 2 grand you can have a margin account, and then it becomes a simple restriction against buying and selling something 3 times in a given week. I'll wager that if your trading beyond that with less than, i'll be generous, 10k your really not able to scalp much. The less money you have the better off you are evaluation something for short term (week or two) or medium term (like a month-ish) and try and trade that way. Every once in awhile trade an oppurtunity that comes up but I'd caution you against attempting to day trade on anything less than a margin account. You just can't and really shouldn't do it.

Another thing, read carefully and understand margin requirements and trading limits. If you do end up day trading and they nail you, you'll have a 90 hold on your account until you hit the given margin requirement see: 25k.

 
Addinator:
If you have less than 2 grand in your account, you have a cash account. That means you sell something, you need to wait three days for the funds to clear before you can buy and sell something again. If you have at least 2 grand you can have a margin account, and then it becomes a simple restriction against buying and selling something 3 times in a given week. I'll wager that if your trading beyond that with less than, i'll be generous, 10k your really not able to scalp much. The less money you have the better off you are evaluation something for short term (week or two) or medium term (like a month-ish) and try and trade that way. Every once in awhile trade an oppurtunity that comes up but I'd caution you against attempting to day trade on anything less than a margin account. You just can't and really shouldn't do it.

Another thing, read carefully and understand margin requirements and trading limits. If you do end up day trading and they nail you, you'll have a 90 hold on your account until you hit the given margin requirement see: 25k.

I have enough to make it a margin account, but I believe I have to switch the designation before it actually becomes one. I was able to pull profits trading GMCR yesterday since it was high volume after earnings announcement. It obviously wasn't much, but I netted 75 dollars on a 50 share trade. Anyway, I understand the ability to make money on day trades is harder with less money, especially when $7 trades cut into your profits pretty significantly at such low amounts. I guess I'll try to set myself up for short-mid term plays. So lame.

 

You can daytrade if you join a prop firm. Many required 5k or under as a deposit and the PDT rule is eliminated. You'll probably need to study for a licensing exam however and pay monthly exchange data fees for level 2 data but in your situation it sounds like prop is good.

 
SirBarney:
You could try your hand at FX, not sure if that's something your interested in though.

Also, nice tags

I will consider it, but with my limited knowledge on the area, I'd like to stay away from FX.

EvOTrAdEr:
You can daytrade if you join a prop firm. Many required 5k or under as a deposit and the PDT rule is eliminated. You'll probably need to study for a licensing exam however and pay monthly exchange data fees for level 2 data but in your situation it sounds like prop is good.

I will definitely have to look into this.

 

You really want to day trade, but you're willing to just become a "long-term" investor if Scottrade won't allow you to day trade? Are you sure you know what you're doing? I'd suggest exploring your different time horizon options/investment philosophies and their respective typical returns before throwing away your taxpayer-funded financial aid.

All I care about in life is accumulating bananas
 
notamonkey:
You really want to day trade, but you're willing to just become a "long-term" investor if Scottrade won't allow you to day trade? Are you sure you know what you're doing? I'd suggest exploring your different time horizon options/investment philosophies and their respective typical returns before throwing away your taxpayer-funded financial aid.

How am I throwing away financial aid? I would get the same amount of financial aid regardless of whether or not I had this account open. I could lose all of my money in the account and I wouldn't get any more or less aid. You clearly don't understand my situation at all. I said that since I can't front the $25k required to day trade, I would work with what I have. I'm "willing to just become a 'long term' investor" because that's what my situation will allow. I'm exploring multiple options and the reason I created this thread in the first place was to get input on my potential options. If you reread my question, you'll see that I ask if there is anything I can do to day trade in my current situation. I'm not losing taxpayer dollars, don't be retarded.

 

By the way, you can't day trade at any broker if you have less than $25k. But look into ChoiceTrade for options and margin. I'm not sure what their minimum is though.

All I care about in life is accumulating bananas
 

Hey BVMadden, I'm a student too, and I have 4k in an E-Trade account. Day trading seems cool and all, but it isn't really a viable option for someone our age who has school/responsibilites/other shit going on. I would recommend doing your homework and finding a few companies with growth potential, low/moderate P/E ratio and a history of success. I have my money in a few good stocks, and each has a sell order on it for whatever profit margin would make me feel like the trade has been worth my time. This way you can live your life and still make money in the stock market, but you have to be in it for the long haul. Chances are, unless you're just pretty shitty at picking stocks, whatever you come up with will go up in the long run, so just pick a couple (I started with companies I already know about and use) and then hang on to them. In the mean time, if you want to beef up your day trading skills for when you might actually have the knowledge/time to do something like that, you should check out one of those sites where it's a play stock market. You have more leverage and no restrictions, and you're not actually going to lose any money so if you fuck up, it doesn't matter. I did that for a while, it really did help me learn.

Best of luck!

Ps. Don't mean to sound like your mom. I just know it really sucks to lose money, especially if you don't have that much to lose.

 
JeffSkilling:
Can you just send me your money instead of losing it in the market.

Your username gives me the urge to send you lots of money

I hate victims who respect their executioners
 

There's a method called "swing trading", which I've done back in college. Trading trends/technicals over a couple of days. Not totally related to day trading, but close enough to where you can get the necessary charting skills.

Sounds like you need to do a lot more reading though, the question seemed a little broad/generic.

"Live as if you were to die tomorrow, learn as if you were to live forever."
 

You definitely need to upgrade your account to margin at the very minimum. Otherwise you'll be subjected to the 3-day settling period before being able to use your money again, regardless of daytrading restrictions. You will also need the margin account before being able to short. Scottrade won't upgrade your account to margin if you're a broke college student.... they want you to have a full-time job with a steady income (since they're basically lending you money they want to make sure you can cover your potential losses). When I opened my account with TDAmeritrade I annualized my internship earnings and said I made $60k or something. Just make something up, they shouldn't ask you to verify this info; if they ask for proof, switch brokers.

Also, if you really want to day trade, look into trading stock index futures (ES, NQ, YM), which don't have the 25k rule, cost less in commission (

 

OP,

First of all, in today's economy, no one is making any money in the "long term" any more, despite the fact that the trading industry likes to use the term "long" when they simply mean "buy". In fact, the average "long" today lasts only about 15 minutes, if even that, for anyone who isn't already one of the uber-wealthy trading titans who can afford to make the surer money via price increase ratios on the already-stratospherically-priced stocks with very firm establishment out there.

So when you read all their rubbish about the importance of investing for the long-term by using the value investment approach and valuations and all that, much of that doesn't apply to today's bomb-shelter economy, where most people are just scrambling for short-term sustenance. Most of the valueists seem to be living in a dream world, just trying to continuing obscuring the truth, or perhaps they're trying to cast a spell of economic healing via positive delusion and self-fulfilling prophecy -- I don't know. But I do know that their knee-jerk condemnation of hype trading is ill-applied and even misleading to average investors, who are losing lots of money by falling for their long-term strategy dogma. That long-term value investment stuff only seems to be working for the billionaire titans and hidden insiders, who can afford to wait out the turbulence of the hype markets and the endlessly self-serving market sabotage of the short-seller cannibals.

So, because no one amongst the sub-billionaire "rabble" is making any money on long-term investments, what other choice is there? Short-term trading -- i.e., day trading. And when I say short-term, I mean seriously short-term -- like the span of perhaps 15 minutes, if even that. Because when the bozos at seekingalpha.com or any of those places announce their "sure bets", what they deliberately neglect to tell you is that those "sure bets" are only going to explode out of the starting gate when the bell rings in the morning and then their "stratospheric rise" will typically end by some time before noon. After that, it's Plummet City... and the prices will stay down.

In other words, the only way to make money nowadays for the non-Buffett-person is via day trading, because only those registered as day traders are not required to endure all the tip-toeing 3-day waiting period Mickey Mouse that hamstrung "cash traders" or whatever they're calling it now, are forced to endure. But as you've discovered, there's a catch, and the catch is that you're only allowed to really take advantage of all the hype-trading pump-and-dump if you originally deposited at least $25,000 into your account in order for them to qualify you as a day trader.

The bottom line? Don't even think about trying to play the stock market these days if you aren't able to deposit at least $30,000 into your account to play with. Because the vast majority of stocks aren't showing long-term increases nowadays, regardless of what anyone tries to tell you. For the most part, stocks today are only being batted up and down, as the day traders and the short-sellers scurry around like snarling weasels nipping off chunks of meat for themselves off the lumbering, bleeding carcass of what used to be the thriving American economy. You will inevitably get suckered into their trap of thinking you can make any headway in their treacherous snake-pit while being hamstrung by a three-day waiting period before every second new sell with "cleared" funds.

 

Sounds like somebody lost their Bar Mitzvah money on NOK...

Don't listen to the Yahoo commenter style doomsday speech - the truth is the retail investor loses more often in the short-term than in the long term. Absolutely hysterical painting the "billionaire value investors" as market-distorting thieves...

I hate victims who respect their executioners
 
Truthblade:

First of all, in today's economy, no one is making any money in the "long term" any more, despite the fact that the trading industry likes to use the term "long" when they simply mean "buy". In fact, the average "long" today lasts only about 15 minutes, if even that, for anyone who isn't already one of the uber-wealthy trading titans who can afford to make the surer money via price increase ratios on the already-stratospherically-priced stocks with very firm establishment out there.

I stopped reading here because I could tell (1) you are a terrible writer and (2) you have no idea what you're talking about.

All I care about in life is accumulating bananas
 

I just got approved for my margin account today after applying yesterday. I also got approved for options level 2. I'm only 18 and a full time college student, and it wasn't a problem. I read the first couple paragraphs of Truthblade's post and then stopped reading. I haven't been investing for long, but I've been watching market news and listening to newscasters tell me the world is going to hell for years. I've also observed at the same time the markets moving higher, especially in the long term.

I think that I'm going to focus on mainly on options trading. Scottrade can potentially fuck you on short sales which turned me off to that idea altogether. Long buys are still an option if I see a stock that I really like.

 

Trade for someone else with a lot more money and almost all of the risk laid onto them and not you. Best of both worlds.

There is no way in hell you're going to be able to day-trade while working in banking for legal/SEC issues alone, forgetting time, etc.

And if you're actually good enough to 'make a killing' shit normally doesn't hit the fan (blow out entirely) unless one is getting there by blind luck and/or having your risk parameters way off.

 

All this post does is illustrate your complete lack of understanding of both fields (IB and Day Trading). Working in IB requires ridiculous hours and intimate knowledge of a variety of companies and Day Trading requires constant monitoring of any number of investment vehicles. No way you can straddle both fields.

If I had asked people what they wanted, they would have said faster horses - Henry Ford
 

@ awp, from your prior posts you have not started working full time so STFU.

@happypantsmcge (non target freshman with a 3.5 gpa) stfu when grown men are talking. I mean day trading your personal account. dumbo!!! Trust me I know more about IB than you will ever know, haven interned at a top BB and having family at executive positions in a BB.

Thanks Jerome and monkeyman. Anyone else want to chip in with regards to management consulting and big 4

 

Dude, you CANNOT day trade from a personal account at basically any investment bank, major consulting firm, or Big 4 accounting firm. In all of those industries you are privy to material information about publicly traded companies. Even if you are allowed to trade, it has to go through a compliance office the vast majority of the time. I really don't know how familiar you are with what an investment bank is if you don't know this. Also, why are you asking this if you've interned at a BB? You should know there is no time and compliance is a major issue, making day trading virtually impossible, if not illegal in most circumstances.

 

Thanks Jerome. Yes I have interned at a BB and know stuff goes through compliance. I have no idea how it works in management consulting and I know in Big 4(at least for audit) you can trade if you are an associate in the firm and no one gives a fuck as long as you are not trading a clients stock. In my original post, I also asked about "corporate finance etc"

As far as not having time, not every succesful day trader monitors his/her stock consistently. My strategy, which has been very succesful for over 2 years, literally takes 5 minutes of my day. I guess another way to phrase the question is which corporate career allows for flexibility in day tradiing(personal account).

Thanks for the input anyway Jerome.

 

@I2010, in a nutshell I trade in blue chip companies to mitigate risk (usually dont make huge gain/losses on a given day) and ensure liquidity. I get a list of 4 companies on a very popular website based on "something", look at their chart pattern in the last x days, pick two of them and long/short at a specific time and cover short/sell at another time everyday(well almost). I trade large sums of money, which keeps trading costs down (get 40 free trades a month),so a 0.5-1% gain is really good.

Would be great being able to do this in a career with "stable" cash flow hence my original question

 

If you think you are that good why don't you just work at a prop firm or in S&T?

Jack: They’re all former investment bankers who were laid off from that economic crisis that Nancy Pelosi caused. They have zero real world skills, but God they work hard. -30 Rock
 

@revsly I, by no means intend to be pompous/arrogant stating my record. S&T is not my thing. I just dont see myself as a prop trader in a professional setting. I rather not trade with other peoples money and won't want to wait a couple of months or years before I actually get to trade.

On a side note, Will anyone give a fuck if you trade commodities if you work in any area of finance/accounting/consulting outside of a bank.

 

You can only trade through specific brokers while working at banks so they can monitor your account. It's quite possible they might not have access to futures.

Jack: They’re all former investment bankers who were laid off from that economic crisis that Nancy Pelosi caused. They have zero real world skills, but God they work hard. -30 Rock
 

While i worked in ops at a hedge fund I traded stock index futures at night. It was my first experience trading and was extremely valuable. I dont know if it was allowed or not, I just did it...its not like it interfered with my day job (except for the tiredness) and the fund I worked for didnt trade asian stocks so i figured better to "beg forgiveness not permission" as they say in the military. I still am not sure what the funds rules were in that regard since i no longer work there but nobody had told me I was explicitly not allowed to trade at night.

 

You cannot trade at big 4 firms because of compliance and independence issues. Most employees tell you that they own almost no stock. I second what someone said earlier about being a teacher. You could also be a personal trainer, security guard, cashier, etc. Does anyone trade fas or faz, 1 trade on charts can make you a nice 3% for the day and then you have the rest of your day free.

 

There exists numerous prop trading firms where you can deploy their capital by leveraging a down-payment (basically, their security that you don't lose the money) that you contribute. If you are as good as you say you are, then that is probably the easiest and fastest way to get to market.

 

Yea, and in that case I still need 40k. I would love to work for a prop shop. My degree is in exercise science so it's not exactly what they are looking for. All though I never understood why anyone would need a degree to trade, either you have it or you don't.

 
Anonymoose:

I hope you're trolling. 2 months is not a track record. You're going to go bankrupt.

Um based on what exactly? Trading is not a school learned trade, it's a sport.

Did you make it on WST? Did you go bankrupt?

 
shorting_wizard:

I challenge the guy who flung monkey shit to a trade off, your results vs mine.

OOOOOOOHHHHH! That'll show them!!

There's a reason few people day trade for a living. If you blow up once, you're done, and the odds of blowing up once are pretty close to 100% over a few years. I sincerely hope that you're at least not just using level 2 data by itself.

There's one of these threads pretty much weekly, and they all end the same. Some cocky/arrogant guy thinks they can trade for a living because they have 2 months of ridiculous P&L with real money, or an even better P&L while virtually trading. They think they have found the one strategy that's foolproof and is the key to infinite wealth, but sorry buddy, it's not. Almost without fail, they are never heard from again likely because they lost it all.

There's a reason why everyone here says this is a bad idea. If you want to lose what you have/be in debt to others, then go ahead and use your level 2 data all you want. But, and I'm not saying this because I'm trying to be a dick, you will lose it all if you trade on level 2 data.

 

If you really are great at trading, why don't you build up your own money? You will turn into a top prop trading firm in no time with your type of talent.

Absolute truths don't exist... celebrated opinions do.
 
ivoteforthatguy:
^ that's the wrong attitude to have, sir. i say ride the beta to riches. you can call it alpha after the fact.
+1 for the density of ideas
Nobody wants to work for it anymore. There's no honor in taking the after school job at Mickey D's. Honor's in the dollar, kid.
 

I would google it but I still have opinion questions that I want to ask here. Some of my questions cannot be answered by just searching it on a search engine. Please help me instead of just telling me, "there's a million and one places you can look this shit up on the internet bro". Thanks !

Learn Programming, Lectures by Professor Mehran Sahami for the Stanford Computer Science Department http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KkMDCCdjyW8
 
Buyside:
I would google it but I still have opinion questions that I want to ask here. Some of my questions cannot be answered by just searching it on a search engine. Please help me instead of just telling me, "there's a million and one places you can look this shit up on the internet bro". Thanks !

Then ask those questions. You have to do your homework before asking for help. You can perfectly understand what equity or fx or futures are just by using google/wikipedia/investopedia

 

Im sorry buyside, but i have to agree with whatwhatwhat. You are asking about really basic terms - check out investopedia, or better yet buy a basic finance text book. I actually dont know if this a serious post: your username is buyside which presuposes knowledge or understanding of what 'equities' are.

Capitalist
 

Sorry, I know those terms could be googled. I didn't intend on creating a thread just to ask about those terms, my main questions are in the paragraph below: "What do you trade and why do you trade it? What do YOU think would be best for someone with limited computer access while the market is open to trade? The markets open at 8:00 am and close at 4:00 pm and I have school for 8:45 to 1:53/2:45(tues and thurs). And what would be best for someone with a LIMITED amount of capital to trade( say about $1k-$3k....$5k would be stretching it)? "

I just posted those terms because I thought it would be better to ask in a thread instead of just searching as I might get a more clear answer and I can ask a question about it and have it answered.

Learn Programming, Lectures by Professor Mehran Sahami for the Stanford Computer Science Department http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KkMDCCdjyW8
 
Flake:
Holy shit, it's like he's fucking 5!

Hey Certified User, thanks for the help. How's JPM Equity Research going for ya hotshot?

Learn Programming, Lectures by Professor Mehran Sahami for the Stanford Computer Science Department http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KkMDCCdjyW8
 

Equities- ownership shares in a company Credit Spreads- the difference between the yield on different bonds Options- derivatives (derive their value from something else) that give someone the right but not obligation to buy or sell a security Equity Options- the above, but on equities as opposed to other financial instruments FX Market- the market where currency is traded between people/institutions. ETF's- securities that hold a basket of securities that you can use in lieu of buying each security individually. FX trading- actually trading one currency for another Swing trading- trying to capture quick moves in securities and trading based on a short term view Derivatives- securities that derive their values from something else. like an option or a future Futures- a contact/obligation to buy the underlying (what the future derives it's value from) at a later date (expiration) Silvers Futures Contract- a future contact where the underlying is silver Commodities- physical items like gold, silver, oil, etc. Swing Options- swing trading with options Spy Options- options on an ETF (see above) that mimics being invested in the S&P 500 Exotic Instruments- securities that are complex and are not actively traded. they are illiquid

I know that these are different things you can trade but what's so different about them? See above

What do you trade and why do you trade it? Futures. I like the leverage.

What do YOU think would be best for someone with limited computer access while the market is open to trade? The markets open at 8:00 am and close at 4:00 pm and I have school for 8:45 to 1:53/2:45(tues and thurs). Currency

And what would be best for someone with a LIMITED amount of capital to trade( say about $1k-$3k....$5k would be stretching it)? Currency or low margin futures

I like Flake too, so you should be nice to him.

Done.

"It is hard to fail, but it is worse never to have tried to succeed." Theodore Roosevelt
 
Something Creative:
Equities- ownership shares in a company Credit Spreads- the difference between the yield on different bonds Options- derivatives (derive their value from something else) that give someone the right but not obligation to buy or sell a security Equity Options- the above, but on equities as opposed to other financial instruments FX Market- the market where currency is traded between people/institutions. ETF's- securities that hold a basket of securities that you can use in lieu of buying each security individually. FX trading- actually trading one currency for another Swing trading- trying to capture quick moves in securities and trading based on a short term view Derivatives- securities that derive their values from something else. like an option or a future Futures- a contact/obligation to buy the underlying (what the future derives it's value from) at a later date (expiration) Silvers Futures Contract- a future contact where the underlying is silver Commodities- physical items like gold, silver, oil, etc. Swing Options- swing trading with options Spy Options- options on an ETF (see above) that mimics being invested in the S&P 500 Exotic Instruments- securities that are complex and are not actively traded. they are illiquid

I know that these are different things you can trade but what's so different about them? See above

What do you trade and why do you trade it? Futures. I like the leverage.

What do YOU think would be best for someone with limited computer access while the market is open to trade? The markets open at 8:00 am and close at 4:00 pm and I have school for 8:45 to 1:53/2:45(tues and thurs). Currency

And what would be best for someone with a LIMITED amount of capital to trade( say about $1k-$3k....$5k would be stretching it)? Currency or low margin futures

I like Flake too, so you should be nice to him.

Done.

Thanks, I appreciate it. Do you know any books I can read for low margin futures? I searched for threads but non really help.

Learn Programming, Lectures by Professor Mehran Sahami for the Stanford Computer Science Department http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KkMDCCdjyW8
 

Low margin futures just means future contracts that don't require a lot of margin, it's not really a separate type of thing. Think TY, FV, US (bond) vs ES (SP500). The collateral you have to put up per contact is a lot less. Just check the exchange site for a list of what the margin is for each contract.

The best book I know of is Technical Analysis of the Financial Markets by Murphy.

"It is hard to fail, but it is worse never to have tried to succeed." Theodore Roosevelt
 
Something Creative:
Low margin futures just means future contracts that don't require a lot of margin, it's not really a separate type of thing. Think TY, FV, US (bond) vs ES (SP500). The collateral you have to put up per contact is a lot less. Just check the exchange site for a list of what the margin is for each contract.

The best book I know of is Technical Analysis of the Financial Markets by Murphy.

Thanks.

Learn Programming, Lectures by Professor Mehran Sahami for the Stanford Computer Science Department http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KkMDCCdjyW8
 

Is the site howthemarketworks.com actually "accurate"? I have a practice account with them and Forex and that site seems unprofessional and I feel like it doesn't prepare me for the real thing. When I start trading, will the real site look bright, colorful, and have lots of ads? The info on the site is good but I just feel that the way everything is executed and set-up is misleading.

Learn Programming, Lectures by Professor Mehran Sahami for the Stanford Computer Science Department http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KkMDCCdjyW8
 
Buyside:
Is the site howthemarketworks.com actually "accurate"? I have a practice account with them and Forex and that site seems unprofessional and I feel like it doesn't prepare me for the real thing. When I start trading, will the real site look bright, colorful, and have lots of ads? The info on the site is good but I just feel that the way everything is executed and set-up is misleading.

You're going places. I might even let you come boss my sad research ass around at JPM, faggot.

Under my tutelage, you will grow from boys to men. From men into gladiators. And from gladiators into SWANSONS.
 

Global Zen trader is nice. Also, if you want a good community (not many people, like 20 or so) go to the StockTiger.net chat room during market hours. They throw around some trade ideas, he has a good list of daily breakout-watch stocks, and the charts he makes are great. And he's a really good guy.

http://stocktiger.net/

Reality hits you hard, bro...
 

[quote=MMBinNC]Global Zen trader is nice. Also, if you want a good community (not many people, like 20 or so) go to the StockTiger.net chat room during market hours. They throw around some trade ideas, he has a good list of daily breakout-watch stocks, and the charts he makes are great. And he's a really good guy.

http://stocktiger.net/[/quote]

I do hope you're joking.

 
Macro Arbitrage][quote=MMBinNC]Global Zen trader is nice. Also, if you want a good community (not many people, like 20 or so) go to the StockTiger.net chat room during market hours. They throw around some trade ideas, he has a good list of daily breakout-watch stocks, and the charts he makes are great. And he's a really good guy.</p> <p><a href=http://stocktiger.net/[/quote rel=nofollow>http://stocktiger.net/[/quote</a>:

I do hope you're joking.

For what? The site looks like a early 90s scam, but the info is good.

Reality hits you hard, bro...
 

The market opens at 9:30 AM EST BTW.

With a couple thousand, index ETF options could be good if you manage risk and money properly.

SPY, QQQ, IWM, DIA.

I would start off trading stock though, as a beginner you could easily get cleaned out trading futures/options. Would also recommend you read and study books on technical analysis and paper trade for a while first.

twitter: @StoicTrader1 instagram: @StoicTrader1
 

2 words CHOP SHOP. Any place that encourages high volume I do not trust at all. You should be able to trade at your own pace and not force trades. 500k shares in a month on only 100k in buying power is pretty intense scalping. If you want to join a prop shop that you put up your own money I suggest Assent.

"Oh the ladies ever tell you that you look like a fucking optical illusion" - Frank Slaughtery 25th Hour.

"Oh the ladies ever tell you that you look like a fucking optical illusion" - Frank Slaughtery 25th Hour.
 

Although Assent is a less notable prop firm, they run on the ANVIL. If you have a very large portfolio, the ANVIL will place orders extremely fast (well as fast as possible through ANVIL). Orders can be executed in about 100ms.

 

Thanks for your inputs. Even I was a bit wary of doing 500k trades in a month. But my only issue is I don't have much capital left to trade on my own at an arcade. I'm sure they would be asking for a minimum capital of around 20-30k USD. I don't have that kind of money, and I also have to pay off my student loans :).

 

u sure u shuld consider arcade trading where you have to pay to trade when you still havent payed off your student loans? Imo you should try to do something legit maybe not even related to trading for a little till you pay back the loans and maybe save up a little more for trading.

As trade4size said before, 500k trades a month is a hell of a lot of trades to force.

 

Definitely S&T. Day trading options is very difficult (momentum, scalping, swing) all take a of learning. You shold paper trade first and get used to it because you'll take a lot of hits initally. You'll want to look for a career where you are trading and get to learn what you specifcally want to do (so definitely be able to read charts on a real time and very fast basis).

 

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"Oh the ladies ever tell you that you look like a fucking optical illusion" - Frank Slaughtery 25th Hour.
 

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