How often do students and professionals see a problem with executives returning calls and emails after multiple attempts to make contact? Is this a lack of professional courtesy, executives being busy, or some other problem?
I am successful in contacting people more often than not but when I get no response after 5-6 emails and a phone call it makes me wonder if others have similar experiences.
I am interested to see discussion and perspectives from both professional and student monkeys.
What does WSO think?
If you are cold calling or cold emailing someone, they have no duty or responsibility or courtesy to get back to you.
I agree with IP. There are times when you are just so busy that you can't possibly get all your work done. During these times, responding to cold calls is the last thing you want on your plate.
On top of that, people play different roles within organizations. An executive's time is not well spent on recruiting junior professionals -- that's why large companies have entire HR departments and a recruiting process. If an executive takes the time to respond to a cold call / email, it is typically because they enjoy fielding such requests. You certainly shouldn't expect him/her to give you the time of day because you asked for it.
I come from a culture where you don't engage in that cold-calling or networking in any way similarly intense to what's usual in the US (Germany), so I can't really contribute to the solution of your problem, but who are you trying to write 5 or 6 times without getting a response, Lloyd Blankfein and Jamie Dimon? I probably wouldn't even dare sending a third email without having gotten a response on the previous ones, and quite frankly I wouldn't know what to write to not sound too pathetic, "Hello, this is Troy McClure, you might know me from emails such as ... and ..." ?
I would not email 6 times. They might not be even seeing those emails (caught by gatekeeper/spam filter), but, if they are, they are going to be annoyed. I would say to email twice (3 if they are an alum, you spoke at a conference, etc.) then drop it.
It is not a matter of courtesy at all. To an executive, you are a homeless guy begging. It is not a "lack of courtesy" if they do not help. They do not owe you anything.
In my opinion, the previous comments are far too nice.
Do I get annoyed at alumni who don't reply? You bet. Absolutely. When they were in school and looking for jobs, I bet they used the alumni network. Now once they got their own asses in, they forget (or refuse) to help the next guy. To me, that's just plain selfish. They leech off the school's resources when they were a student, and once they graduate they shun the next batch of kids.
I haven't graduated yet, but once I do I'll make it a goal of mine to help as many students from my university as possible. I bet there's loads of current students on WSO who share my view on this.
Couldn't have said it better myself. I'm also a current student (undergrad).
I take this stance as well. I am only too eager to help current students get into finance. It is fucking tough now, so, if I can help them prepare in any way, I do so. I owe my current job to (several) alumni.
More selfishly, I also think it helps your relationship with the school. If you are recruiting a student or two every year, you can bet your kid will be getting into your alma mater. It sure beats donating a building.
How do you know? Not everyone uses their alumni network, some people make their own networks.
And how is it "leeching off the schools resources" if students paid student fees, student union fees, and the alumni networks are run by the student unions which are able to be run to a profit?
Sure, it's nice to help others, I agree. I do it myself sometimes. But why, just because someone you've never met went to the same uni as you, if you're under the hammer, why would be expected to answer the the 6th email someone sent, when nothing he said in the first 5 had enough value to you to capture your attention.
This is why I don't understand making alumni donations either. Unless you're going to buy a wing of a uni and get preferred admission for my future generation, or get a building named after you or something, what's the benefit?
It's not about whether you owe someone something or whether you are obligated to help out. It's about giving back. To this day, I occasionally get an email from someone from my high school who's interested in my university. I would always take the time to answer their questions and to accompany him/her if they come to campus for tours.
Bottom line is - If an alum helped me as a student, I would want to help future students once I'm an alum. It's just natural. I personally resent those who think just because they have a full-time job, they stick their nose in the air and think they are better than current students.
I used to think very similarly to how you do, and to some extent, I still do. However, like most situations in life, it helps to look at it from the other side.
Honestly, I do think many of these alumni have good intentions, and would be more than happy to help. The unfortunate reality is that they are probably knee-deep in work, stressed out, dealing with personal issues i.e. family/relationships, etc. Put simply, they don't have the time. Think about how stressed and busy you are. Now increase that by several orders of magnitude. That's probably how an MD feels.
I'm just saying that there are a million factors to why someone wouldn't respond. It would probably be better for you to ignore unhelpful alumni and move on rather than get frustrated and angry over something you have no control over.
It probably takes 2 minutes MAX to reply to an email.
This.
If you think this is rejection wait until you are pitching deals to potential buyers, or calling on LPs to invest in your fund...
In a business setting if people don't respond after a 2nd attempt at getting in contact (e.g. leaving a message with their PA after having emailed a couple of days earlier or vice versa) I usually assume that they have issues that they have to sort out at work, or worse... This is for people I've actually met. If you're approaching someone cold it doesn't make sense to do more. It's kind of like dating, you don't want to be the guy who left 6 messages on his voicemail.
Also, don't hold grudges for people not calling back. Some people only like to call back when they have good news or can help. For all you know he has just seen a few colleagues get fired and the last thing he wants is to do is to talk to an eager student / potential employee.
Somewhat related... once we were working with another firm on making a joint-offer for a large portfolio of distressed real estate assets and as we were putting the final touches on our draft term sheet their entire team were MIA for 48 hours... We knew that this wasn't a good sign. A colleague was good personal friends with one of the guys on their deal team and he left the guy over 20 messages... Their chairman had killed the deal citing Euro concerns... as if that was a new problem, or we couldn't hedge appropriately / factor it in. Anyway, my point is that the 20 messages didn't change the reality of the situation and would have only annoyed the guy if he wasn't such a good friend.
Let me be clear, I never said I think I am owed or entitled to anything. I am curious about what WSO users think about the situation. I personally wait a month or two between emails to not annoy people I meet and I generally do not cold email/call at all unless introduced by common connections.
I think the alumni situation is a little different, but it also depends.
Cornell and UPenn alumns probably have a whole lot more work fielding student emails than, say, UW Madison alumns given the size of those schools and their placement rates on the street. I would like to think I have a strong alumni duty to UIUC, a moderate duty to the Big Ten and the UofI system schools, and something in-between the Big Ten and UIUC to Princeton alumns now (I am only spending one year at the school- the other four were at UIUC)
Interesting to see the difference in responses between people who actually work and have to respond to these emails and students who are the ones sending them.
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