Wikileaks

Baba Vanga seems to be getting more credibility with the Nov. 10 war date and potential Europe mess.

Turkey, part of NATO, helped Al-Qaeda apparently

http://www.elpais.com/articulo/internacional/EE/UU/vigila/cerca/agenda/…

ahhh sooo many people are on the hot seat right now. This truth can hurt people as much as it satisfies our curiosity.

We can only hope.

What is so funny is all these damn leaks have not shown anything amazing. No where do you see the leaks showing the USA doing much more than what we already know. Actually, the recent leaks support the WMD argument Bush had lol.

I really wish America would just shut down all of our bases, pull out all of our troops and just say fuck the world. In 10 years when someone invades something and the Europeans wring their hands we can smile and say "told you so".

I certainly wouldn't say that all leaks are pointless or harmful to American interests, and there is a time and a place when they are useful, or at least a case can be made (for instance, the Pentagon papers), but I agree with Jimmy Wales that if you think something should be published, give it to someone like the New York Times, who can differentiate between something that advances US interests and harms then.

Objectionable as this is, it is not "treason," which is clearly defined as:

"Treason against the United States, shall consist only in levying War against them, or in adhering to their Enemies, giving them Aid and Comfort. No Person shall be convicted of Treason unless on the Testimony of two Witnesses to the same overt Act, or on Confession in open Court. The Congress shall have power to declare the Punishment of Treason, but no Attainder of Treason shall work Corruption of Blood, or Forfeiture except during the Life of the Person attainted."

Fortunately, I don't believe the publishers of wikileaks are Americans, so they aren't subject to US law anyway. As far as I'm concerned, the publication of state secrets is spying, and spies are not protected by international law. Nor, because wikileaks is not run by Americans, is it afforded first amendment protections. The punishment for spying has been the same for a few thousand years, and I see no reason to change it now.

Yes, treason is not the appropriate word for what Julian is doing. What I find concerning is who in the government is leaking this information.

Some of the past releases came from pretty low ranked individuals. When you are at the bottom of the pile it is hard to see the whole picture. While I 100% believe in accountability and transparency, I also think there is a point where it can cross the line. Sometimes things are kept secret for a reason.

I agree with Drexel that the NYTimes or another reputable news source should be involved. Just wholesale dumping of this information could potentially cause serious harm.

This piece of shit is going down

http://www.guardian.co.uk/world/bradley-manning

Fall out from the release:

http://www.guardian.co.uk/world/2010/nov/28/us-embassy-cable-leak-diplo…

Julian is now pissing off the UK government.

In late 2008 the Moscow embassy wired back about the relationship between Russia's president, Dmitry Medvedev and the prime minister, Vladimir Putin, remarking that Medvedev, officially the senior partner, "plays Robin to Putin's Batman"

http://www.guardian.co.uk/world/gallery/2010/nov/28/wikileaks-cables-wo…

Bargaining to empty the Guantánamo Bay prison: When American diplomats pressed other countries to resettle detainees, they became reluctant players in a State Department version of “Let’s Make a Deal.” Slovenia was told to take a prisoner if it wanted to meet with President Obama, while the island nation of Kiribati was offered incentives worth millions of dollars to take in Chinese Muslim detainees, cables from diplomats recounted. The Americans, meanwhile, suggested that accepting more prisoners would be “a low-cost way for Belgium to attain prominence in Europe.”

http://www.nytimes.com/glogin?URI=http://www.nytimes.com/2010/11/29/wor…

I think this stuff is highly amusing. Don't worry it's only the world burning. Be a dear and pass the merlot.

Yeah, I have been reading some of those super important cables released. They reveal nothing condemning or illegal. All they do is make once strong allies uncomfortable. Thanks for kicking the bee's nest Julian.

This guy is running out of countries to hide in.

Yeah, that is going to cause some problems.

We spy on everyone and they spy on us. Considering how important we allow the UN to be in our dealings it only makes sense to try and get information on them. I suppose I should be upset about this.

The USA is carrying out air strikes in Yemen against terrorists. Oh no, the war crimes. Yemen was taking the credit for this so as to cover our backs. Now that this information is revealed I feel so much safer.

The whole reason all this information is made available to so many people is because of 9/11 and the issues with different agencies not knowing everyones information. We changed that and tried to make information available across the board. Now we are having sensitive information leaked all over.

Other than hurting relations with other countries and exposing our intelligence gathering efforts, these leaks do nothing. No evidence is found showing how we kill innocent people for fun. No planting of evidence. Nothing criminal. Just letting the world know secret US negotiations.

Like I said earlier. Suppose Julian called your friend and had them get all of your personal information, released it on the internet and hid behind " freedom of information". This is the same damn thing.

The government needs to find out who is releasing this information and arrest them. A couple life sentences in Leavenworth will make these kids think twice.

I'm sure that some of the things in the report - spying on diplomatic allies and the Yemenese case of a covert proxy war ARE in fact illegal according to international law. Nobody is going to be tried or go to jail because of it, but to say that they are not illegal acts is probably incorrect.

As far as this kid going to jail.....meh. If he believed that what was going on in these dispatches was unconstitutional then he is obligated by his oath to leak this information. I'm not sure if a lot of this stuff is, but it certainly is suspect.

Also, just out of curiosity, are you a Glen Beck fan Anthony?

Naa, I really don't like beck or O'Reily .

I have a feeling that if this guy ever had anything really, really groundbreaking, some black ops team would have already taken this guy out.

maybe he can leek something useful like Obama's birth certificate...............................

This shit is honestly just annoying rather than highly insightful. There are a few blatant things that will piss off both out allies and enemies and that mainly has to be the Iran-Saudi Arabia stuff and all the Russia information. I see on benefit from releasing these cables other than self-gratification. Although the United States cannot legally order the assassination of any person or political leader- without being a war-crime or something of the sort- I think that we should find a way to shut Julian up. Whether that be arresting him and throwing him in Gitmo or getting someone to do the dirty work- he needs to stop inflaming tensions for no reason. The guy who leaked the info is no doubt gonna be in jail for a long time at least, at most he could be convicted of treason and sentenced to death. (Revealing wartime information is treason) Either way, he needs to be made an example of. I think that the capital punishment way would be stupid though, simply because idiots may see him as fighting the oppressive government- and then the government silenced him. Don't need a martyr for the militant anarchists in the U.S. All things aside, it made me feel better about our Presidents- backing up Bush's WMD theory and also making it seem like Obama wants to actually win these wars.

/\ haha (edit, thought this post would be below blastoise)

There's some interesting stuff in what was released, nothing really game-changing though. While I support government transparency (and especially making our politicians look like the asshats they are), this isn't the way to do it. Not to mention that this guy DOES only go after the US, which is kind of toolish. Obviously he doesn't care so much about educating the public as he does trashing us.

so egrypt and isreal want to take out palestein big game changer

eokpar02][quote=happypantsmcgee][quote=eokpar02][quote=MMBinNCAlthough the United States cannot legally order the assassination of any person or political leader- without being a war-crime or something of the sort-

If only. The USA currently has a hit out on a current citizen.

http://www.guardian.co.uk/world/2010/apr/07/obama-assassination-cleric-…]

There should be a few added to the list. I see no problem with this as their are units designed to and structured in such a way that they are able to work within our borders with and against domestic assets[/quote]

If Anwar al-Awlaki was in the USA, nothing would happen to him. While his verbal support for terror is terrible, its constitutionally protected. But when he leaves, the government has the right to kill him?

Seriously, the National Security's Council basis for killing him is "Awlaki has been accused of encouraging terrorism in his sermons and writings."

Which amounts to saying he is on a hit list for being inspirational.[/quote]

Awlaki wasput on the list because the U.S. government believes that he is active in the plotting of terrorist operations. Therefore he is considered an enemy combatant and can be killed as a part of the "targeted killings" that you are talking about. On that note, I meant the outright assassination of a non-enemy combatant (rather than someone we are at war with)- which we cannot do.

eokpar02Could you post a link please.

Just because you say it, doesn't make it true.

MMBinNCbacking up Bush's WMD theory and also making it seem like Obama wants to actually win these wars.

Happy?

http://www.wired.com/dangerroom/2010/10/wikileaks-show-wmd-hunt-continu…

Yeah, I found it amusing all the WMD shit still being found. While not some mega cache that would vindicate Bush, it is still pretty funny that there were in fact chemical weapons all over Iraq.

The whole problem with Wikileaks is no one takes responsibility for what is posted. There are no professional fact checkers, no person to sue if something false causes damage. He just throws the info up online and lets the chips fall. Irresponsible if you ask me.

http://www.indexoncensorship.org/2010/11/wikileaks-and-state-department…

Look at this little exchange. What a cheeky bastard.

The thing that shocks me is how little consideration someone like Julian takes when engaging in something like this. Granted: nothing released (yet) has been endangering to national security on a macro level. Nothing incriminating has been released. Yet if you look at how monumental all the 'little' individual things add up to be, this is massive in scope. I'm sorry, my brother has been deployed six times as a reservist. If some little fuck was doing something like this that endangered him or the people around him, you could bet for damn sure I'd be on an insatiable bloodlust.

Ever bite your tongue when you were about to say something for the thought that it might come to hurt someone you know (a relative, friend, an ex, or someone else)? How much more ought you to exercise prudence when someone's LIFE is put at risk by divulging legally-protected, confidential interaction they have with someone who their own government or religious associates abhor?

I don't know how this Assange kid manages to live with himself. I couldn't put my mind at peace if I were to steal a candy bar. I feel like the fact that he has to live in self-imposed 'virtual asylum' outside of America speaks volumes for itself. He dare not set foot in a country he's actively working such harm against. I'm glad the first-world is closing up for him. Maybe he'll have to resort to some third-world haunt where people like those he's so willing and eager to put at risk will have a shot at him.

Good job Julian. I am all for releasing information about the status of Afghnistan, Iraq and the Cables being sent by officials.

It is about to time to know the inner workings and true opinions circulating around.

And NO the ME does not hate Iran. The governments of those Sunni/Wahabi monarchies hate Iran.

Get your facts STRAIGHT !

The noose tightens

http://www.google.com/hostednews/ap/article/ALeqM5iwccD-L13DUSB8jYF5UvK…

http://www.reuters.com/article/idUSTRE6AS1VL20101129

Don't bother hanging out anywhere in the first world pal. I was reading his Wiki page and the guy has run into trouble all over. Apparently publishing stolen, confidential information isn't his only criminal problem.

I just don't really see the point of this. I do think the stuff about Iran's capabilities is worth letting the world know since most everyone is pretty much kept in the dark with regards to their actual threat level. That said, letting the world know that the US thinks Sarkozy is a dickhead doesn't really do anything but make it harder for nations to work together.

See, that is my whole point. These releases are not about revealing injustice. It is about embarrassing and targeting the USA. Diplomats for the USA are making honest and frank assessments about allies and foes. This helps with negotiations and planning. Revealing this information does nothing buy hurt our diplomatic efforts.

This is just going to result in a further tightening of the information we share between units. These restrictions played a role in 9/11. Sad day when US soldiers, diplomats and other cleared agents cannot keep our information private.

The real issue is we have some enemies within our own services.

The general public is lazy and loves all the spy crap they see in the media. Read CNN/FT/BCC/Al Jazeera and you can form your opinion on global/political events. This guy takes common knowledge, repackages it, and distributes it as something else via the internet. Could that information serve harmful to foreign relations/military operations? Sure. However, there are fully funded spy agencies, terrorist groups, and whatever else you’d like to call them doing the exact same thing. Wikileaks stealing worthless secrets/documents, in my opinion, should be the least of our worries…..

Fact is that espionage has been around for a long time. It just so happens that some idiot probably finds this funny and is looking to make a quick buck on someone else’s expense.

A few years from now this guy is either going to be in prison or magically "disappear." It’ll all become old news and we’ll have something else to talk about….

Looks like he plans on releasing internal docs from a major bank in the U.S. that is "still existing" as well as a oil corporation.

I don't understand how all these people are applauding this cyber criminal for wrecking privacy rights.

I don't understand Wikileaks. Why is there such a huge US focus and effort on making our country look horrible? Isn't the founder Swedish?

I'm just annoyed that he isn't exposing all the other wealthy countries and their dirt? We are not the only ones, and maybe if they did I wouldn't feel so biased about it. It just feels like a site to slander the country. Ugh

It's not actually slander, for two reasons. Firstly, slander is spoken; libel is written. Secondly, both slander and libel would imply it was publishing lies. I'd much prefer if it was dedicated to publishing libel against the US; there are enough sites like that that one more wouldn't hurt. What it is doing is publishing the truth, and that is going to get people killed. We can only hope those who die are the ones behind the publication, rather than the ones who are being exploited for a cheap headline.

I know this is quite conspiracy theorist( is that a word?) but don't these documents actually make US look good? It helps the cause for an attack on Iran, shows that the US is holding back even after requests from ME countries to attack it and makes a greater case for Pakistan nuclear weapons to be taken away. Just something a bit odd

It may sound weird, but Jullian Assange is a modern day John Conner(from terminator). If be so inclined, I'd love to elaborate