Chances at HBS/Stanford/Dont Like Wharton

Quick thought: It looks like you have about 6 years of work experience now, yes? 7 years once you actually enter in Fall 2010. If so, that puts you at a slight disadvantage in terms of applying to HBS, since they're deliberately trending younger these days (esp. with the 2+2 program).

Someone feel free to correct me if I'm wrong, but I get the impression that ~4 years of work experience (give or take) is right about the sweet spot for HBS these days.

Wharton would actually be beneficial for you in this regard.

Everything else looks pretty solid, though.

H definitely likes younger candidates that have a ton of potential, but are planning to use H to develop that potential into strong leadership skills (this is not me talking, but sort of H-speak). I would therefore agree that based on hard stats you are a good fit for W, but since you don't like W, you've probably got a shot at H and S - essentially there is nothing terrible about your candidacy that says "you will probably be dinged." That said, H and S are not cookie cutter, just as most of the top 10 schools (H and S above the rest) - therefore, looking at stats alone is not enough to say how great of a shot you really have.

Additionally, you are leaving out 2 points that would be of interest: 1) what ECs/Volunteer work/leadership do you have lately, since you have been out of school for a while now, and 2) why do you want to go to B school- you've done IB, S&T and now consulting, developing products, etc (according to you) - you will really need to sell why B school and why S/H, more than "because they are the best." Stats aside, without convincing the schools that you have a great reason to go and selling your said experiences to the admissions (you can check out an article on B school essay traps http://www.bankonbanking.com/2009/07/11/applying-to-business-school-par…), you chances will be much slimmer.

In short: stats-wise, you are in the ballpark. Unfortunately, there is much more to H and S than just the stats.

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wintonheights- your profile, obviously, is amazing. What exactly do you want to do post-MBA? I mean you co-ran a desk, which at your age, is awesome... from an academic standpoint, there is nothing an MBA can offer you unless you take the initiative to sign up for PhD classes. Perhaps you're looking for access to recruiters- but I would think with your background, you'll be able to find a great job on efinancial and save yourself a couple hundred thousand in the process.

If you're really into finance & econ, I'd suggest Chicago Booth, Columbia and NYU also.

see my previous post #2. i am looking for access to recruiters too tho, as i think switching careers proves difficult w/o that. plus my previous experience is very narrow. i need to broaden my skills. and of course the bschool contacts would be great. took me a while, but im over the cost at this point. hard not to sound like a spoiled prick when i say this, but "its just money."

i lived in NY...looking for something different - Columbia and NYU are great schools but theyre out. Booth is an option tho as i consider it Wharton-lite, which im prepared to handle...

if all of this doesnt work out...i will keep efinancial in mind tho. thanks

Winton, you have a very, very impressive resume which spans three industies: IB, trading and now consulting. I understand that you think where you are in consulting now is not near the sophsitication of M/B/B, but would an MBA really be worth your time and money to get access to those recruiters? With your impressive background, why not just look directly into applying to some of M/B/B; I'm sure you would be a strong candidate. Please take my comment with a grain of salt because I am not an expert on B-school but it doesn't seem like an MBA has much to offer you. Could be wrong and don't mean to judge but just my two cents.

thanks...looks like my achilles heel will be explaining to the adcoms why i want in. i mean i knew that, but from the continuing "why?" comments (that i thot id given the gist to), it seems that ill have to pay extra careful attention to that in the essays. there are also some really personal reasons that id rather not share, but i get what you guys are saying.

funny...once youve been in finance for a while you become so concerned w/ the way things usually get done (or maybe thats just me?), i just completely dismissed the thought that i might be able to go bulge consulting direct. frankly realizing this certainly doesnt improve the odds, but its def at least worth a shot. you just reminded me to think outside the box. cool.

Schools applied to:

School 1: GSB - Submitted @ R2 deadline School 2: HBS - Submitted @ R2 deadline School 3: LBS - Submitted @ R2 deadline School 4: MIT - Submitted @ R2 deadline School 5: Booth - Submitted @ R2 deadline

waiting with baited breath...

btw confirmation for future bschool applicants - applying to 4 schools in one round is pushing it and 5 schools is borderline insane.

Good luck dude. Keep us posted.

Good stuff. As for myself, I applied to four schools in round 1 and couldn't remember the last time I was so stressed out -- think it was when I was applying to college almost a decade ago. Anyway, glad I'm done with all of that and you should be too. Best of luck!

i was staring at my inbox as i do so many times these days....and reached into the depths of rejection again when i realized that there were no new emails - not even from my friends. so i clicked the refresh button just to torture myself. and yep, sure enough there was nothing. crap.

but as i got up to walk away from my laptop lo and behold: an interview invite from chicago booth! i nearly fell down back into the chair. fkg AWESOME.

thanks for the good luck charm guys!

Obviously your academic and work experience are highly impressive but I think you will be dinged at H/S due to the following:

1) You dont seem very well-rounded on paper (i.e. lack of ECs, leadership examples outside of work, etc.) 2) I think Harvard will ding you on age and W/E. Most of the older accepted applicants are PhDs and former millitary guys.
3) A lot will rely on your ability to put forth a cogent story regarding your past and future

Keep us updated and best of luck to you.

yep. 1 and 2 have worried me a lot. well see how well i did w/ number 3 i guess.

if i can lock down booth, ill be satisfied tho. i did not apply to any place i did not wish to go.

Considering someone does 2 yrs banking + 2 yrs in PE, how the hell is he supposed to find time for ECs & leadership outside of work?

thats what everyone thinks, but you have to tweak your attitude towards it bigmonkey.

admissions committees recognize the all consuming job of working in finance, but the reality is: there will be candidates that have done what you have done and maybe even more than youve done, yet have still found time for leadership roles in society.

I was big on ECs in college, but only volunteered sporadically since i joined the workforce. i did not make an excuse, i just made sure to use the extra essay to explain what i have been involved in and why. if these schools wish to ding me on my age or that - as we used to say on the trading floor "it is what it is". i did the best i could with what i have and ill continue to do so w/ or w/o an mba.

You have an excellent background and should be a shoe-in to land a spot at a top bschool. As others have hinted at the most important thing is this:

you have a bit of an unfocused career and the bschool adcoms might think you're just a talented guy who doesn't have a grand plan and now wants to hit the reset button after getting laid off from wall street. (which i assume happened due to your timeline)

You'll need to craft essays that show how each career move is part of your master career plan, and the MBA is THE crucial component to allow you to finally land the career path of your dreams. Make sure you have concrete and realistic career goals, and write a compelling story about how you've done all this cool shit in your life, but it is all just a warm up act for your main career (which obviously will require an MBA!)

I'm assuming you're around 27/28 which is a perfect time. HBS likes younger applicants, more like 24. As you approach 30 your chances at HBS approach zero unless you are military, pro athlete, or PhD. I'd recommend applying now while you are at a prime age!

ECs are going to be important but guys with your background (IB) are always in the same conundrum. How do you find time for EC when you're working 100 hour weeks? :)

you mention you're an immigrant which is good, but i'm not sure about your specifics. Indians and Chinese have a more competitive applicant pool than Americans. If you are URM, still have citizenship from an 'unusual' home country, or female, you're a LOCK at all the schools.

Edit:

just realized your post is from September! Yowza. Anyway from your stats and background I'd say you have the best shot at Chicago GSB, due to the fact 1) they like older applicants and 2) they love finance backgrounds. LBS too. HBS likes younger applicants. MIT likes engineers (which who knows you may have a tech b/g). Stanford likes hippies. But you're going to be super competitive everywhere!

good luck and please update this board when you hear from the adcom.

got the invite from LBS today!

i hear they have a presentation/case portion of their interview...yikes. this whole process is a roller coaster. still have to prove myself one more time before i get in...i feel good about interviewing, but im trying not to get overconfident.

anyway, just updating anyone that cares. lol. back to the grind.

btw monument man,

i quit my trading job, and that was after surviving three rounds of layoffs. its possible i could have gotten let go eventually tho, who knows.

and im pretty sure my 'unusual' home country has helped so far, im guessing it prolly mitigated my lack of current EC leadership roles. Age is another story tho - im not that at that sweet spot age of 24 any more! well see.

don't like wharton? wharton is great!

wharton is great BUYSIDEGIRL. no disputes there. personal preference is all im talking about.

was that really necessary EIFFEL? a very quick check of your other posts seems to indicate youre not a troll, otherwise i would blast you to the dark side of the moon. im guessing you were just cranky because it was past your bed time. au revoir.

looks like HBS took a pass...invites were sent out and my inbox looks like the emperor with his new clothes.

i guess theyre not sending out dings because "technically" this batch does not account for 100% of the invites, but they did say they were "the bulk" (sly bastards) of them. im not holding my breath any more until i turn crimson.

ah well. cant win em all.

You might be a little bit short for HBS. I heard they only take 6'2''+...

the secret revealed! and somehow its strangely comforting. lol.

Just kidding around friend. Best of luck with the remainder of the process!

i just went from my lowest low to my highest high.

i got rejected from MIT yesterday after what i thot was a stellar app, and after thinking Booth, LBS and MIT were going my best chances this season.

i figured the "for all practical purposes" ding from HBS meant that my chances at GSB were definitely remote.

but then i just checked my email after a long flight back home and was extended an interview invite from stanford.

wow. i am speechless.

Congrats but don't screw it up.

my thots precisely. thanks maxc.

I think Wharton would have been a very strong shot; also INSEAD. They like people with a lot of experience, while H and S say that they prefer younger people.

agreed. to its credit, wharton seems to have carved a successful niche in the 28+ year old candidate space that H and S have left wide open. great competitive strategy imo. unfortunately INSEAD never hit my radar. no regrets tho.

stanford interview in a few hours..... you ever feel like life comes down to a few key moments?

thats what this whole bschool process feels like. youre at the gates with your paperwork ready. will they let you in? will you go from being really good to greatness? i feel like im right at those crosswords.

i know im applying pressure and being dramatic, but i need to be MJ today. carolina blue. rookie with the ball. tongue out. last seconds. last shot. elevate. score. for the win. a legend is born.

get 'em.

hard to be jordan. he dropped 50 once when he had the flu ... just saying

good luck

you don't need to be jordan. just be big shot rob and drop timely trey's. rockets, lakers, spurs, that guy has made dagger shots everywhere.

good point tuaj. i think it went pretty well. i would liken it to a scottie pippen performance in the bulls championship era.

lets just say, i didnt give them a reason to ding me. if they do so itll all be based on previous information or a decision they already made.

nothing to do but wait now.

Good luck!!!

thanks charm....

not much longer now, but this wait is freak-ing-kill-ing-me....ugh.