The Social Network For Smart Money Investors

  • Commonstock built a platform to showcase the portfolios, real-time trades, and analysis of the smartest retail investors, helping you distinguish signal from noise. 
  • From equities and options to crypto and NFT's, markets are changing fast. It's more important than ever to find trustworthy information. 

Comments (31)

Nov 24, 2009 - 10:50pm
marcellus_wallace, what's your opinion? Comment below:
monty09:
adehbone:
lol prestige, guys in energy are out to make money. Even the boys at JArnold's are still country folk at heart. Energy is prolly the most relaxed environment out there, prestige comes with your bank account.

JA has a nice piece in this months Fortune

Thanks for the heads up, I actually saw the video of the CFTC proceeding/testimonies recently, all interesting points from him and the producers, he sure is focued on putting regulations on the physical contracts and leaving the financials alone.

Dec 18, 2017 - 12:30pm
CreditGuy19, what's your opinion? Comment below:
marcellus_wallace:
lol prestige, guys in energy are out to make money. Even the boys at JArnold's are still country folk at heart. Energy is prolly the most relaxed environment out there, prestige comes with your bank account.

This is as true as it gets. Traders work for themselves and the company is just a vehicle to help them get paid. All you should worry about in trading is how much experience you can get early on and the rest comes with time.

Nov 28, 2009 - 12:55pm
MarkyMarkWahlbergWasAwesome, what's your opinion? Comment below:

does anyone have a link to JA's testimony? trying to write a paper basically on the CFTC proceedings and i'd rather watch the video than have to read the entire testimony...

------------------------------------------------------------------ "I just want to be a monkey of average intelligence who wears a suit. I'll go to business school!"
Learn More

300+ video lessons across 6 modeling courses taught by elite practitioners at the top investment banks and private equity funds -- Excel Modeling -- Financial Statement Modeling -- M&A Modeling -- LBO Modeling -- DCF and Valuation Modeling -- ALL INCLUDED + 2 Huge Bonuses.

Learn more
Dec 3, 2009 - 4:17am
AdvisorPrime, what's your opinion? Comment below:

Glencore was generally considered undisputed #1 before, had a lot a of turmoil however and so there's been a lot of talent shuffle from there, most notably to Trafigura.

Prestige-wise: analyst at a bank beats analyst at a commodities firm.

What you should do though is a question of serious thinking. The most successful people in energy trading quite often come from a strict commodities background and had a junior experience at an Enron or BP which gave them the connections and understanding of the logistics in the business.

If you're seriously thinking about energy trading, take a look at John Arnold's e-mails which he wrote while at Enron. If you sift through the crap e-mails about meetings and attendance, a lot of the e-mails where he's talking about pricing or moving the market would be good for you. Also, there's one particular e-mail where he asks for permission to short Enron stock/buy CDS (can't remember which).

-Advisor

Advisor Prime
Elitecollegeandinterviewprep.blogspot.com
[email protected]

Academic & Corporate Interview Preparation http://elitecollegeandinterviewprep.blogspot.com
  • 2
Nov 11, 2017 - 2:21pm
koalalove, what's your opinion? Comment below:

I know this is an extremely old thread, but does anyone know of energy prop shops that recruit summer interns? It seems like none of them really have a structure Summer Analyst program and they're never posted under career opportunities

Array
  • 1
Nov 12, 2017 - 10:59am
koalalove, what's your opinion? Comment below:

Yeah, I realized most of the listed firms are physical traders. I guess I'm more interested in paper trading.

Array
Best Response
Nov 12, 2017 - 9:38pm
Rotterdam, what's your opinion? Comment below:

There are very few firms out there strictly trading energy related paper. The largest paper traders in the business are the physical shops listed in the original post of this thread. Banks move some size too but it is in no way "prop" trading like you are thinking as they are typically just trading in order to offer a service to their clients with a little speculation on the side when they can get away with it. Then on top of that there are a few hedge funds here and there but nothing with summer programs.

If you want to trade paper someday then realistically you need to start at a physical shop or a major such as BP or Shell. From there you can move onto trading strictly paper if that is still want you want to do for some reason.

To answer your question directly, banks and the majors are about the only places that offer formal summer programs. What I would do if I were you though is get on LinkedIn and start messaging every person you can find at smaller shops related to energy trading/logistics and ask them to get on the phone. See where it goes from there.

Energy in general is much less formal than any New York based products and the people in the industry reflect that. Call enough people and assuming you have a decent background I bet you can find something. PM me your resume and I will see if I can help you out.

Nov 13, 2017 - 9:55am
monty09, what's your opinion? Comment below:
Rotterdam:
There are very few firms out there strictly trading energy related paper. The largest paper traders in the business are the physical shops listed in the original post of this thread. Banks move some size too but it is in no way "prop" trading like you are thinking as they are typically just trading in order to offer a service to their clients with a little speculation on the side when they can get away with it. Then on top of that there are a few hedge funds here and there but nothing with summer programs.

If you want to trade paper someday then realistically you need to start at a physical shop or a major such as BP or Shell. From there you can move onto trading strictly paper if that is still want you want to do for some reason.

To answer your question directly, banks and the majors are about the only places that offer formal summer programs. What I would do if I were you though is get on LinkedIn and start messaging every person you can find at smaller shops related to energy trading/logistics and ask them to get on the phone. See where it goes from there.

Energy in general is much less formal than any New York based products and the people in the industry reflect that. Call enough people and assuming you have a decent background I bet you can find something. PM me your resume and I will see if I can help you out.

agree and great reply

Nov 17, 2017 - 9:15am
koalalove, what's your opinion? Comment below:

I actually just applied to the Shell internship program listing Commercial Trading as my first choice. Anyone know where they are in the recruiting process?

Array
Nov 21, 2017 - 9:33pm
secrethidden, what's your opinion? Comment below:

Applied as well. Crazy long process just to get an interview in my opinion. 3 assessments along with a hirevue. That's at least 1 hour worth of work...

Nov 24, 2017 - 12:18pm
Mr. T, what's your opinion? Comment below:

While the pure "Commercial Trading/Rotational Programs" should definitely be something you apply to and strive to get they are fiercely competitive with 1000s of applicants for very few positions, making the odds of you landing one slim to none. I would also look for internship roles within operations, risk, or even contracts/settlements as that is where you are most likely going to be starting out in/spending a majority of your time anyways in order to learn whatever product you wind up working with. Physical Trading is a lot different than banking in that almost all of the "front office" guys come from the "back office" and not just through these specialized rotational programs. When you go to apply for full time positions having an internship showing that you have at least some understanding of operations/risk/contracts will be a huge leg up. Do not think that just because you were rejected for one of the prestigious rotational programs that you're shit out of luck.

Nov 25, 2017 - 6:59pm
nattyphizz, what's your opinion? Comment below:

if you call being an analyst or scheduler on a desk "back office" I guess I would agree. But 100% having a internship in risk will def help you getting to top of the list for your next internship or analyst gig

Nov 27, 2017 - 5:08pm
Mr. T, what's your opinion? Comment below:

Sint adipisci est enim eum eos nihil explicabo. Aut ut odit sint et. Ullam dolorem officiis numquam dicta. Et repellendus maiores distinctio soluta voluptatem. Itaque voluptatem veritatis laborum nisi. Dolor quos dolores ut incidunt ipsam.

Ex adipisci provident officiis quo nisi. Fugit tempore vel commodi maxime. Rerum rem quae nihil eligendi nesciunt. Suscipit quam voluptatum molestiae et error harum nisi.

Start Discussion

Career Advancement Opportunities

June 2022 Investment Banking

  • Jefferies & Company (▲03) 99.6%
  • Lincoln International (= =) 99.2%
  • RBC Capital Markets (▲07) 98.8%
  • Bank of America Merrill Lynch (▲01) 98.4%
  • Houlihan Lokey (▲06) 98.0%

Overall Employee Satisfaction

June 2022 Investment Banking

  • Jefferies & Company (▲12) 99.6%
  • Lincoln International (▲05) 99.2%
  • Greenhill (▲07) 98.8%
  • Evercore (= =) 98.3%
  • Rothschild (= =) 97.9%

Professional Growth Opportunities

June 2022 Investment Banking

  • Jefferies & Company (▲04) 99.6%
  • Lincoln International (▲04) 99.2%
  • RBC Capital Markets (▲09) 98.8%
  • Houlihan Lokey (▲07) 98.4%
  • Bank of America Merrill Lynch (▲04) 98.0%

Total Avg Compensation

June 2022 Investment Banking

  • Director/MD (9) $661
  • Vice President (37) $394
  • Associates (189) $246
  • 2nd Year Analyst (115) $162
  • 3rd+ Year Analyst (17) $156
  • 1st Year Analyst (369) $150
  • Intern/Summer Associate (77) $148
  • Intern/Summer Analyst (289) $91