Apple Corporate Finance?
I was reached out to by an Apple recruiter today for a corp fin analyst role and was wondering if anyone had any knowledge of what working in CF there is like? Any knowledge on what the work is like, compensation/pay, atmosphere and culture, etc would be very helpful. Would like to have an idea of what it's like before deciding whether to engage seriously with the recruitment/interview process.
I worked at WW Finance before, not sure if that is the same team though.
Yeah, WW is in the title. Any insights? Also what does WW mean? Worldwide?
Background: I worked for Apple in both the US and EMEAI with some limited travel to other offices as well.
CF: First of all, there are various teams within finance. WW is worldwide, then you have all the other regions. Within finance itself there are also other depts looking at their own subject areas. There is sales finance, commercial teams, acquisition, and more. If you are used to the regular banking or ibd climate - this is very different. Everything from dress code, demeanor, politics, hierarchy and rest are not comparable to a traditional bank. In fact, people try their best to be "non traditional". You will not see people yelling at each other or stab each other in the back like in most other places. Junior members of the team are encouraged to speak up more and not be afraid. It is a very American tech company, especially in the finance teams.
Disadvantages of finance culture: Because of their unique status in the world of tech and the market there is at times a feeling of insularity. While real banking and finance is connected to other banks, has a "common culture" among key institutes and has a relatively large networking element, I always thought Apple staff were aloof regarding a lot of external market factors. I guess when you are the perceived #1 in the world you can afford the luxury of behaving this way. Also, if you want to learn the traditional trade of finance, some elements are there, others are not. This is not a bank.
People: Very diverse, very different from each other, very different professional and education paths, very different personalities - all combined with their passion for the company and the brand. No race, ethnicity or background is favored, so this seems to be a better place if you are not white/a minority, too short, not very attractive, or not any of the other "perceived values" in normal banking. This does not mean that staff here are all fat geeks in unwashed clothes - but a lot of them are. Women also seem to get better opportunities here compared to other industries or companies. I think the part of the office I was based at in Cupertino had more than 50 languages and 40 nationalities. If a company is this important you can simply get the best brains from anywhere in the world. Talking about brains - I must say my colleagues were all exceptionally smart when it came to traditional intelligence.
Compensation: Low compared to street comp. But people don't work at Apple to get rich. They do it because they like the culture, want to work for a really cool company and want job security. I don't think I have ever heard that someone got laid off at Apple. Except on the self-driving car project. But that was an experiment anyway.
Culture: Very supportive, fewer politics, it is about getting work done. You can email pretty much anyone in the business and they will do their best to help you. There is no culture of "hoarding information or documents" like in many British or American blue-chip companies. Even today you can feel Steve Job's impact on product, leadership, guidance and how confident they are walking through this world.
Exit opps: The biggest upside, IMO. After I finished at Apple my phone wouldn't stop ringing. Everybody wanted to talk to me. There were recruiters and line managers who called me up just to speak to someone who worked at this firm before. They wanted to ask questions and learn about the culture. This is by far the biggest takeaway from my job - people didn't care as much about what I did at Apple, they were more fascinated about the fact that I worked there. I could have landed 3-4 jobs right after leaving within 2 weeks if I wanted to and even years after that gig people still refer to me at other offices "as the guy who worked at Apple before".
Conclusion: If you are into traditional careers at traditional white-shoe firms, don't join Apple. Things are done differently here and I mean everything will be different. Work processes, how projects are managed, how people communicate is vastly incompatible with how the old guys are doing it in Manhattan or the Square Mile.
Do interview and join if you are willing to be flexible, able to open up and learn and have a passion for one of the most incredible companies in the world. Passion and emotions are important because all your hard labor and input may not be reflected in your paycheck.
Just curious, what are you doing now and what caused you to leave Apple?
Why did I leave? - Apple, while it is a very unique and interesting company, was too small for me. When I worked there, after subtracting retail, support, admin, and off-shore staff - only a small portion was left in the management team. What does that mean? It means smaller teams, smaller projects (even though these are still very important), smaller titles and smaller responsibilities than in larger corporations. - Money All the infatuation in the world is not going to support my financial goals. Maybe I shouldn't have worked in IB before I joined the fruit? Joining Apple was a down round for me and at some point I wanted to be rewarded for my work. The salaries are not "low" at Apple, they are just low compared to finance jobs elsewhere. But I guess some people like prestige more than money. - Too many men Like many tech firms there are quite a few male dominated teams. There is a strong cultural push to bring in more women in tech, but due to many reasons this is still an issue. Based on my experience teams are more productive with gender mixed staff. While performance is not an issue at Apple, it is a bit sad that traditional stereotypes against women exist here. There are a lot of people from other cultures at Apple, maybe that is the reason? - Too diverse I grew up in the West (US + UK) and I thought I was always open-minded and friendly towards other nationalities and cultures. In some teams at this company there is a very strong bias towards men from a certain sub-continent. This is totally fine and they are really smart people, but sometimes it could become an issue if they bring in cultural elements from their homeland to the US or Europe (like how they talk about women or disregard certain decisions). Being in a hyper-diverse team where every skill, race, language and culture is present is the ideal goal, but it also has challenges we have to cope with. This environment is the opposite of traditional firms. Likewise, a lot of men in there dress like S. Jobs. black turtleneck, same glasses, new balance shoes, and the rest. I found that really weird. I guess they think the same about bankers who dress alike.
There is also something superficial that I learned about me: I prefer to work with attractive people. I would never say that everyone at Apple is unattractive (not the case), but I have also not seen a lot of well-groomed men or women in nice attire. Some basic standards were missing (nobody shaves, women don't wear always makeup, some people had weight issues,, ..) - the entire environment is very casual. If you like this, you are good to go.
Wow. Really appreciate your response. Very thorough and insightful. Would +100SB if I could. Currently work in CF at traditional blue chip company so it's not banking culture but it's also nothing like a tech company. Think it'd be interesting to try out though. Assuming comp would likely be similar to slightly better than my current company, with the obvious Bay Area COL caveat.
Same question as the commenter above, why'd you leave Apple and what are you doing now?
After I left I worked in an area that picks up quite a few ex-tech people: corporate innovation
These are the teams that manage the future of the company, handle acquisitions and manage change. I have done that in many different industries, including retail and investment banking.
+1 Huge insight. Someone get this person verified
This kind of post is why I’m on this site. Very informative, thanks.
How does Apple pay in Austin for Finance jobs?
I wouldn't want to pay the California state income tax to and deal with the Bay Area personally.
But Apple card = Goldman Sachs. Is there a specific banking division in Apple that focuses on Marcus or is that only at Goldman Sachs?
... what? That's why this is posted in the Corp Fin forum. This was in reference to corporate finance at Apple, not any banking division or Apple Card/GS/Marcus
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