11/19/17

Forbes came out with their annual 30 under 30 for 2018 today. It's that time of year where we feel bad about ourselves, but at the same time motivated, because no matter how well you're doing, there's always someone out there who's doing even better. Unless you're a 29 year old Partner at Pershing Square.

https://www.forbes.com/30-under-30/2018/finance/#3...

Comments (62)

11/14/17

damn Vitalik Buterin is the youngest person on that list and probably by far the wealthiest

Financial Modeling
11/14/17

This list has always confounded me since it came out. Don't get me wrong; the people who make it are all bright, talented, and successful. This is not me hating on them. But the whole notion of a "30 Under 30" ranking in finance is weird because it's a hodgepodge of young people who work at top firms mixed in with entrepreneurs. Unlike pro sports or tech, it's much more difficult to quantify those who are at the "top." For instance, is the junior partner at Blackstone more impressive than a portfolio manager at a large long-short equity hedge fund? One can argue it either way, but there is no quantitative metric unless we know how much money these guys have made. At least in tech, if we are talking about startup founders, we can compare valuations of their companies. And in sports/media/entertainment, we can look at actual on the field performance, records sold, etc. All we know about these people are their education and professional pedigree, job titles, job description, and how much money they manage if they are on the buyside. We know nothing about performance, and even if we did, they are too young to have a viable track record that can stand scrutiny.

I think the finance list is mostly compiled by word of mouth and networking, whereby those at top firms are able to get referrals, and the judges take that into account when making their decisions. Again, I'm not bashing the list or the people in them. I just don't think for finance, doing a ranking for people this young makes too much sense and mainly serves as resume pornography.

On a side note, I love how the Two Sigma guy is just wearing casual clothing and a hat. In terms of pure brainpower, he might be the smartest guy in that group.

11/14/17

i honestly have so much more respect for the people who actually started their own business/crypto/hedge fund versus all of the people that are just like VPs in BB IB. seriously confused how they deserve to be on this list to be honest..

11/14/17

And not one of them has ever seen a woman naked. I'm kidding. Some perspective for you younger guys here:

I've personally known several people who have been on the list in the past few years. If you're not on the list, two things:
a) The list means absolute shit. The selection process basically starts with people at Forbes asking friends of friends "Who's a high-flyer in finance that you know of?", then gets people to comment on the people they've heard of ---> Confirmation bias if I've ever seen it.
b) It's not at all indicative of future career success. Think about what the timeline is for most people in our industry: 28 is maybe one year after your MBA on the banking/PE side, and only the absolute top, top, top guys are allowed the VARs on the trading side to make numbers to write home about. And that's 80% of the timeline (80% of your 20s) done with the list.

That's not at all to say that these people aren't impressive, God knows they are. But if you're not there yet, and worried about how you measure up, chill out. I know Blankfein says it all the time, but chill out and take things day by day in your 20s.

My best friend in the industry started in Ops (Asset Servicing, literally the back office of the back office), jumped to I Banking, jumped to an in-house PE at a BB bank, jumped to a PE firm and now has his pick of roles at one of the PE firms you guys all jerk off to. I know what he makes and its's comparable to any one on that list. The difference is, he doesn't care to be on the list. That's the only difference. There are a lot of people who just don't care to be on it.

11/14/17

Probably true. At least Vitalik and Charlie are the faces of Ethereuem and Litecoin, I'm still skeptical about Bitcoin since last week's crazy drama with the segwit2x being cancelled.

11/14/17

Agree. Send in your pay stubs and rank in descending order.

11/14/17

The finance list is wildly uneven. It ranges from ppl that have killed it so far in their career to people that just happen to have goog gigs at good firms.

Still makes me *sigh since I know several of these ppl ... coulda been there with just a bit more luck

11/14/17

two sigma isn't that difficult to get into anymore

11/14/17

But it's likely Buterin.

GoldenCinderblock: "I keep spending all my money on exotic fish so my armor sucks. Is it possible to romance multiple females? I got with the blue chick so far but I am also interested in the electronic chick and the face mask chick."

11/14/17

And you can lie about your wealth and Forbes accepts it, at least for several years. That's the Wilbur Ross way of doing it.

11/15/17
dorsia reservations:

And not one of them has ever seen a woman naked.

This is wrong, my good sir. I'm fairly certain that the women on the list have seen themselves naked

11/14/17

Is that Korn kid at Pershing Square the son of David Korn that political commentator douchebag?

Follow the shit your fellow monkeys say @shitWSOsays

Life is hard, it's even harder when you're stupid - John Wayne

11/14/17

Thanks for sharing the link. Interesting to see blockchain based ventures being reflected in the profiles.

11/14/17

Meh. I just got a title promotion that didn't come with a raise. Take that, Forbes.

11/16/17
CRE:

Meh. I just got a title promotion that didn't come with a raise. Take that, Forbes.

So is it 'Senior Janitor' now or 'Executive Janitor'? I mean they both sound good. Congratulations.

"If you always put limits on everything you do, physical or anything else, it will spread into your work and into your life. There are no limits. There are only plateaus, and you must not stay there, you must go beyond them." - Bruce Lee

Best Response
11/14/17

Forbes must have missed all the under-30's on LinkedIn who are "CEO / Entrepreneur / Thought Leader / Disruptor / Reiki Healer"

11/14/17

Not sure if this is true, but someone said that you need to submit yourself to be considered for 30 under 30, so its not like they seek you out. A few of the people are obviously really legit(Like Vitalik), but if you're wondering how some of the 29 year old VPs or Principals made it its because they made an effort to be recognized.

11/14/17

^I've had a few credible sources confirm this is true.

"Who am I? I'm the guy that does his job. You must be the other guy."

11/15/17

Can confirm. I've been a finalist for the VC list two years in a row and the process is a fucking joke. You can technically nominate another person, but the questions are so personal it would be impossible to have someone random nominate you. So, you nominate yourself and then Forbes contacts you. You have to fill out a survey with your hopes and dreams and then you get on the phone with Forbes. The criteria is basically "be a VC under 30" - and also, totally uneven with people who have founded or created something, and people who just have good jobs with good firms (I'm the latter). My MD thought I'd have a shot so he told me to nominate myself, even though I've been fairly normal in terms of my Associate-level accomplishments (some good deals, some cool shit, nothing mind blowing)

(Just to clarify, I've been a finalist but not chosen for the list. I didn't really try very hard this year because I was applying for MBA and the apps were due around the same time)

11/15/17

The thing that boggles my mind - as someone else mentioned earlier in thread I believe - is that they really don't mention any type of actual accomplishment. For example, they talk about these guys owning x number of companies and investing x million, but they don't talk about how much return they've generated or how many of the companies actually succeed (unless I'm missing it). So you could raise $400 m, piss it all away on crappy firms, and still get on the list?

"Who am I? I'm the guy that does his job. You must be the other guy."

11/15/17

Yeah they only ask like what you sourced or what your projects were. They seem to care more about your (high) profile than your accomplishments.

11/15/17

Yeah I mean don't get me wrong, I'm sure some of these people crush it, but it just seems like they are focusing on the wrong metrics by which to give kudos.

"Who am I? I'm the guy that does his job. You must be the other guy."

11/16/17
little-monkey:

Yeah they only ask like what you sourced or what your projects were. They seem to care more about your (high) profile than your accomplishments.

Yeah I think Trader Daily Magazine Top 30 under 30 was more for descriptions and accomplishments.

But, the magazine imploded.

"If you always put limits on everything you do, physical or anything else, it will spread into your work and into your life. There are no limits. There are only plateaus, and you must not stay there, you must go beyond them." - Bruce Lee

11/21/17

Wow blast from the past.... that was the list that made me want to get into finance back in the day

Financial Modeling
11/14/17

Tom Dadon impresses me although I know 3G has the tendency to have very young people in very senior positions. Also, Julia Yu seems nice....

11/14/17

Agree with those thoughts.

I some concern with 3G strategy going forward. But I'm a big believer in the de-branding movement. They are obviously great costs cutters, but the lack of product development could be a problem.

Array
11/15/17

Totally agree. Similar with when they purchased Tim Hortons they installed some very young senior people and all they did was slash and burn.

11/19/17

idk about Julia but my friend working in same position as her at millenium cleared 20m before taxes a year ago.. so in terms of $$ def should be on the list

What concert costs 45 cents? 50 Cent feat. Nickelback.

11/14/17

"Fuck all these kids for being more successful than me"
-Everyone

11/14/17

This thread, lol.

You know, they also publish a "where are they now" of 30 under 30's, retrospectively. You might be entertained to find out how many of these "rising stars" end up falling off the map, convicted of felonies, or otherwise not so impressive down the line. Just a short list:

  • Elizabeth Holmes - failed Theranos chief, currently barred from operating a lab for the next two years.
  • Marissa Mayer - participating in puff pieces on Yahoo! news after running that same enterprise into the ground.

And from the '97 class:

  • Jon Saltzman - publisher and senior editor at a no name publication.
  • Too bored to keep going through this, but you wouldn't recognize the places where most of these people landed.

As others have said before - who cares?

11/14/17

I was with you until you noted Marissa Mayer as an example of "falling off the map". Lmao bro she is worth $300 million+. Damn I would love to fall off the map like that.

11/14/17

Understood, the golden parachute she's riding can keep you floating blissfully for the remainder of a lifetime. Still, she fits my point which is that frequently these people make the list when they're in the limelight, but that you can't stay on the top of the roller coaster forever. Her cache as an executive was more significant prior to her tenure at Yahoo! than it is now. She is now "that lady that got paid millions of dollars to make several poor decisions at Yahoo!", not "40 under 40".

11/14/17

Yahoo is one of the best performing stocks since she took over.

Granted that is all financial engineering and picking a good value spot to land as ceo.

Array
11/14/17

I'd rather run Theranos or Yahoo and fail in a fantastically public and grande fashion, i.e. "falling off the map" than not being there at all.

11/14/17

Sure, I think most posters on this board, and I too, would agree with you. My point is merely that the darlings of Forbes' "under __" lists are just mortals, like the rest of us - as evidenced by their careers falling victim to gravity, eventually. These lists are not much more than self-congratulation from connected people.

11/15/17

Basically your post was really shit, lol.

11/14/17

There might be some cognitive dissonance in my comment but I really feel like the list should only include people who are "head of XYZ" or "founder/CEO/partner a XYZ" etc. I mean come on...Associate banker at GS??

11/14/17

Ryan Williams is such a handsome brother.

11/15/17
PaulAllenIsInLondon:

Ryan Williams is such a handsome brother.

Looks like Chris Brown from far away, of course without the tatts.

11/16/17

Don't insult Mr. Williams like that.

He ain't go to Harvard, GS TMT, & Blackstone to be compared to that tap dancing fool.

11/17/17

He ain't get none from Rihanna like CB did thou..

26 Broadway
where's your sense of humor?

11/18/17

I'd hope the prestige driven WSO would prefer Harvard, GS TMT, & Blackstone over Rihanna.

At least I would - Rihanna's horribly overrated, both aesthetically and professionally.

11/20/17

I'd prefer Rihanna, chill with all that nonsense. Idgaf about her music she's a smoke show (especially after the recent weight gain) and if I could gold dig on some of her ~150 million net worth that would be just perfect. Maybe pull a Federline.

11/14/17

The 29 year old Pershing partner is a short little fuck and apparently can't even find a decent fitting suit/have enough taste to pay for a good tailor.

We're not lawyers. We're investment bankers. We didn't go to Harvard. We Went to Wharton!

11/15/17

Looks well on his way to being as douchey as Ackman himself

11/19/17

His speaking style does heavily remind me of ackman. Like a mini-me.

Thing is every other trading desks now looks at an ackman idea as the top filter for finding potential shorts.

Array
11/15/17

"We manage $20 billion of capital". Video really went and dated itself didn't it.

11/14/17

Wow... Michael Ding, I remember that kid from undergrad asking to copy my problem sets for Math and Econ classes... he's certainly come a long way...

11/15/17

You either have it or dont

11/14/17

Can a one hit wonder short-seller really raise 200 for a short fund.

FWIW Valeant is still one of the most misunderstood stocks in the market despite all the media coverage.

And of the shorts I'm not even sure they got it right for the right reasons. They were right with some of the issues, but IMO the biggest reason it crashed was being highly leveraged when the pricing environment for pharma changed. Teva has fallen a lot to and theirs no fraud with them. Just lack of pricing power.

Array
11/21/17

Think she was running the short book at a small (for HF world) fund.... so she has experience running a short book through one of the longest bull markets in financial history and she was early on Valeant which always helps with opening doors. Think Marc Cohodes (a famed short seller) is also seriously going to bat for her with allocaters

All that said, still difficult to raise a 200mm fund and her age will give allocators pause

Still, even if she doesn't raise a fund she actually deserves to be on this list as opposed to any associate at GS or even a mid-level pe guy at a mf

11/14/17

Agree that this list is kinda BS (by no means downplaying anyone on this list, obv super impressive) -- but damn, 27 year old PM at Viking? Jesus christ, that kid must be rain man.

11/14/17

What's more relevant than the 30 under 30? Almost everything.

Forbes is at the end of the day, a failing magazine at the verge of bankruptcy, with a CEO who's at odds with most of his journalists in terms of opinions, and this list is one of the few ways they manage to stay afloat. I was once invited to write an article on Forbes, but researching into the quality of content on the site, I decided against it. I'd rather be published in Bloomberg View.

GoldenCinderblock: "I keep spending all my money on exotic fish so my armor sucks. Is it possible to romance multiple females? I got with the blue chick so far but I am also interested in the electronic chick and the face mask chick."

11/15/17

Fortunately, once you're past 30 you couldn't care less about this list. That said, I didn't realize Vitalik was only 23. That's nuts. Explains his recent odd twitter comment comparing the damages of heroin use to owning child porn. Guy definitely needs to learn some EQ.

11/20/17

lol I just looked that up. how does doing heroin impose more risk on others than CP? Hopefully the mans not projecting

11/16/17

David Sklar = Danny Almonte

11/16/17

Dude maybe I should get back into finance. Will they hire an ex-felon? I'm pretty smart and personable, but have a record and went to a state school.

heister:

Look at all these wannabe richies hating on an expensive salad.

11/16/17

nah nah, fuck that. Goldie you been watching too much Billions

heister:

Look at all these wannabe richies hating on an expensive salad.

11/17/17

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