Help Me Decide on An Offer from a Major Developer
I recently received an offer for an analyst position with a major developer (Brookfield/TCR/Hines/Related). I live in a Tier 2 city and have one year of experience at a very large and well-known real estate asset manager. I would like to pivot to development as an end goal.
New Comp:
85K w 30% bonus (110K). There are also deal completion bonuses. Good upwards mobility.
Old Comp:
75K w 25% bonus (93K). Good, stable job with a clear future. Culture is a bit boring.
To take this new position I would have to give up the bonus that has accrued thus far this year (~18K) and pay back part of my signing bonus (~9K). This new position also has much longer hours and only has 10 days PTO whereas my old one had 21 days PTO.
My questions are as follows:
1) Is it appropriate to ask for a signing bonus to cover my lost bonus? They haven't offered any form of a signing bonus. Or should I ask for more in base pay?
2) Is it appropriate to ask for more PTO? Or does that give the impression that I'm incapable of handling the long hours. Frankly I don't mind the long hours, but I do really enjoy traveling.
Given that you have a job (and I'm assuming its stable as far as you know/can tell given pandemic), you have some room and legit reason to negotiate. I would explain your situation, especially the need to payback the 9k. Would you need to relocate? If so, you can ask for moving assistance. I think getting the 9k to "make you whole" is reasonable, maybe a bit more as incentive. As far as un-paid bonus.... eh, its a negotiating point, but not the strongest, still I would let them know. You don't look greedy in that situation, its a reasonable point, just be sure to have a great attitude.
The PTO question is deicer, I would talk with the HR rep if can. Just ask the general policy, how fixed it is, and how flextime is addressed. Some firms are very strict about PTO policies and when/how long you get more. 10 days is small, do you also get sick time or personal days? or is it really 10 days total? But some firms make you take time for like half-days, others don't give a shit, just make sure ur job is done and you are reachable. Since you have more, it's not unfair for you to ask, but this may be difficult... Like if one analyst gets 10 days and you get 15 days that will just look bad for the managers (think how you would feel if you only go 10 and the new guy got 15).
Thanks for the lengthy answer. I asked for a signing bonus to cover my payback amount and they said they would get back to me - either way I'm happy I asked. In regards to the PTO it turns out the offer says 10 but the reality is that no one actually registers their PTO when they take a vacation so you have a lot more available to you if you want it and get your work done appropriately.
that's what they all say about PTO
Not surprised by those answers, fairly common. To be sure, like some of the others above said, the "Unlimited PTO" deal sounds great but can be a trap/deceiving. Unless mngt actively encourages, if not forces, vacations.... the tendency is for everyone to take less than they otherwise would. If you are diligent, are intentional, you can totally take advantage of this policy... but it implies the trade... "We expect you to be reachable/available 24/7, even on vacation".
Honestly, this is mostly mngt fault, and if you stand your ground, you should do just fine. It is self-imposed punishment, not firm/mngt imposed.
How much do people really care about taking vacation? I’m very junior but do the senior people consider that when deciding on bonuses? Obviously assuming that I’m able to get my work done. Seems like such an antiquated line of thinking...
Honestly, I can't speak for every organization, but at least the one I work for and most I've seen, it goes like this...
You will not earn any special points as a junior (or senior) being a work mercenary, all that matters is you get your work done, done correctly, and show initiative, creativity, and resourcefulness as needed. Getting tagged with "wins" and "breakthroughs" or "saves" is what will earn you promotions, raises, and better bonuses. Show that you can lead, be uber reliable, and be respected by peers and you can get promoted to legit mngt roles.
Being organized and efficient should let you take some vacations with minimal "check-ins", clearly senior people will do this all the time. Saying you are too busy to take vacation is like saying you aren't good enough to organize your work to take time off, it's not actually a good signal. Clearly, you need to know the "slow seasons" if there are such a thing for being best time to go, but really, you need time off. You will be better off for it.
Same thing for staying late all the time, sometimes totally needed and no option. But, let's be honest, a lot is bullshit and you're not impressing anyone.
I think this is culture dependent. I've been in a couple of jobs with limited PTO and one was "we expect you to grind/work even when on vacation" and the other was "this is a corporate/hr policy that we're tied to, but me "hiring manager/boss" doesn't care how many days you take as long as you're getting your work done". Given he's looking at big institutional developers, I think there is at least a decent chance of the latter.
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