Hi, I'm just curious about the lifestyle you can have in London when working at an investment bank, or a PE firm. After all, London is the most expensive city in the world, so is the salary really worth working 70-80 hours per week?
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Mediocre - salaries are a joke tbh. It’s still a highly paid job compared to other jobs in the UK but you’re not going to be living a baller lifestyle in London.
I feel like everyone is fucking poor in London compared to the US
do you actually work in London?
Used to work in London but moved to the US.
Salaries are lower, but only compared to employment markets like the US. If you compare it to the average British salary, where they live, what they drive, what problems they have, etc.. it is actually a decent salary. Same for other EU nations, Scandinavia is hopeless (taxes, anyone?), Switzerland is very expensive, and Frankfurt et al don't pay nearly as much as London. Despite a good income, I often felt like a tiny wheel in a huge machine there.
The real rich guys in London are not permanent employees, they own businesses, make large investments from their family office, or are ballers in other areas of life (athletes, musician, social media influencer, entrepreneurs, ..). Also many are Chinese, Indians, guys from the Middle East, etc
Just walk around Knightsbridge and you'll realize that a normal job will never get you that kind of lifestyle.
If you work in finance and live in London, your life will be significantly better. You will be able to live a lifestyle average Joe could only dream of in England. Better post code, better car, better social class, better network. But it is only better compared to the rest of the country. Not better than what your purchase power would be in the US or elsewhere.
If an expat wants to live and work in the UK or EU, it is for the purpose of getting international experience or because of gf/family relations. There is no point spending years of your life in these markets if you could get the same job in NYC (unless someone would prefer London to NYC for another reason).
Agreed. I used to work in London and was pretty disillusioned. Luckily managed to make the move to the US.
Isn't COL higher in NYC than London as well as items like health insurance? Are you paid that much more it makes a difference?
Shit I really need to start my own business if I want to leave the rat race
I have cars as my hobby. Whatever car meet I go to, the best/coolest/most exotic cars are *never* owned by someone who is an employee. they either inherit, win, invest well or own a business.
Frankfurt with lower COL seems like a good deal to me tbh over LDN.
Frankfurt’s kinda grim tho
Yeah, I am in London and even MDs in IBD won't compare to the lifestyle Saudi's/Russian oligarchs have here. Finance will put you in the top of the pot of lifestyle, but certainly not a road of luxury.
shit lifestyle. just like PE anywhere else.
Idk where the above posters are working, but as an Assoc in PE here, I cleared 120k+ 80-110% (not giving exact amount to not reveal where I work) bonus last year which is pretty good being 25. By the time I'm in my early 30s, I'll be a VP making probably c£1m afer you include carry (maybe £500k cash). I got to take 2 weeks of holiday last year (which I spent well, think Aman hotels & flights in F). We somesitmes also have a team trip. Idk why everyone above is going on about how great the US is, everyone I know there works an extra 20 hours a week and takes far less time off every year.
Most MDs have big houses in Belgravia/ Knightsbridge and 1/2 holiday homes (usually a country house somwhere like Hampshire, and then something abroad like a chalet or a house in Tuscany). Most send their kids to Westminster/ Eton/ etc, go on plenty of nice holidays, etc. I don't get what more could you want in a career/ life at that stage? Sure you probably want to have £10-20m by the time you retire so you don't need to worry about money, but if your whole life becomes growing that number to $60-70m (or whatever those in the US aspire to) -- at the cost of having a miserable life in the interim, I think you've thought through things wrong.
well, that sounds amazing but I am sure not every PE shop in London will pay that much! I am in my late 20s/early 30s and absolutely don't get 1M GBP. Nobody at that age in my firm does, and from what I know through peers, 1M GBP isn't as common as in your firm.
Not saying what you make is super rare, but maybe I should start looking for a new job!
I suppose it's dependant on performamce. I think VPs at most funds will be making about £500k cash (£180k-£200k base + ~130% bonus), that's probably quite standard. The carry bit varies based off how well you do as a firm/ fund though (especially if you have a high minimum hurdle for your investors) - and there's probably some variation in how many bps carry you get firm-by-firm.
Are you a VP at a "MF" (much as I hate that term...) type firm?
Glad to finally see someone seeing the glass half-full (or even 3/4 full in your case). 2 weeks of vacation doesn't sound like alot though...
I mean I'm happy with the lifestyle I have broadly. 2 weeks (3 maybe sometime in a few years) is good enough for me, and normal weeks are maybe 65-75h (more during crunch times, less during times when we're just screeing etc).
I go out for drinks in the evening occasionaly w/ colleagues - and spend Saturday/ Sunday's having lunches and things with people, so I'm happy. I also work close to a club I'm a member of so I like spending time there when I get the chance (& there's a strict no phone policy inside so you can disconnect a bit!)
Salary affords me a nice appartment near Hyde Park, nice holidays, and saving enough to grow that pot for my own retirement too haha. When I get to age of having kids, as mentioned before, i'd hope to making more than enough to send them to good schools.
I think you can definitely be very content working in London - and even though I'm sure those in the US might be making some more (like some others alluded to), I woudn't ever want to move there.
Are you working in the industry or are you a student/ in another field considering private equity as a career choice?
And then you woke up from your dream. Stop talking utter BS.
Nothing here that I've said is false, I don't know why you would assume it is.
The numbers I've quoted are identical to what other friends at other MFs in London are making. My friends in HFs (same age) are probably making double what I do too...
Not sure if you don't belive the holiday numbers too?
I have no idea what year assoc you are or if you’re quoting your comp in GBP or USD but let’s go with £200-250k. I believe those numbers and think that’s ok money for MF PE assoc in London.
However I’m positive you wont be drawing £1m/yr as you make VP. As a more tenured VP I can see it moving toward that if you want to include carry but that’s it. I also have buddies in top HF (the sort you’d leave MF PE for) and I can tell you that you are wrong to think they make double of what you get at similar stage in career (PE Assoc). Face it - London has worse comp. Lifestyle is definitely more chill though.
PS: I definitely wasn’t doing fancy Aman or splashing on a nice crib when I was at that age/income level but I recognise that’s purely a personal lifestyle choice.
Just clarifying some stuff here (maybe it's of use to the prospects...):
£220-250k in GBP, Assoc1. Think this is market. I also do get a small bit of carry but I won't see that materailise for a long while (and really isn't huge for now...) so I haven't included it. I said specifically that as a VP, I expect to make £500k cash (AFAIK, even investment bankers make £350-400k cash as VPs, notwthistanding all these recent pay rises); and the rest would be carry as you mention (so I think we are perfectly in agreement here actually). When I say VP, I mean my median tenure as a VP (not VP1).
Afaik my friends at HFs (more quant/ MM stuff I should clarify) made probably 80% of what I make year 1 out of undergrad actually - they're probably on £400-450k GBP now. I don't mind earning slightly less for now anyway, my skillset would get me nowhere in a HF, and my income growth trajectory will probably be better (and importantly, it's also stable, unlike in HFs).
In terms of expenses:
Appartment costs me £2.5k a month (got a good deal with covid discounts) which you'd never manage to get a nice place near Central Park in NY for for reference.
I booked J flights for only £1.5k, upgraded to F using Avios I earn from work-travel & CC spend. You can get 10 days at an Aman for c£5-6k. I also went skiing in the winter too. About £10k all in is not too bad to spend on holidays p/a (seeing as you need them to recharge from work). Maybe it's lifestyle choice but I don't see the point of saving £5k here at the cost of your wellbeing.
My club membership runs me just over £500 p/a at the moment (by the time I'm 30+, it will rise to c£1.5k).
Dinners/ lunches/ drinks there and at my other prefered restauarnts once/ twice a week run me £150pw (c£7k pa for the ~49 weekends I'm in London).
Total here is: £47.5k (add in maybe £5k of random miscallanoeus things, like ordering water/ wine/ snacks to keep at home) and we're at £52k. Everything else (including all meals during the week, even my CC subscription fees, I expense). I save c£25k of my base, and 100% of my bonus (£47k-£60k).
I'm happy with that -- sure, as I said, people in the US will be earning more; and perhaps if I had slightly less costly lifestyle choices, I'd save a little more too. But I don't really care. For any prospects considering this as a career in London, yes it's quite hard work at times of course, but you can have a pretty good lifestyle/ you do get paid 'fairly'
LMAO London is not in the same planet as the US and will never be in a million years. Anyone who has worked in banking knows this. The Brits overestimate their place in the world. It’s now an irrelevant country with a tiny market.
California has a higher GDP than the UK. LOL.
Dude. The size of the UK market has little to do with the importance of London. Despite Brexit, London is still the EMEA capital markets center. Suggest you take the time to read your posts before you try to sound smart
When/if the tech bubble ever bursts, then California is going to be in serious trouble and don't forget the wildfires and risks of 'The Big One' or a currently overdue Cascadia event. California is really a ticking time-bomb
California isn't even on the finance map? Honk Kong is more of a financial centre than California?
London isn’t the financial hub for the UK though, it’s the hub for all of Europe, Middle East and Africa. Brexit has definitely moved a lot of the European staff and dealflow to the continent but it still stands as the main hub for IB.
As an aside, before ‘08, London comp and dealflow was a lot more similar to NY but London has been flat since then with the drop in FX from 2->1.3ish absolutely killing relative comp.
What about women in London in regard to the IB/PE/HF lifestyle? To what extent is it possible to have a normal social life, dates etc?
Looking at my superiors, most of them have physically very average, inconspicuous girlfriends/wives.
Don’t blame banking for that. British girls, in general, are ugly with their characteristic yellow Brit teeth and bad skin.
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