(urgent) if you had to choose 1 for NY office: LAZ, PWP, or MOE?
have a deadline coming up and wanted to hear thoughts from people. thank you so much gentlemen :))))
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personal choice but pwp > laz > moe,
PWP
not sure if it helps...but I had a choice b/w 2 of the 3 and went PWP based on culture and class size
Tossup between Lazard and Moelis. Not sure why there are so many PWP fanboys on this forum.
Lazard and Moelis will be slightly better for exits but you can get the interview from PWP as well. I think PWP is the least sweatiest of the 3, so that's why some may prefer them.
Also think it's a tossup between Lazard and Moelis. Would probably go with Laz for NY
All great firms, no matter what choice you make here it won't make or break you. Would go with where you have the best support system (alumni, mentors).
PWP if you value culture. If you want to slave away, Lazard and Moelis are equally good.
Just choose based on personal relationships
I’d go Moelis, they are growing like crazy and exits will continue to be great, plus you can do both RX and M&A....that would be awesome, for me at least
what if I value having a life? serious question. I've heard all Moelis does is pitch and pitch
Not true, used to be a sweatshop a couple of years ago but hours have improved substantially since. Don't know where you heard Moelis just does pitches, dealflow is really strong. Especially now given the ability to work on M&A or RX
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Coming from someone who worked at an EB and had a roommate at Moelis, the notion of spending years doing free work for huge clients at Moelis is still pretty true. Look at some of the most high profile and biggest deals - I can personally attest to the fact that they only got an extremely tiny slice of the pie. Moelis more often than not is being touted as one of the greatest firms to exist on this forum (not saying it's not good), but you'd be delusional to think that it holds it's weight next to GS/MS/EVR/PJT. Regarding exit opps, you'd get the same looks at any shop. EOD, it doesn't matter as much as you think. It's a self-fulfilling prophecy that the most polished kids tend to end up at the top banks, and then people fascillitate the perception that the bank/group landed them the post-banking opp, rather than their inherent abilities.
Kk intern thanks for input
do something other than banking if you value having a life
Damn bro you get an offer everywhere? Probably Moelis
Moelis for sure. No longer a sweatshop and they killed it for on-cycle recruit this year.
Agree with this
Agree with this although really can't go wrong here.
Do you think the differences in exit opps are marginal between the 3? Hoping to not have to spend all my 2 years doing useless pitches at Moelis tbh, and narrowing it down to the other 2
Moelis exit ops are definitely better for PE. Also not sure where you heard they do useless pitches cause that's untrue. Dealflow is very strong especially given you can work on M&A or RX
At my school (target), general consensus if given the choice: Moelis >= Laz > PWP but depends on your personal preference as said above
Congrats on the offers! All great places to start your career / can't go wrong with any of them.
I graduated a few years ago from a target school and the general consensus then was Laz > Moelis > PWP. Definitely not a huge difference by any means though and things may have changed a bit but anecdotally, this appears to still hold true.
Laz / Moelis definitely get a sweatshop rep. I know Moelis has taken efforts to fix this and I know the Laz rep is pretty overblown (highly dependent on group). PWP seems to breed more career bankers.
Depends on your preferences / priorities but I'd lean toward Laz (especially since they've recently upped their comp to be in line with other EBs). Will get MF opportunities from any of the three if that's what you're interested in although Moelis probably places the best into MF while Laz probably places the best into UMM.
Good luck!
Congrats! Three great banks, take the one you like the most! Lazard is the best known internationally and outside the pure financial/banking industry (and the largest). I have heard veey good things about PWP too, not as much about Moelis
I worked at Moelis for a while between BB1 and my current bank. You have to be an absolute psychopath to survive/have any semblance of a positive experience. That being said, you learn the technicals like nothing I've ever seen. You just do so much work, with so few resources, that you get very good. The best Moelis juniors were much better technically and in terms of general speed/efficiency than anyone I've seen at either at my two BB (think BAML/Citi for first bank, and now GS/MS). I also saw far too many people who wanted to literally kill themselves though.
I have a few buddies at Lazard and had an offer back in the day (SA so wayyyy back in the day), and I do somewhat regret not taking that. I think they balance the positives of both larger and leanrer platforms pretty well. They're smart and have lean deal teams, so you'll get substantive experience but while they grind you hard, it's not to the sickening and unsustainable extent that Moelis does. They also pitch a lot less than Moelis (hence the hours/bitch work difference), and generally the good analysts/associates work on slightly larger (and more public co) deals vs. Moelis, where competition to get on anything large is super intense.
Don't consider PWP; they just don't quite play in the same sandbox anymore. TLDR: I'd take Lazard...
Appreciate the detail - SB'ed. Don't mean to take the thread on a tangent, but would your recommendation change if these offers were at the Associate level (i.e. in terms of Moelis' culture, Lazard's deal experience and PWP's presence in the proverbial sandbox)?
Also genuinely curious, what drove you to go from Moelis to GS/MS? Was it due to culture or other factors?
Hmmm...At the Asociate level (I was one for a bit) I think the deal exposure at Moelis is better (and the money is insane) but the hours/lifestyle gap between Moelis and street is larger. I think Lazard's comparative appeal is a bit less though because you just get less responsibiltiy on a significantly more clogged org chart (and they still don't quite pay Moelis for associates, especially if you got on some big stuff). The quality of resume deal lines still probably better on average at Lazard, and the name is more established if you're thinking of trying to move over to in-house/client stuff or whatever (assuming if you're going into IB post-MBA you're not primarily fixated on sponsors exits). So I guess longwindedly, it swings a bit more towards Moelis, but I'd still probably learn Laz if I wanted to have a life.
Idk, mostly the hours man. They were brutal. Also the culture is pretty intense at Moelis, just got to become a lot. There's quite a bit of turnover there because it's such a grinder but those who stay really thrive there. I just realized I wasn't one of those people, and it was time I move on. I also wanted to get back to a bigger platform and see more large cap public M&A in the vertical I'm working in now, and which I'm starting to totally love. Couldn't be happier at my bank now - people are smart, deals are awesome, lifestyle is banking but still civilized. I do miss those Moelis bonus checks though....
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During which years were you at Moelis? I know it was terrible during the 2016 - 2018 period, but heard it got better now.
Yeah I was there from 2018-2019, and while it got somewhat better while I was there, I think it's mostly spin and certainly an overstatement to say that it's nearly as civilized as most banks on the street. Grinding is just in that place's DNA.
moelis?
PWP hands down. Work life balance.
Would have to agree with this. For equal salary and same exit opps (you'll get equal looks at each spot, just comes down to you personally), I'd go with culture. You'll hate your life a little less if you're surrounded by genuine people and don't have to worry about facetime
https://www.wallstreetoasis.com/forums/jpm-return-offer-rate-0
Really, same post you made. My dude you jerking yourself off or something?
So what if I am? Might just jerk myself some more
Moelis >= Lazard >> PWP
If you like going home at 7am on weeknights and then showering and going back in, pick Moelis. People in this thread saying the culture got better are full of it, the culture definitely hasn't changed.
Perspective from analyst at another EB (EVR/PJT): Lazard>=Moelis>PWP
Most PWP groups have great culture, but the exits are just not up to the standard of the other two yet. Moelis is a great place to be in terms of deal flow but it’s still the sweatiest shop on the street (though it has gotten better). Hours at LAZ ny aren’t much better, but I know as a fact that both groups are cross staffing analysts in M&A and coverage for RX assignments. So in this environment you’ll probably be able to work on some RX at either firm.
Laz and Moelis have had comparable exits generally (I think most recent PE exits thread showcases some from Moelis and another thread on EBs has some data points on LAZ, will post if I can find) but from talking with RX people at both firms, LAZ had stronger exits from their RX group.
Lazard is also meaningfully more prestigious as a name outside of finance and this is one of the reasons I even considered taking them a few years back over EVR/PJT. Without their pay bump I think I would go with Moelis. But with the recent bonus bump, Comparable dealflow, slightly better lifestyle (group dependent), and arguably better exits. I think I would go with Lazard out of these choices.
Posted this on a thread for LAZ / PWP / GHL:
"Exits from Laz NYC in last two classes have included AEA (x2), Carlyle (x3), Centerbridge, Cerberus, Golden Gate, L Catterton, Lindsay Goldberg, NEA (x2), Oaktree (x2), Rhone, Summit, THL (x2), Vista (x2), Viking, Warburg, etc."
Definitely missed a couple of other good names. Class exits over next two classes include American Securities, Ares, Centerbridge (x4), CD&R (x2), Cerberus, GTCR, Harvest (x2), L Catterton, Lindsay Goldberg (x3), Siris, TA Associates, Thoma Bravo, TPG (across different funds), Vista, etc. Once again, not all inclusive but you get the idea - maybe not as heavy on the megafunds but pretty solid for class size of 30, which is now maybe closer to 35-40.
know of a recent bain and top family offices as well
wherever you felt the best fit when networking/interviewing
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