1/9/16

Mod Note (Andy): Best of Eddie, this was originally posted in October 2010. To see all of our top content from the past, click here.

The worst trading error of my career (if you don't count my second marriage) was in Natural Gas, and it was a doozy. I don't remember the exact circumstances, but I screwed the pooch somehow and before I knew it the loss to the firm (for which I was personally liable) was well into the five figures. This wasn't me being wrong about the direction of the market, mind you, because that happened all the time. This was a bona fide, fat finger trading error - which almost never happened. I got called into the big man's office and he sent me home while he decided my fate.

He called me later that day and told me to meet him for dinner at Morton's, where we would discuss "my future with the firm". When I arrived at the restaurant I saw him, his second-in-command toady, and our research director out of Miami, a truly gigantic specimen who went almost 400 pounds. Whatever. I sat down and ordered a Mount Gay on the rocks, some bacon-wrapped scallops, a rare prime rib, garlic mashed potatoes, and a very nice Meritage to wash it all down. If I was about to get the ax, at least I'd have a full belly and a decent buzz.

The big man decided that the occassion called for Morton's signature 48-oz porterhouse. Now, I've been going to Morton's for 20 years and it's always been there on the menu, but to that point I'd never actually seen someone order it, much less consume it. That's four three whole pounds, hoss. When the steaks arrived, our table descended into a bacchanalian orgy of charred animal flesh. Not a word was mentioned about what happened that day. After the meal, while my head was swimming in meat and Meritage, the big man lowered the boom.

First things first: I wasn't fired. Firing me would only make it difficult to collect what I owed. Nice. His solution could even be considered a promotion of sorts, because he put four junior traders under me to help square the books faster (note: he wasn't letting me trade my way out of the position, because that would incur further risk to the firm. He put the guys under my supervision because I'd get a percentage of their profits and my hit would sting a little less). So I was going to be working for free for a while. A long while. Almost as an afterthought, he added, "Oh, and this one's on you." The waiter handed me the tab as the other guys chuckled, and I was out another $600 on top of everything else.

Anyone who has read Liar's Poker knows that Wall Street had its appetites back in the day. Almost everything - food, booze, drugs, women - was done to excess. It wasn't unusual to have a huge steak with all the trimmings at lunch in the middle of the day and come back to the office feeling like a hundred pounds of shit stuffed into a fifty-pound bag. There were a couple guys who spent their lunch hour working out, but they were the outliers back then.

As I've watched Wall Street transform itself from a locker room to a chess club over the past 15 or so years, I've been curious about how the diet has changed. It seems everyone is more health conscious these days, and that's a good thing. Believe me, as I sit here at 5'9" and 230 pounds, I wish I'd opted for a vegetable platter a few more times back in the day. I don't think I ever worked with any vegetarians, but surely there must be some on the Street these days.

The other day CaptK mentioned that he lost a bunch of weight on the Paleo Diet, and I've been hearing more and more about Paleo-style eating. Admittedly, I know less than nothing about it, though I'm guessing it involves avoiding processed foods and emphasizes foods that our hunter-gatherer ancestors were likely to encounter. Sounds like a lot of nuts, vegetables, fruits, and wild game. I'd love to hear if a lot of people are doing this and if it's working for them, because it sounds like the kind of diet a guy like me could get behind without too much effort.

I'd also like to hear from the vegan/vegetarian crowd. About a year ago, my wife brought home Skinny Bitch because it was all the rage at the time. She never ended up reading it because I got to it first. I have to tell you, it is a hilarious book and extremely well written. And it lays out the case against meat better than anything I've ever read. If you're the least bit squeamish about how your steak, chicken, or pork chops go from pasture to plate, this book will turn you vegan in no time.

At about the same time, we watched Food, Inc. for the first time. My wife hasn't touched a pork product since (and, by extension, neither have I). When you see how food is produced in America, it is really scary. But the movie has a hopeful message, too. You can eat really well if you choose to.


So that's what I'd really like to know. Is the culture of gluttony still prevalent on Wall Street? Or has the advent of SeamlessWeb and the hundreds of healthy choices it offers carried the day? The life of an analyst is pretty sedentary, and there's not always time to work out. What do you guys do to stay in shape? And how big a part of staying in shape is your diet? I basically went vegetarian early in the year and pulled off 20 pounds and felt great. But the minute I stopped, the weight came right back. I'm not ready to commit to a full vegetarian lifestyle - I love my steak too much.

Is anyone in the same boat? Is Paleo the answer, or is it just another fad?

Comments (88)

10/21/10

It's our MDs birthday today, we're going out for what quite could possibly turn into 3+ beers and steak.

i'm looking forward to it.

oh and that's lunch not dinner

"After you work on Wall Street it's a choice, would you rather work at McDonalds or on the sell-side? I would choose McDonalds over the sell-side." - David Tepper

10/21/10
Oreos:

It's our MDs birthday today, we're going out for what quite could possibly turn into 3+ beers and steak.

i'm looking forward to it.

oh and that's lunch not dinner

Lunch was very tasty, just to let you know.

Nutrition is simple; eat small meals, but often, vary your diet and use your head. If you don't think it is health it isn't.

"After you work on Wall Street it's a choice, would you rather work at McDonalds or on the sell-side? I would choose McDonalds over the sell-side." - David Tepper

10/21/10

Eat often, as in closer to 6 mini-meals a day. Get in the habit of drinking mainly water. Try to limit your meats to skinless chicken and turkey, and salmon (or whatever healthy fish, some like tuna). Snack on fruits.

Calorie count. I know it sounds tedious, but you don't have to get nazi over it. Just keep a loose running total somewhere in your head, and as you get used to your new eating habits and fall into some routines you won't even need to do that anymore.

The gnawing in your stomach for the first 4 or 5 days as you adjust goes away and you end up feeling "cleaner", whatever that may mean to you. I sometimes cheat/splurge/apathy-binge by hitting the McD drive through, and afterward I always feel bloated, heavy, gross.

It's also important to give yourself a cheat day (or just meal) to look forward to. If you aren't getting any exercise then I'd say just once a week, say Fri or Sat night, allow yourself to eat whatever-the-fuck-you-want. The rest of the time, have a little discipline.

As you already learned from drastic diet changes (like going full vegan), you may like the initial benefits, but the change is just too much to see yourself doing for the rest of your life.

Perhaps you and your wife, if time allows, could even start learning how to cook healthier meals together, and then you could start tupperwaring some of that into the office for your meals there.

If it is an inescapable part of your work (or whatever) to have to eat out with clients often, it's really not that difficult to make leaner choices once you start being conscious of it.

I am absolutely sure that nothing I have just written is anything new to you or anyone else reading this, you just have to look in the mirror and say, "Edmundo, you are a fat piece of shit who is going to an early grave if you don't make some changes." And believe it. And make the changes.

10/21/10
Conphas:

Eat often, as in closer to 6 mini-meals a day. Get in the habit of drinking mainly water. Try to limit your meats to skinless chicken and turkey, and salmon (or whatever healthy fish, some like tuna). Snack on fruits.

Calorie count. I know it sounds tedious, but you don't have to get nazi over it. Just keep a loose running total somewhere in your head, and as you get used to your new eating habits and fall into some routines you won't even need to do that anymore.

The gnawing in your stomach for the first 4 or 5 days as you adjust goes away and you end up feeling "cleaner", whatever that may mean to you. I sometimes cheat/splurge/apathy-binge by hitting the McD drive through, and afterward I always feel bloated, heavy, gross.

It's also important to give yourself a cheat day (or just meal) to look forward to. If you aren't getting any exercise then I'd say just once a week, say Fri or Sat night, allow yourself to eat whatever-the-fuck-you-want. The rest of the time, have a little discipline.

As you already learned from drastic diet changes (like going full vegan), you may like the initial benefits, but the change is just too much to see yourself doing for the rest of your life.

Perhaps you and your wife, if time allows, could even start learning how to cook healthier meals together, and then you could start tupperwaring some of that into the office for your meals there.

If it is an inescapable part of your work (or whatever) to have to eat out with clients often, it's really not that difficult to make leaner choices once you start being conscious of it.

I am absolutely sure that nothing I have just written is anything new to you or anyone else reading this, you just have to look in the mirror and say, "Edmundo, you are a fat piece of shit who is going to an early grave if you don't make some changes." And believe it. And make the changes.

I agree with most of the points you make here but I think you are wrong in telling people to avoid red meat entirely. I think lean red meats in moderation are excellent such sirlions, filets, bison etc. Especially for a person with decent heart health who is active. The saturated fats and cholesterol also have positive effects on free testosterone.

10/21/10

I did the full on vegetarian thing just for kicks for about 6 months and then gradually let off (the almighty steak is just too tempting to give up for good). It didn't produce any positive or negative results on my weight but that is moot since I have a metabolism that would make Usain Bolt look like an amateur.

What I did appreciate from the whole vegetarian experience was that it helped me focus more on a healthy diet. My diet then consisted of mainly greasy and unhealthy foods, and it may have not put on weight but it sure wasn't healthy for my heart or major arteries. Aside from preventing me from having a heart attack, I believe the whole vegetarian experience gave me a lot more energy and stamina (both physical and mental). The nutrients and vitamins that come from an all fruits and vegetable diet really do make a difference in the physiological makeup of the body.

In hindsight it was a good experience and I never did once get tired of eating a nectarine or two every day. If anything, it helped me be more aware of my diet and health. Kudos to you for staying with it and shedding the 20 pounds.

As far as vegetarianism or the Paleo Diet being the source for ultimate bodily health, I'd say it really depends on the body type and what vitamins one is lacking in.

A fun post to read by the way.

In 1976, James Hunt broke the sound barrier through Eau Rouge only to retire before the event finished... following the race he had sex with three Belgian nurses at the clubhouse near La Source.

10/21/10

Exercise is just as important nutrition.

I can usually eat whatever I want but I rarely have fast food. Playing soccer also helps burning all that fat away.

The problem with diets is that they are temporary and once the body adjusts, the weight piles back on.

10/21/10

I've been a vegaterian for 5 years, never eat red meat again. But, I do miss a good steak.

10/21/10

My gf is vegan, I like meat. But since she will always have veggies, fruit, and nuts around, I automatically eat these things more than I would by myself. Thus, at the same time cutting down on the crappy stuff makes that I don't have to worry about my diet. It all goes without having to think about it.
So....get a gf that's vegan :P

  • eyelikecheese
  •  10/21/10

As long as you exercise and burn lots of calories, then it really doesn't matter what you eat, to an extent. I run about 7 miles a day, so I can have so much wiggle room when it comes to a diet

Eat Wheaties or eggs in the morning. You need your energy for the day, and need to pile it on in the morning

Stick to fruits, they are delicious. Salmon/tilapia/chicken breast are amazing sources of low calorie,high protein.low fat foods that are inexpensive, delicious, and can have so many variations to them.

I think the thing that makes most men gain weight is he alcohol. Pile on a few binge drinking nights a week usually turns into a late night food binge on mcdonalds/taco bell and being unproductive in the morning.

10/21/10
eyelikecheese:

I think the thing that makes most men gain weight is he alcohol. Pile on a few binge drinking nights a week usually turns into a late night food binge on mcdonalds/taco bell and being unproductive in the morning.

This is my biggest problem, around some of my bigger friends a beer..turns into 10 beers, turns into a double quarter pounder with a side of mcnuggets.

10/21/10
eyelikecheese:

As long as you exercise and burn lots of calories, then it really doesn't matter what you eat, to an extent. I run about 7 miles a day, so I can have so much wiggle room when it comes to a diet

Eat Wheaties or eggs in the morning. You need your energy for the day, and need to pile it on in the morning

Stick to fruits, they are delicious. Salmon/tilapia/chicken breast are amazing sources of low calorie,high protein.low fat foods that are inexpensive, delicious, and can have so many variations to them.

I think the thing that makes most men gain weight is he alcohol. Pile on a few binge drinking nights a week usually turns into a late night food binge on mcdonalds/taco bell and being unproductive in the morning.

It does matter what you eat even f you exercise a lot. Exercise doesn't get rid of trans-fats which is what clogs up arteries and kills you.

10/21/10

I used to be heavyier...what i do might not be as popular but i thnk its the most sane and has worked amazingly for me.

  1. Diet: 2-3 meals a day...lighter at breakfast (usually just coffee). Lunch I usually get a main entree and top off with fruit. Dinner I let myself go until I am satisfied (not disgustingly full). Get used to slightly eating less. Mine is a combo of french diet/ warrior diet.
  2. Exercise: try to work out 5x a week. Lift atleast twice. Do something cool like kettlebelles/sports/etc.
  3. drinks: shy away from the girly froo froo drinks and beer...easier to do since i only drink hard liquor: single malt, or if im doing gin, hendrick's...stick to a couple twice a week.

thats purty much it. worked really well for me, you feel like you can be social, easier to maintain etc.

10/21/10

Last time I checked, 48 oz was 3 lbs, not 4.

10/21/10
sneamia:

Last time I checked, 48 oz was 3 lbs, not 4.

Ha! Nice catch. Still a pretty burly piece of meat, though.

10/21/10

Yeah, I've done my best to rein in the drinking. I really only drink the hard stuff straight up anymore, because I figure that's the least amount of calories. I limit my consumption to a liter of rum a week and wine with dinner maybe two or three nights a week. I realize that might sound like a lot to some of you, but it's quite a bit less than I used to drink.

10/21/10
Edmundo Braverman:

Yeah, I've done my best to rein in the drinking. I really only drink the hard stuff straight up anymore, because I figure that's the least amount of calories. I limit my consumption to a liter of rum a week and wine with dinner maybe two or three nights a week. I realize that might sound like a lot to some of you, but it's quite a bit less than I used to drink.

That's roughly a pound a week you could lose by eliminating booze, and that's just the calories that come directly from the alcohol, it doesn't include the effect it has on your metabolism or other aspects of your body/mind.

The Paleolithic diet is actually pretty decent, with a few modifications: Legumes (beans) should be a staple of any eating program... While it's generally good practice to eliminate milk, other forms of dairy like low fat cheese and yogurt (greek and other styles) are great... Extra virgin olive oil is good stuff and should not be avoided.

Here's an easy way to eat relatively healthy:

One palm for lean protein, one palm fruit, 2 palms vegetables. It's ok to sub in a palm of starchy carbs sometimes, but fruit > grains usually.

That's what I do and while I've lost some muscle mass being desk bound, I haven't become fat.

  • eyelikecheese
  •  10/21/10

Eating out is the worst thing you can do. For two reasons:

The daily caloric/fat/carb needs are usually found in one entree at a restaurant. You don't know what goes into the food not who doesn't wash their hands hen preparing it, nor what type of microwave they use to heat it up. Resist it at all possible

Also, I can't remember the last time I ate at a restaurant, and while walking out said " damn, that was a great meal and well worth the money"

10/21/10

Mount Gay on the rocks? That's not a thing.

This topic got real boring real fast.

10/21/10

This vegetarian shit is for pussies. I can't believe I see dudes in line at salad restaurants.

10/21/10

This vegetarian shit is for pussies. I can't believe I see dudes in line at salad restaurants.

Maybe as you grow older you will know why dudes line up at salad restaurants.......or maybe you just do not hang that much around your desk....

Maybe I do not have quotes under my name on google, but I KEEP IT REAL

Best Response
10/21/10

This is my 48 oz portherhouse with a half of a 22 oz lobstertail from del friscos along with tons of sides

BEAST MODE. ate it all solo.

ill throw down for WSO eating contest with anyone

10/21/10
shorttheworld:

This is my 48 oz portherhouse with a half of a 22 oz lobstertail from del friscos along with tons of sides

BEAST MODE. ate it all solo.

ill throw down for WSO eating contest with anyone

Ma Man! +1

10/21/10

^^^ I'm oddly aroused...

10/21/10

Um... nerd alert coming up.

Since I'm a consultant and travel all the fucking time, I can't really cook for myself the way I do at home. So I downloaded some of the info of the healthier stuff at fast food and the usual restaurants and make an excel sheet to calculate metrics like protein/calories and protein/fat. Best thing you can order: Wendy's Ultimate Chicken Grill with chili instead of fries. 590 cal, 14 fat, 52 protein. Chicken burrito bowls from chipotle etc are really good too.

I don't drink during the week unless it's an occasion (I more than make up for it Fri-Sun though) and generally try to get in the gym 4-5 days a week.

10/21/10

I've fat fingered for a mid 5 figure loss before. Quite an interesting emotional ride that is.
"Woah! Why's my PnL blood red?! "
"Wait, where's the market?"
"What's with the huge price spike?"
"Wait a second, what's my price?"
"FUCK!"
"No way that will stand, I'll get this broken."

(Temporary relief.)

Risk manager - "The counter party/exchange says to go fuck yourself"

(Despair resumes mixed with a weird perspective and light headedness.)

As far as food - I not a strict vegetarian, but I eat limited meat. I have no moral issues with eating animals. Steak is delicious. After learning about the industrial and factory farm processes (via Food, Inc, Omnivore's Dilemma, etc) I decided to cut back. Now I basically follow this advice: "Eat food, not too much, mostly plants.:
http://www.webmd.com/food-recipes/news/20090323/7-...

10/21/10
spoonfork:

I've fat fingered for a mid 5 figure loss before. Quite an interesting emotional ride that is.
"Woah! Why's my PnL blood red?! "
"Wait, where's the market?"
"What's with the huge price spike?"
"Wait a second, what's my price?"
"FUCK!"
"No way that will stand, I'll get this broken."

(Temporary relief.)

Risk manager - "The counter party/exchange says to go fuck yourself"

(Despair resumes mixed with a weird perspective and light headedness.)

Nailed it.

The only things I might add are:

  1. Puke blood into trash can
  2. Throw trash can at intern
  • eyelikecheese
  •  10/21/10

The healthier fast food meal is a charbroiled chicken sandwich from chik fil a. Hits about 280 calories and 30 grams of protein.

10/21/10
eyelikecheese:

The healthier fast food meal is a charbroiled chicken sandwich from chik fil a. Hits about 280 calories and 30 grams of protein.

Oh, it's in the list too haha. It actually has more fat and cals than the wendy's sandwich and there's not a high protein side replacement. You could go with the fruit though.

10/21/10

I wonder what kind of meal Kerviel would have to buy to keep himself from being fired?

Metal. Music. Life. www.headofmetal.com

  • vanillathunder12
  •  10/21/10

I am a vegetarian (not going to go into why, its a weird and crazy story), so I can chime in about the diet. Meat substitues help a lot. Boca chicken patties taste better than real chicken patties (it's weird but true). Good vegeburgers are hard to come by, but there are some good vegedogs out there on the market. Other favorites of mine are soup, pasta, mac and cheese, eggs (not meat, chickens will lay eggs regardless of if they are fertilized or not), and mashed potatoes.

10/21/10
vanillathunder12:

... pasta, mac and cheese, eggs (not meat, chickens will lay eggs regardless of if they are fertilized or not), and mashed potatoes.

I think the meat/no meat/different meats is only part of Edmundo's problem. The other part is he is 5'9" and TWO HUNDRED AND THIRTY POUNDS. Either he is secretly a body-builder on a sestanon-250 stack, or he is about 70 lb. over his BMI ideal. Cut out the pasta (or drastically reduce), NO mac&cheese, and I'd also stay away from those starchy mashed potatoes until his weight was more under control. If you are already happy with your weight, then sure, eat that stuff (it all tastes good), but if you are trying to lose a few pounds that shit will seriously fuck your efforts up.

10/21/10

Conphas:
vanillathunder12:
... pasta, mac and cheese, eggs (not meat, chickens will lay eggs regardless of if they are fertilized or not), and mashed potatoes.

I think the meat/no meat/different meats is only part of Edmundo's problem. The other part is he is 5'9" and TWO HUNDRED AND THIRTY POUNDS. Either he is secretly a body-builder on a sestanon-250 stack, or he is about 70 lb. over his BMI ideal.

Dude, that actually made me laugh my ass off. And you are completely right, of course. That said, I look pretty bad at 160, as you can see from this photo of me at the end of the Gulf War at 153 lbs:


Pretty emaciated. I think my ideal weight is around 180.

And for all you haters about to make a crack about the 70's porn 'stache, that kid got laid more by accident than you ever have on purpose. Examine your motives.

10/21/10

i'll worry about eating healthy after im 50 and have had my first massive corollary.

10/21/10

Exercise is as important as dieting. You can't have one without the other; it's as simple as that. I'm not saying you have to work out 7 days a week, but you need to make an effort and be smart about it. Running five miles to burn 500 calories isn't really worth it when you go out and drink 15 beers that same night.

Personally, a mile is the most I will run on a treadmill (I get bored too easily). Instead I try to mix it up with racquetball and tennis whenever I can get out and lift for about an hour 2-3 day a week.

What I had for dinner last night.....Zucchini pasta (with eggplant, diced tomatoes, garlic), a side of asparagus, and chicken. I'm usually not a fan of foods pretending to be other foods, but it was healthy and delicious. The gf is a health nut, so she makes a conscious effort to shop and cook healthy. I wouldn't be able to do this by myself!

I don't munch on junk food either so when I'm craving it, I either go for yogurt or fruits (chewing on gum does the trick sometime). I also do think it's important to have a "cheat day" so whenever I do go out to eat, I don't hold back.

Has anyone given P90X or crossfit training a try? I have friends who swear by it.

10/21/10

Anyone heard of Anabolic Diet? Makes me mouth water thinking of that juicy Steak.

10/21/10
kimbo:

Has anyone given P90X or crossfit training a try? I have friends who swear by it.

My roommate did P90x. He took it pretty seriously and saw moderate results, I wasn't too impressed. I would only recommend it if you're out of shape/fat. Since it's mostly cardio with light weights, I question it's ability to put on significant muscle. Frankly, it would probably be really good for chicks. If you're trying to just cram a workout into an hour though, it's not too bad.

10/21/10

like i keep telling friends and relatives - you can't really change your weight/health sustainably unless the diet goes with the lifestyle and activity.

i eat fastfood only in extreme cases of the munchies and i drink out with friends once a week or two (weeks). i also make sure i eat a vegetable and a fruit every day and usually stay away from oily stuff (deep-fried, oil-covered, don't know what else).

but i also swim twice-three times a week, though i really don't enjoy it after the first few laps. it's still better than running and better than watch my belly eclipse my partner-in-crime.

i guess i've never had much of a weight problem, so i might sound a bit of a hypocrite, but i also know that because i've never lacked any kind of food, and when i want it, i usually get it, i never have serious cravings for anything. chocolate and meat and chicken nuggets are always at hand, not to mention awesome freshly-grinded 2/3 pound burgers and beer and onion rings (i know the size is laughable but food here in israel is still served in somewhat sober portions)... and dohnuts.... i think i'll have one now..

night ppl

=========================================
"... then, lobbest thou thy Holy Hand Grenade of Antioch towards thy foe, who, being naughty in My sight, shall snuff it."

10/21/10

I decided that I shall never watch that video, again. BTW someone here said something about mice in meat factories a while ago. I believe it's "it's legal and clean as long as less than 3 are caught in the factory". Damn I just consumed some sausage.

10/21/10

The problem is that although everyone knows how to get into decent shape, not everyone is motivated enough to want to. To truly be successful, you need to get your mind right. There are different paths to the goal, but essentially all you need to do is exercise more and eat less/better. You CAN be in half-way decent shape without hitting the gym all the time, eating at McDonald's, Taco Bell, and Steakhouses, but you have to be smart about it.

At McDonald's for example, don't order a fucking Big Mac, large fries, and drink 2 Cokes. Order a Big Mac, small fries, and a cup of water (diet soda is gay). You'll enjoy the Big Mac more and save a good chunk of calories in the process. At a steakhouse, go ahead and order a 48 ouncer, but get some fucking vegetables as a side (baked/mashed potatoes don't count).

If you really have the discipline, you could follow any number of diets out there, just make sure whatever diet you choose is aligned with your goals.

Now, to exercise more, you don't need a ton of time. Cut some TV time off your schedule because who the fuck cares what happened on Burn Notice? Michael Westen gets a new client, Sam and Fiona help him save the day, and Mikey learns a little bit more about why he was burned.

If you don't have the time or the willpower to hit the gym for 30-60 minutes for 2-5 days a week, fine. Go workout for 5-15 minutes when you wake up and before you brush your teeth. Make that shit part of your daily routine: wake up, piss/shit, pushups, burpees, etc, 2nd shit, brush teeth, move on with your day. Same thing at night: finish all-nighter, fuck girlfriend, pushups, burpees, etc., take a shit, brush teeth, and go to sleep.

Even if you do you spend an hour watching Burn Notice, use the commercials to push out some sets of pushups, squats, burpees, or whatever. In a 2-3 minute commercial period you can do a quick circuit of exercises and rest during the 5-10 minutes of TV time. If you do this, push yourself hard for those 2-3 minutes; to the point of exhaustion, and then bang out more reps.
Take what you want out of life.

10/21/10

@Kools Not for nothing, but if you're shitting three times a day, you don't have any trouble maintaining your weight.

10/21/10

Edmundo Braverman:
@Kools Not for nothing, but if you're shitting three times a day, you don't have any trouble maintaining your weight.

that's very true. also, as an afterthought:

=========================================
"... then, lobbest thou thy Holy Hand Grenade of Antioch towards thy foe, who, being naughty in My sight, shall snuff it."

10/21/10
10/21/10

Ah, hey guys - looks like I'm a bit late to the party here. Allow me to throw my hat into the ring for the Paleo Diet (albeit my own modified version based on some of Tim Ferriss's work).

First, my own experience. I was a high school athlete and generally pretty in shape before college - about 6'1", 180lbs and fairly built. Over the course of 4 years and countless Busch Lights, I graduated around 205lbs and started a job in banking. After 6 months of takeout dinners and 90 hour weeks at a desk I was up to 220lbs, had back pain, acne, and digestive problems. I regret now that I didn't have my body fat analyzed, but I expect I was pushing 30%. I looked in the mirror one day and realized - I was unhealthy. I was on pace to become the fat guy in the red convertible that dies at 55. It was time for a change. I'll tell you where I am now at the end of this post.

Around this time I'd also picked up Tim Ferriss's excellent book The Four Hour Work Week, which I'm sure you've all heard Eddie and I recommend countless times. Ferriss also does significant fitness research and experimentation and had two posts on his blog that interested me. One called From Geek to Freak: How I Gained 34 lbs of Muscle in 4 Weeks and another titled How to Lose 20lbs of Fat in 30 Days - Without Doing Any Exercise. I highly encourage you to read them both if you're trying to lose weight.

The fitness plan I arrived at is a modification of the Paleolithic Diet, which I'll explain briefly below. For the Cliffs Notes crowd, the below can be summarized in 3 bullets:
- Avoid white carbohydrates. If it is white or can be white (bread, noodles, rice, cookies, crackers, etc), cut it out completely.
- Don't drink calories. No sodas or juices. In combination with the above, that also means (gasp) no beer. We'll allow wine and hard liquor (straight or with diet soda) because a guy's got to have a life.
- Exercise to exhaustion. 2-3 30 minute high intensity workouts are more valuable for muscle hypertrophy than 4x weekly moderate sessions.

So - let's dive in. The basic idea behind Paleo eating is to consume only foods that our ancestors from the Paleolithic Era had access to (meat, fish, shellfish, eggs, nuts, vegetables, fruit, etc), and exclude foods that developed in the more recent Neolithic, post-agricultural era (grains, processed dairy, beans/legumes, potatoes, sugar, and other "fake" foods). Volumes of literature have been written about the reasons this makes sense, particularly the ways that carbohydrates and simple sugars are metabolized - they are literally killing you by spiking your insulin, damaging your small intestines, and more. Read this article by Robb Wolf for more - Robb is the former review editor for the Journal of Nutrition and Metabolism. He knows his stuff.

Above is the "standard" Paleo diet, but I've made a few modifications to make it both less miserable (more sustainable) and more practical. First, I'll allow beans/legumes, both for variety and also for protein. Also, I allow for 1 "off day" each week when I can eat whatever I want. No only does this help keep me sane, but spiking caloric intake once per week increases fat loss by ensuring that metabolic rate (thyroid function, etc) doesn't downregulate from extended caloric restriction.

Let's also briefly discuss exercise. The two things you're shooting for are consistent elevated heart rate and lifts to failure. You can accomplish this with cycle training - begin with 15 minutes on the treadmill to get your heart rate up, then move around the gym lifting several muscle groups to failure, with no rest in between. Do all your sets to failure. It will hurt, but you'll build lean muscle mass very quickly. You can be in and out in under 45 minutes, including locker room time.

So how has this all worked for me? As I said, at my peak during banking I was 220lbs, with back pain, acne, and digestive problems. So I made a change. I went on my modified Paleo diet, and hit the gym for 20 minutes of cardio and 20 minutes of hard lifting twice a week (it was all my banking schedule would allow anyway). I kept drinking on the weekends with my buddies to stay sane, but limited myself to wine or bourbon rocks. What happened? After 3 months I was down to 200lbs, my skin was clear, and my digestive problems were totally gone. After 3 more months I was at 185lbs, in the best shape of my life, with no lower back pain. Several years later, that's still where I am today. This stuff works guys, I've lived it.

And for everyone in the "diet or exercise" debate - the real answer is that you should do both. However, diet is absolutely critical. Look at the numbers. A single chocolate chip cookie has about 300 empty sugar calories. It would take you 30 minutes on the treadmill to burn that off. It's so much easier to cut weight by eating healthy, wholesome calories than by killing yourself at the gym. When you combine the diet with exercise, that's when the real results appear.

I've already gone on far too long, so I'll cut myself off. Happy to answer any questions about Paleo eating or my experience doing it while banking. Give it 30 days guys, it just might change your life.

- Capt K -
"Prestige is like a powerful magnet that warps even your beliefs about what you enjoy. If you want to make ambitious people waste their time on errands, bait the hook with prestige." - Paul Graham

10/21/10
CaptK:

- Exercise to exhaustion. 2-3 30 minute high intensity workouts are more valuable for muscle hypertrophy than 4x weekly moderate sessions.

I agree with CaptK completely on this statement - excellent advice. To many people spend like 45 minutes every day on the eleptical machine going at complete 50 year old chick speed trying to burn a bunch of calories and see very little result (not that it doesn't help a little, but still). You need to go to exhaustion - it's more effective and WAY more time efficient - which is key for a banker. The same thing goes with weights - go heavy or go home. None of that soft ass "toning" shit with high reps and low weights. 3-4 sets of 6-8 with 80+% of your maximum weight is the way to go.

10/21/10

I was hoping you'd chime in, Captain.

I did the same thing you did when I lost the 20 pounds I talked about, buy my problem was that my cheat day became a cheat day-and-a-half, and then a cheat weekend, and then I was back to my old habits. It's a question of discipline, and I've always struggled with self-denial.

I gearing up to make another run at it, but I can't say I'm looking forward to it. I really do love all my vices.

10/21/10
Edmundo Braverman:

I was hoping you'd chime in, Captain.

I did the same thing you did when I lost the 20 pounds I talked about, buy my problem was that my cheat day became a cheat day-and-a-half, and then a cheat weekend, and then I was back to my old habits. It's a question of discipline, and I've always struggled with self-denial.

I gearing up to make another run at it, but I can't say I'm looking forward to it. I really do love all my vices.

I love my vices too - particularly the carbs and sugars. If you read Robb Wolf's article, you'll find the below excerpt, which really hit home for me:

Robb Wolf:

Not only do grains make you sick by raising insulin levels, messing up your fatty acid ratios (n-3/n-6), and irritating your gut, but they are also addictive. Grains, particularly the gluten-containing grains, contain molecules that fit into the opiate receptors in our brain. You know, the same receptors that work with heroin, morphine, and Vicodin? Most people can take or leave stuff like corn tortillas and rice. Suggest that people should perhaps forgo bread and pasta for their health and they will bury a butter knife in your forehead.

It's a real phenomenon - we are literally addicted to carbohydrates, and it's a tough habit to kick. Like other forms of addiction, you never really get over it - just as reformed smokers will always have a deep, dark craving for a cigarette, so too will Krispy Kreme donuts call to me for the rest of my days. But then I realize how much more I get laid at 185 than 220, and I decide it's worth it...

- Capt K -
"Prestige is like a powerful magnet that warps even your beliefs about what you enjoy. If you want to make ambitious people waste their time on errands, bait the hook with prestige." - Paul Graham

10/21/10
CaptK:

just as reformed smokers will always have a deep, dark craving for a cigarette, so too will Krispy Kreme donuts call to me for the rest of my days. But then I realize how much more I get laid at 185 than 220, and I decide it's worth it...

one of the best quotes ever haha

  • eyelikecheese
  •  10/21/10

Guys,

A really healthy thing to eat as a snack, or as a meal is.....

Cheese. I like to encourage mild cheddar. It's a little up there is calories and fat, but has no carbs-NOT ONE.And the feeling you get from eating a nice slice of cheese it truly eurphoric

10/21/10

background: I am 6'4 and 215 pounds - not like ALL muscle anymore (no longer time to go to the gym for 90 mins/day), but in no way chubby or with a belly... I no longer have a defined six-pack, but you can still see it shining through a bit on a good day, and I look big (in a good way) all over in the shoulders/arms (46 L).

I eat a ton of red meat - a ton. But you have to distinguish between different kinds or red meat. Eating hamburger meat is rarely, if ever, a good idea. Eating a porterhouse or ribeye is something you can do on occasion, but don't want to get in the habit of. Never eat bacon or sausages - or almost never. Don't eat spare ribs. Most other kinds of red meat, particularly lean steaks and pork chops, I think are good for you. Sirloin steak, when prepared properly, is still delicious (despite lacking the marbel of a ribeye or whatever), and you can always go with a fillet mignon. Red meats are not only loaded with protein, but have iron and natural creatin amongst other things you need to stay built.

Obviously working out is a given, and not only cardio, you absolutely need to do some muscle work. 3x per week 30 to 40 minutes, will a heavy emphasis on compound movements such as deadlifts, squats, bench press and pull ups, will keep the doctor away and keep you looking well shaped and make your suits fit right.

10/22/10
International Pymp:

I eat a ton of red meat - a ton. But you have to distinguish between different kinds or red meat. Eating hamburger meat is rarely, if ever, a good idea. Eating a porterhouse or ribeye is something you can do on occasion, but don't want to get in the habit of. Never eat bacon or sausages - or almost never. Don't eat spare ribs. Most other kinds of red meat, particularly lean steaks and pork chops, I think are good for you. Sirloin steak, when prepared properly, is still delicious (despite lacking the marbel of a ribeye or whatever), and you can always go with a fillet mignon. Red meats are not only loaded with protein, but have iron and natural creatin amongst other things you need to stay built.

Obviously working out is a given, and not only cardio, you absolutely need to do some muscle work. 3x per week 30 to 40 minutes, will a heavy emphasis on compound movements such as deadlifts, squats, bench press and pull ups, will keep the doctor away and keep you looking well shaped and make your suits fit right.

Completely agree, your point about types of protein/red meat is a very important distinction. Ground hamburger is terrible for you - go with buffalo instead if you want a burger. Ribeyes are delicious, but if you think you're being "healthy", just take a look at an uncooked ribeye - it's nearly all marbling/fat. Pork is great, so is lean red meat like filet or sirloin. And obviously chicken and fish are staples.

Also great advice on compound movements during workouts. A lot of people avoid pull ups, squats, etc because they hurt, but there's a reason they burn. The idea is to work out large muscle groups - when your muscles are torn down and rebuild, they release more testosterone, and that helps you build extra muscle, puts hair on your chest, and is generally beneficial for a lot of other reasons. Your biceps is a tiny muscle, you're not burning many calories or releasing much testosterone doing curls. Do an ass-to-ankles squat on the other hand, and you're activating your entire lower body, as well as your stabilizing core. Pain is weakness leaving the body.

- Capt K -
"Prestige is like a powerful magnet that warps even your beliefs about what you enjoy. If you want to make ambitious people waste their time on errands, bait the hook with prestige." - Paul Graham

10/22/10

Great Thread...Thanks everyone.

I must say that I would add that feeling tired of the time makes your brain wants to go for greasy/ easy food.

I have been crushed to the bone in the past 6 months and I have realised that after two or three days of really intense work, I tend to go for stuff I don't really like originally (KFC, McDonald, Pizza).

My sister who is a doctor, specialized in sleeping disorder, told me that it is pretty normal. The explanation to this phenomen relies on the fact that you are pushing your body so much that your brain intuitiveley goes for "rich food" because your mind/ brain reacts like it is a critical time / threat so it has to "make sure" it has the adequate nutrition for the coming days / hours.

10/22/10

I just wanted to add something I do know about meat.

When we talk about marbling, we're talking about fat. Marbling is just a nice way to describe the big vein of pure fat running through a piece of meat. It is a truly deft bit of marketing that has made this desirable.

Wild cattle do not have "marbling". Only factory farmed beef marbles, because the cattle are force fed grain, specifically corn. Not only is this diet unnatural, it leads to all kinds of diseases for which the cattle are treated with antibiotics. Those antibiotics are passed through to us when we eat the meat, and that's part of the reason we're seeing so many drug-resistant bugs these days.

If you go to the effort to find grass fed, grass finished beef you'll never go back. Some of the beef in stores is grass fed, but then it's shipped to a CAFO for finishing where it is fed corn to fatten it up. Grass fed, grass finished beef is much leaner and has much better flavor in my opinion.

However, due to the lower fat content, the cooking times for grass fed, grass finished beef are much shorter. If you try to cook it the same way as regular grocery store beef it will come out tough and dry.

My point is, it's worth the extra money to eat the good stuff, and you have a lot less to worry about when it comes to lean cuts when the whole cow is lean.

10/22/10

I dispute the notion that wall st is any healthier then the old days. Everyone always says the old days were "wild and crazy" but i have seen plenty of insane consumption including many three martini lunches, large steaks, drug use, etc. I actually think its probably worse now because the money is much bigger. On normal circumstances I dont even leave my desk for lunch and neither does anyone else because we are trying to make money, but especially in summer i will occasionally slip out for a lunch that starts innocently enough with a drink and ends 4 hours and many many drinks later. I often have stumbled out into the bright summer of an August day feeling no pain and trying to figure out how to tell my girlfriend why I was completely plastered and why whatever plans she made for tonight arent going to happen (at least not the way she had pictured them happening).

The thing is that you have to know which colleagues and especially which salespeople (since they are paying) will be discreet about it and not go crazy telling people. I have at least two or three counterparties that will leave the office on 5 minutes notice anytime after 7am to go get drunk and will not say a word. You've got to know who you can trust these days.

Anyway, on fitness I am in very good shape and I do it by working out 5 times a week and trying to avoid bread and pasta. thats all you need to do unless u r trying to be in the "top 1%"...im just going for "above average".

10/25/10

So wall street has been pussified? Let us eat and drink, for tomorrow we may die.

10/25/10

All this shit sounds pretty complicated. How about do a little cardio, lift some heavy weights, eat complex carbs and high quality cuts of meat. Get your veggies and eat fruit, don't smoke. Done.

As you get older start dialing in your diet more and more. When you are younger you can be a little less strict. Most people have natural body sizes and these will stay the same unless you have an intense work out regime.

As for the getting laid stuff, women like 2 things :

Confidence and Cash.

That is about it.

10/25/10
Anthony .:

All this shit sounds pretty complicated. How about do a little cardio, lift some heavy weights, eat complex carbs and high quality cuts of meat. Get your veggies and eat fruit, don't smoke. Done.

As you get older start dialing in your diet more and more. When you are younger you can be a little less strict. Most people have natural body sizes and these will stay the same unless you have an intense work out regime.

As for the getting laid stuff, women like 2 things :

Confidence and Cash.

That is about it.

Heh well actually one of my favorite things about my nutrition/exercise system is how simple it is.

  • No white carbohydrates, period
  • Concentrate on lean proteins and vegetables
  • Don't drink calories (except hard liquor)
  • Exercise at high intensity 2-3x per week

That's really all you've got to remember. Side note - people are actually divided on fruit, since it's got a lot of sugar and spikes blood glucose. Still, it's a far better dessert option than ice cream.

- Capt K -
"Prestige is like a powerful magnet that warps even your beliefs about what you enjoy. If you want to make ambitious people waste their time on errands, bait the hook with prestige." - Paul Graham

10/25/10

CaptK,

You are the second person in as many days to say that about fruit. Never in my wildest dreams did I think a day would come when eating an apple, banana or orange would become hazardous to my health.

10/25/10
Anthony .:

CaptK,
You are the second person in as many days to say that about fruit. Never in my wildest dreams did I think a day would come when eating an apple, banana or orange would become hazardous to my health.

Haha well fruit definitely isn't all bad, especially when you choose fruit over twinkies. As I said, I've heard both sides of the debate - there are obviously very beneficial nutrients in fruit (vitamin C, potassium, etc), so you need to make sure you get enough of those elsewhere if you cut it out. Personally, I eat it occasionally but not every day, and take a multivitamin.

All I can say is what worked for me, and the same old diet routine kept giving me the same old hungry and unhealthy results, so I tried something new. It's been working better than I'd ever expected for almost 2 years now...

- Capt K -
"Prestige is like a powerful magnet that warps even your beliefs about what you enjoy. If you want to make ambitious people waste their time on errands, bait the hook with prestige." - Paul Graham

10/25/10

There are a lot of really easy ways to cut a few hundred calories a day out of your diet.

Don't drink calories: Drink diet colas, use artificial sweetener and little cream in your coffee, and really only drink Skim Milk if you have to

Cut down on condiments: Next time you go to the Jewish deli, just get a little bit of mayo or mustard on the sandwich. I see people who put a thicker layer of mayo than the meat.

11/2/10

[Just got around to reading this, sorry for the late reply]

I got the chills when thinking about cutting beer for hard alcohol -- while I certainly am a fan of Sapphire and soda, I love my beer. I might actually try to give it up between now and Thanksgiving, but that may be an issue...

I'll second everything abotu CaptK's post. In college, I drank heavily about three nights per week, and it generally consisted of lots of beer. But I cut all white carbs (in fact, all non-vegetable and fruit carbs), and would generally only eat fruit pre-workout to get some natural sugar carbs in there for a bit of energy. I would also limit non-cheese dairy to post-workout and pre-sleep. During the day, I'd eat nuts, salads, and meat -- and that's about it. As much as I wanted, but I wouldn't eat any crap. Couple this with exercise until exhaustion 4-5 days a week (once you get in the routine and eat properly and take the appropriate steps for pre- and post-workout recovery, you can do this), and you're going to seeing some noticeable differences less than a month in.

Two most important pieces of advice: Cut the carbs (including liquid calories) and workout until exhaustion as often as your schedule/body allows it (and don't be a sissy -- if you're out of work at 9pm and did a workout yesterday and are a "little sore," suck it up -- who knows when you'll get out that early again).

  • eyelikecheese
  •  11/3/10

There is no way fruits are bad for you, except watermelon, and thats only marginally bad because so much of it is water. The sugar found in fruits is NATURAL sugar, so it makes no difference how many apples you eat, its all healthy. Now there are carbs present, but these are complex unprocessed carbs that take longer to turn into glucose, or sucrose whichever it is.

The best thing to do is not eat simple carbs, for as the term describes, they turn into sugar almost instantly (processed food)

Become your own chef. The upside is unlimited, and you know absolutely everything you put in your system is natural and unprocessed. People in this country are too damn lazy to get up and run, lift weights, and the supplement market prey's on this laziness. Get off the sofa, stop watching television of people that actually look good and go do something

And if you can work up the motivation, get Jack3d....it will do the job or I'll personally refund your money back

11/3/10
eyelikecheese:

There is no way fruits are bad for you, except watermelon, and thats only marginally bad because so much of it is water. The sugar found in fruits is NATURAL sugar, so it makes no difference how many apples you eat, its all healthy. Now there are carbs present, but these are complex unprocessed carbs that take longer to turn into glucose, or sucrose whichever it is.

The best thing to do is not eat simple carbs, for as the term describes, they turn into sugar almost instantly (processed food)

Become your own chef. The upside is unlimited, and you know absolutely everything you put in your system is natural and unprocessed. People in this country are too damn lazy to get up and run, lift weights, and the supplement market prey's on this laziness. Get off the sofa, stop watching television of people that actually look good and go do something

And if you can work up the motivation, get Jack3d....it will do the job or I'll personally refund your money back

Sorry cheeseman, but you're totally wrong here and clearly have no idea what you're talking about. Fruits are great sources of vitamins, minerals, phytochemicals, and fiber, but it is a nutritional fact that they are also high in fructose (a simple, monosaccharide sugar). There is no such thing as a "natural sugar" - chemically all fructose is the same in your bloodstream.

You can read a lot about how fructose is metabolized, but the summary is that it's not all just fine because it's a fruit sugar. Fructose has a lower glycemic index than sucrose (table sugar), but it's definitely a far cry from "it doesn't matter how many apples you eat, it's all healthy". There have been countless studies that show high fructose consumption is correlated with insulin resistance (diabetes), obesity, elevated "bad" cholesterol, liver disease and metabolic syndrome. There have also been studies that suggest fructose is even better at creating belly fat than glucose, the simplest sugar of all.

No, fruit is not killing you, and it's packed with tons of other nutrients. But the sugars in fruit are metabolized along with all the other sugars you take in. Sucrose, Fructose, and Glucose are all "natural sugars" in that they appear in fruits, vegetables, and as naturally occurring molecular building block inside our bodies. The trouble with sugars comes when we have too much of tehm, which we've gotten really good at doing thanks to our friend high fructose corn syrup. Thus the reason that if you're trying to reduce carbohydrates and sugars, some people cut out fruit and take a multivitamin instead.

- Capt K -
"Prestige is like a powerful magnet that warps even your beliefs about what you enjoy. If you want to make ambitious people waste their time on errands, bait the hook with prestige." - Paul Graham

  • eyelikecheese
  •  11/3/10

We can both throw our own facts out there, as there are literally hundreds of studies/articles that you can find contradicting opinions to back up your thesis. All I'm saying, is fruit is healthy. That is something we can agree on

My central theme is fruit is healthy, and people are lazy

3/1/11

Awesome thread. I've tried variations of a lot of diets but I've really come down to just keeping things simple:

  • Drink only water (I do drink beer when going out though)
  • Avoid sweets and desserts (empty carbs)
  • Can still eat meat but focus more on vegetables as the main course - when you do eat meat, go for chicken and fish and not a bad idea to skip meat out of a meal altogether every now and then
  • I'm also fine with whole wheat bread and pasta in moderation

To those who say to cut out or heavily reduce bread/pasta/other carbs - I won't be the first to make this point - but I spent 4 months in Italy and Italians eat a ton of carbs but seem to be healthy. I think it's more important to be active/exercise and eat moderate portions of organic food - one of the biggest problems in the US is that everything is over-processed.

On a different note, has anyone heard of metabolic typing and what are your thoughts? It's a theory that everyone has an ideal diet (ideal proportions of carbs/fat vs. proteins) based on their genetic make-up and ancestry. And if you think about it, up until recently, most countries and cultures stuck to a traditional diet that had evolved over many generations. Only in America did you get the melting pot that has made this country great...but also made people lose sight of traditional diets. It's interesting stuff...and it could actually explain why Italians can stay skinny on their cuisine while that certainly wouldn't work for some other people.

7/6/13

People who workout hardcore will probably have something to say about Crossfit, but for those with limited time it is truly the best all around workout one can get. Additionally, you don't have to think about or create a plan, just go to the website www.crossfit.com in the morning and your workout is posted. Just follow that plan and you will be stronger, more agile and healthier in no time. I will say if you haven't exercised for awhile the workouts will probably feel like death hitting in you the face but thats alright, just keep at it for two weeks and it will pass. As far as diets are concerned I found the Greek/Turkish diet to be the best; fresh fruits and vegetables, bread, tea, yogurt, cheese, honey, lamb, fish and chicken is perfect. You never really crave anything and have a well balanced diet.


"I am always saying "Glad to've met you" to somebody I'm not at all glad I met. If you want to stay alive, you have to say that stuff, though."
-- J.D. Salinger, The Catcher in the Rye

7/6/13

For me the hardest part is cutting out my nightly drinking. I love having a good craft beer or a glass of wine while I watch TV before bed. The actual eating less part itself doesn't bother me that much, I typically ate the same stuff I was eating anyway, just less of it. Monitoring your calories with myfitnesspal app goes a long way, that app is amazing btw it has almost any food in it and you can see your caloric intake for the day broken down. I was on a good streak for 2 months before spring break, lost 20 pounds eating 1800 calories a day but unfortantely gained most of it back.

7/6/13

All things nutrition related could take decades to type. At the eod it all boils down to calories in/out- depending on your goals you'll want to run a deficit/maintenance/surplus for cut/maintain/bulk respectively.

All the small things really add up so cutting sodium, carbs and such will bring results. Granted you want to do all this gradually, or your gains will eventually reverse when you relapse into a shotty diet lifestyle. It's unbelievably how you can manipulate your body into transforming when you reengage muscle memory

I'm on the pursuit of happiness and I know everything that shine ain't always gonna be gold. I'll be fine once I get it

7/6/13

Based on the dinner post WSO conference it is proven that Wall Street's eating habits have not changed.

Porterhouse for the win (fuck the garlic)

7/6/13

Intermittent fasting works wonders. Highly recommend it. I hate going to bed hungry and it solves that. Go to leangains.com.

7/6/13

Been doing it for a couple months now ever since reading Man 2.0 Engineering the Alpha. I've lost about 30 pounds and I'm at the lowest weight I've been in 10 years. Totally sold on intermittent fasting and the hormonal advantages of it. That and getting plenty of sleep, which is something I never did before, but sleep kills cortisol and cortisol is where belly fat comes from.

7/6/13

I prefer to drink my meals on the rocks. Booze really is the cornerstone to any healthy mental state.

My drinkin' problem left today, she packed up all her bags and walked away.

7/6/13

Well today at work the company decided to buy a ton of Papa John's. True American excess.

7/6/13

Edmundo Braverman:

Been doing it for a couple months now ever since reading Man 2.0 Engineering the Alpha. I've lost about 30 pounds and I'm at the lowest weight I've been in 10 years. Totally sold on intermittent fasting and the hormonal advantages of it. That and getting plenty of sleep, which is something I never did before, but sleep kills cortisol and cortisol is where belly fat comes from.

Great to hear Eddie! I've been on Intermittent Fasting for 3 weeks now and have been seeing some results (~1 lb/week). The abs are really showing but prograss has been stalling this week due to 5 hours of sleep days and drinking with some long lost friends. Time to get 7 hours a night and I'll be on my way to 10% body fat.

I can never become a vegetarian. Eating soy for most of my life has given me manboobs even though I have been hitting iron for 7 years.

7/7/13

Is the culture of gluttony still prevalent - from what I've seen, yes. It's just the nature of the beast (or the relatively wealthy). Per my observations with my limited sample size, at least 50% of the MDs and Partners are heavily overweight.

On the subject of food consumption, I have to disagree with the six small meals a day theory. There was a point in time in which I was so hardcore about having six small meals per day that I'd set the alarm on my phone to remind myself to eat at set intervals. I did that for two years and it almost ruined my life - it affects your lifestyle, your ability to make plans with friends and it drives your mind into OCD insanity.

Then I discovered leangains.com and IF (Intermittent Fasting). People like to use the word "IF Diet", but frankly I hate the word "diet". IF is not a diet, it's a lifestyle. In a nutshell, the protocol is this:

1) You eat from 12pm - 8pm (8 hour feeding window).
2) You don't eat anything, or fast, from 8pm - 12pm next day (16 hour fasting window).

Then there's the whole topic on when to workout and whether you should workout fasted or eat before hand. What I found works for me, is that I wakeup at 6:30am, take a caffeine pill and drink some BCAAs (Branch Chain Amino Acids, I use Scivation Xtend powder), then workout from 7am-8am. Then I drink another 10g of BCAAs at 10:30am, and I start my first meal at noon (lunch).

Some people say IF is a broscience and "omg look at those bodybuilders they all eat 6 small meals a day and get ripped". Well, we're in the finance world. We don't have the luxury to workout whenever we want to and eat whenever we want to and make our own healthy, nutritious meals whenever we want to. Give it a try, it takes your mind off of food and I'm in superb shape going into my third year of IF.

Also, weight loss and getting fit is simply calories in

1) Eat healthy, nutrient dense foods
2) Don't low-carb your diet, eat most of your carbs in your first meal when you break your fasting, and taper it off throughout the day
3) Do not eat late at night. Do not eat late at night. Do not eat late at night and especially not before bed.
4) Have a good workout plan that involves 3 days of weights with compound movements and 2 days of cardio.

7/7/13

Clearly I should have read all the previous replies and noted "IF" before posting my one-hundred cents. :)

7/7/13

Romaniello adds that if you really want to kick the fasting up a notch, you should have an EPIC cheat day on Sunday (like literally go apeshit and eat anything you want in any quantity) and then not eat again until your regularly scheduled breakfast on Tuesday. So like a 36 hour fast.

7/8/13

I am also a big fan of intermittent fasting...on most days i try to take in all my calories between noon and 8pm so i have 16hrs of fast each day. i have found it to be a much easier plan to stick to rather then the many small meals idea which leaves very little margin for error. once you have trained your body not to expect meals at regular intervals it becomes much easier to eat when you want and not give in to cravings. generally i eat lunch at noon, workout at 3pm followed by a small meal and then an 8pm well-sized dinner.

7/8/13

@Bondarb I know you watched that Anderson Silva-Chris Weidman bout the other night. I have a new favorite UFC moment. Just incredible.

7/8/13

Edmundo Braverman:

@Bondarb I know you watched that Anderson Silva-Chris Weidman bout the other night. I have a new favorite UFC moment. Just incredible.

i did watch it and I it was a good one for sure...weidman is also a long island native from baldwin high school which made me enjoy it even more.

7/8/13

I'm still speechless. Silva took up so much space inside Weidman's head that he should have been paying rent. I wouldn't dare call it a lucky punch, because nothing about the way Weidman got there in the first place was lucky, but damn. One minute Silva was owning him and forcing him into a fight he couldn't win, and the next minute it was lights out for Silva. You see the way his eyes rolled back in his head? Jesus.

7/8/13

I think the biggest thing people forget when they attribute their weight loss to cutting out carbs, is how many fewer total calories they were consuming. I'm not saying that cutting carbs doesn't provide other benifits as well, just that most people tend to attribute all of their weight loss to cutting out carbs when they also dropped their calories as well. At the end of the day it really is calories in

IF is the easiest lifestyle to follow for me (if i eat in the morning I eat all day) and avoiding empty calories helps a lot too. While cutting carbs definitely would help reduce your calories and might provide other benifits, I can't imagine a world where I could never eat a sandwich or bowl of pasta.

7/8/13

Intermittent fasting is incredible. More energy and just generally feel better. First week adjusting to it sucks but then you reap the rewards.

7/9/13

Silva is such a clown,... I couldn't be happier to see that moron go down to an American

9/6/14

Metal. Music. Life. www.headofmetal.com

9/6/14

Those who can, do. Those who can't, post threads about how to do it on WSO.

9/7/14
9/8/14
1/9/16
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