I'm working with a few headhunters for quant positions. I'm pretty frustrated with one of them, and I no longer want to work with this person. If I stop working with them, is it still possible to interview at the firm they introduced me at?
Story:
This person asks me the same question repeatedly multiple times a week. They've also been trying to rush me to interview for this paticularly position ASAP, claiming how there's only a single position available, and that they have X number of candidates in the final round already. I mean I spoke with the hiring manager who told me this isn't true. When I told the headhunter what the hiring manager told me, the headhunter insinuated that the hiring manager is wrong and that there is indeed one position available. I seriously feel like I'm dealing with a poor man's car salesman here, and I no longer want to work through them.
This isn't just a one time occurrence. This has happened 5+ times by email and phone in only the past 10 days.
of course you can ghost the headhunter....their fee is paid by the hiring firm...not the potential future employee....and whatever contract they have with the employer is really none of your business...so go ahead and ghost them, and ask the employer to contact you directly going forward, and that you don't want to have any contact with the headhunter going forward.
Thanks - I was actually looking for this info as well
From my understanding once your name is submitted by the HH they get paid regardless. So to an extent they probably don't care. It would be a stupid business model for them if they could submit a name and then be side stepped.
*edit - In past experiences if I have a contact at the firm, either director or friend of friend, I'll gently tell/ask the HH if I can network directly. They never mind and are typically happy. Ultimately they want you placed and don't care how it happens.
Then why did you go through a HH at all instead of directly approaching your contact?
Seeing as though you work at a HF, you know how the game works, the funds hire HHs and don't really post the job widely thus its impossible to front run like you've said. The HH hits you up and tells you the fund. At that point cross reference network on linkedin see if commonality, in best case scenarios a really good connection, and take it from there. Of course if you learn about the job without the HH even better, use network directly.
Which HH firm was ok with that? I, unfortunately, have not had that positive experience you’ve had with headhunters
Offhand memory, Oxbridge, Glocap, CarterPierce
What happens if the HH reaches out to you, but there is also a direct application to the company possible? Is there possibility of higher pay if you go through the direct application as the HH doesn't get their fee?
I think possible. Likely impossible to generalize. Also likelihood of higher chance of getting the offer but again, impossible to generalize.
I'm not 100% certain, but my understanding is once a HH reaches out to you you're tagged to a carve out list and they get paid regardless. I don't believe you'd get paid more without a HH - kinda a weird negotiating tactic. The fee is not really a huge cost to a decent sized fund and I think they are just accustomed to the process.. If you had a direct referral / found out about the job outside the HH and you were basically tied so to speak with another candidate they might pick you to save the money, but ultimately a fund is going to pick the best candidate, whether that is inside or outside of the HH process. Also, the HH will be in the ear of the firm so there will be that battle too.
A buddy of mine applied to a PE role via a HH and also had a contact refer him to the position. Since the contact referral landed in the inbox before the HH did the HH does not get the fee. This likely may not be industry norm, and is an anecdotal example from my end, but thought it was interesting. Not totally sure I agree with the fund for trying to get around the fee since its just an associate position, but it is what it is.
For sure, I doubt there are hard rules, depends on the contract, relationship with HH, willingness to burn bridges etc. For the applicant perspective, I say do whatever it takes to get the job you want.
Yeah it’s in your best interest to do whatever is best for you. I’m surprised that HHs have been ok with you reaching out to your network at the funds, unless it’s strictly after they’ve introduced your resume with the fund. I think that unless there’s an exclusive hard mandate where the HH gets paid regardless (some searches are like that) then it’s really at the funds discretion as to who to pay and be good about it. Because it’s impossible to prove that the fund wasn’t in contact with you beforehand or got it from another headhunter etc. once they get your profile, your contact info may be blurred out by some HHs but like...in the HF land...there’s Bloomberg terminals where they could chat and continue the conversation offline or whatever if they really want to. Or you could be proactive and email them using your personal email or whatever as soon as you hear from the HH what the fund that is hiring is. It’s all gentleman’s agreements at the end of the day I feel. I don’t think as soon as the HH reaches out to you, automatically you’re their intro because what if you had known about the fund beforehand etc.
I used to try and do right by HHs and only let one firm introduce me to a fund but then I realized I don’t care how I get the intro and when there’s searches that multiple people have mandates on, ill see if I get any traction with one and if not I’ll use another and even reach out direct if it makes sense. Did that with one of my processes where a HH said they introduced me to a fund and never heard back and then 7 months later a different HH for the same fund and I applied through them and they were super keen to meet etc. etc. Elliott is one example of this where 5 HHs have approached me about them over the span of 10 months and I said yes to each one and only the 5th one came back and said they wanted to meet. My resume had not changed a single bit in that time...only difference was the HH that I could gather.
I’d bite my tongue and not burn the headhunter bridge. He got you in the room, you may need him again in the future and maybe from the other side of the table as well
From my experience most Quant recruiters are indeed some version of a shady used car salesman. Fortunately after a while you will someone belonging to the 10 percent of them who are actually useful.
I think the HH will be paid whether you continue going though him or not. To avoid introducing noise in the hiring process I would continue working with them on this particular opportunity, but of course stop working with him after. Make it clear that he must not send your CV anywhere else and ask him to fully disclose where he sent your CV if you think this might be an issue.
If it is really unbearable working with the HH you could tell the hiring manager, HR or whoever's your contact at the firm to contact you directly for making appointments for interviews, negotiations etc. As someone who is hiring I much prefer directly talking to the candidate anyway
lol, this is either selby jennings, alexander chapman, or westbourne partners
ah the big trifecta of shit
Especially Selby Jennings. The most used car salesman and “read off a script” people you will ever encounter. I don’t think they know what reputation means lol
It's not AC. I actually like AC and have had a pleasant experience with Michael. Are you implying Michael at AC or another headhunter there? I think he's the only US quant HH from AC.
The other firm I've worked with is Options Group. I've spoken to them since early 2019, and no complaints.
Don't really feel comfortable disclosing the one I'm complaining about right now. I've never heard of westbourne, but I will say that every person I've spoken with at Selby (4+ of them) has made me regret taking the call.
I know numerous people who’ve had their own issues with Options Group and numerous more (myself included) who’ve had their issues with Mercury so I’d add them to the list. Never worked with those other 3 though so perhaps they are one rung higher.
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