To all VPs - please help
To all VPs out there, I’m currently working with an associate that does not work, review or provide any guidance whatsoever. Instead, my work gets taken and sent straight to the senior deal team members. If there is a mistake I get thrown under the bus, and if it is good work, he tries to get all the praise. Loves to call me out all the time too for any little mistake. Anyways, I feel like quitting because the VP I work with always sides with associate too. Advice?
How is he able to call you out for minor mistakes if he doesn’t review your work?
As in the VP or someone else will catch it and then he’ll walk over to my desk
If you’re an analyst 2 with a good rep put him or her on blast but otherwise you kinda just eat shit as a analyst 1
Do you know why the associate is being a dick? Have you spoken to them about it at all? Asked them questions and done walk throughs before submitting work?
If they just suck, go up to the VP and have a discussion with them. Don't complain or make it weird, just ask them to review the work with you. If they ask why, just say that you're not getting much guidance and want to learn.
The move here is to try to cut the associate out, but you need to be strategic about it.
Whoever doesn’t contribute should be found out. This messed up dawg…there has to be some more complex work that senior team would have questions about and the guy wouldn’t be able to answer?
Thank you everyone. He is not liked by a single junior member of the team but has established a good relation with VPs and MDs. He is a good speaker and knows how to finesse office politics I guess. He is a smart guy just so lazy. It’s kind of hard to go straight to my VP still since they would literally go play golf or hit the range and I’m stuck working by myself on a model or presentation and get help from those at the analyst level. Not going to lie, and not to sound arrogant, but I am basically running the show for the deal. I’ve never been put out of my comfort zone. Wrapping up last few months of my first year and already handling buyer calls, even walking them through the CIM, model, etc. What’s crazy to is I handled the EL (of course VP helped with this), I process NDAs (shouldn’t this be the associates duty??), so basically I do everything and they just review on their phone and give me comments that way…I just don’t know what to do anymore. What’s worse is they sometimes exclude me from calls when my MD is on but then if they don’t know a question would tell me to come to their desks…i feel like they just both scheme together but I don’t think this is right as I’ve had pulled ~1-2 all nighters a week having to learn myself and then apply it to get the actual work done…
Thank you everyone. He is not liked by a single junior member of the team but has established a good relation with VPs and MDs. He is a good speaker and knows how to finesse office politics I guess. He is a smart guy just so lazy. It’s kind of hard to go straight to my VP still since they would literally go play golf or hit the range and I’m stuck working by myself on a model or presentation and get help from those at the analyst level. Not going to lie, and not to sound arrogant, but I am basically running the show for the deal. I’ve never been put out of my comfort zone. Wrapping up last few months of my first year and already handling buyer calls, even walking them through the CIM, model, etc. What’s crazy to is I handled the EL (of course VP helped with this), I process NDAs (shouldn’t this be the associates duty??), so basically I do everything and they just review on their phone and give me comments that way…I just don’t know what to do anymore. What’s worse is they sometimes exclude me from calls when my MD is on but then if they don’t know a question would tell me to come to their desks…i feel like they just both scheme together but I don’t think this is right as I’ve had pulled ~1-2 all nighters a week having to learn myself and then apply it to get the actual work done…
Thank you everyone. He is not liked by a single junior member of the team but has established a good relation with VPs and MDs. He is a good speaker and knows how to finesse office politics I guess. He is a smart guy just so lazy. It’s kind of hard to go straight to my VP still since they would literally go play golf or hit the range and I’m stuck working by myself on a model or presentation and get help from those at the analyst level. Not going to lie, and not to sound arrogant, but I am basically running the show for the deal. I’ve never been put out of my comfort zone. Wrapping up last few months of my first year and already handling buyer calls, even walking them through the CIM, model, etc. What’s crazy to is I handled the EL (of course VP helped with this), I process NDAs (shouldn’t this be the associates duty??), so basically I do everything and they just review on their phone and give me comments that way…I just don’t know what to do anymore. What’s worse is they sometimes exclude me from calls when my MD is on but then if they don’t know a question would tell me to come to their desks…i feel like they just both scheme together but I don’t think this is right as I’ve had pulled ~1-2 all nighters a week having to learn myself and then apply it to get the actual work done…
The thing is- as shitty and unfair as it is- it’s actually to your advantage. With other people’s laziness and arrogance comes great opportunity for those of us who are go-getters. Just ignore it. You can’t change his actions but you can continue to show up and outshine him. You may think people don’t know but it always gets found out. Keep working hard and getting the experience and you’ll come out on top. People aren’t stupid- we know when someone is lazy or entitled and doesn’t step up.
Man this sounds nuts.. you should say something or very subtly start dropping hints eg love working with Jack he lets me run (insert everything you've been doing) it's great he trusts me to run this directly without review and my progress has accelerated. You can obviously be more pointed but in a super even keeled way
My plan is to let it be grind it out and close this 1 high profile transaction and then go to PE even before my 2 years as that’s ultimately where I want to be. Not being arrogant and cocky but I feel very comfortable now talking to seniors / clients (CFO of client calls me on direct line to go through model), PE associates call me instead of that associate I work with. Even though these are some dark times (have had no weekends in 2022; lost 40lbs, cried a few times and yelled to myself), I’ve changed my mindset for the past month and used it as motivation instead. Hope any analyst reading this does the same.
If you're crying something needs to be done. I cried once and it was due to sleep deprivation during a pretty hellish period. If it's happening multiple times something is very wrong, you need to take it up with the VP since Associate sounds like fuck all help. That's also some pretty huge weight loss, most put on weight in their first year thinking their Seamless budget is a target to be hit.
If speaking directly with the VP doesn't change things, then I'd see if there's a staffer further up the chain you can speak with. If you're only staying there for 2 years maintaining relationships with these 2 isn't that important. Hope it improves, this industry is shit enough what crap like this happening.
Sounds like a shit VP and Associate.
When I was a VP, and I still do it as a director, I would review outputs. If there were stupid or obvious mistakes then I'd ask the associate if he/she had actually reviewed it.
It's then a check mate - they either say yes and admit they can't do a simple work check, or they say No and admit to not doing their job.
I did this and the associates soon realised that they had to actually check work otherwise I'd come down on them like a tonne of bricks.
Thanks everyone. Only reason I’m still apart of this group is because of how historically analyst have placed in PE. Horrible culture at a top bank. I’ve seen so many other analysts this year who deserved as1 told they are not good enough. I feel like they are better than our current associates especially the one I mentioned. Our group just wants to cut costs but they cut the wrong people and still expect same amount of work to be done. Ridiculous.
Not to be mean but think I wish I can cut both them out and wish I got their salaries / bonuses too. IB comp is just not fair sometimes…
What bank?
As a third year starting to play up and be staffed as an associate, errors really should be fall on the associate. It’s their job to review your work and catch errors. That’s why I’ve been spending admittedly way too long checking my A1’s work, because the errors fall on me. Probably worth having a conversation with your talent manager about.
Where did your associate and VP get their MBAs?
Bank is BB (GS, JPM, MS). VPs associates have both not gotten MBAs but have graded with BA at Ivey league schools…
These crying posts never make any sense to me at all.
Let me explain.
I’m a director now. But there are still plenty of important deals where there is a group head or MD above me.
Let’s say we want to make a deck for some issue. The MD will tell me what he wants and I will sketch out the deck and with the help of a vp and associate and analyst, we will get the MD a draft.
The MD will then give comments and ask for a new draft, let’s say in a day. The next day of there are mistakes, he doesn’t care who the vp or associate or analyst is. He comes to me and gets mad.
And then my anger or annoyance or dissatisfaction would go to the VP.
Do you see my point? If there is a mistake, it’s on the person below you to take the responsibility or culpability, not the lowest guy.
So when there is a mistake in your example, how are you ever thrown under the bus? If a comp is wrong, it’s somewhat your fault but it’s also the associates fault for being awful at reviewing right?
That’s why these crying posts never make sense to me. We all work in finance and know how it is. I’ve never seen a senior person or vp come down on the analyst and not care the associate doesn’t review properly.
So what’s the real story here, what detail are you leaving out?
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