Am I really adding value to my life?

These last few months have been weird. I mean, I have a perfect GPA, make $12/hour at my part time job, have no expenses (CC is free), been networking (have met and talked to some amazing people in the industry) and will be transferring to the school of my choice next year which I'm excited about. I have my mind set on what I want to do and have been staying in touch with people who have given me invaluable advice.

I've been trading lately in a speculative fashion. It's been a huge swing. I've had days where I have made $500 in a single trade in one sitting, to being wiped out the next day. I remember making my first $250 on an earnings report and it felt amazing, I thought then and there I could become the 1-10% of traders who are consistently profiting and can live of it. I constantly work to make money, I have no interests besides making money. I really push myself to work a lot of hours as a student just to add more to my checking account and in a non-bragging way, I'm positive no college kid has as much as me which is the only reason I'm confident in this whole thing.

I research so much about equities and options, how to study chart patterns and hours on end just try to learn something new. I've learned a lot about trading (and investing) but is sitting in front of a screen trying to just squeeze out more and more money really valuable at my age? Most of my pals have moved on and they are having the times of their lives socially. I'm here trying to just make money and focus on my career and I just started school. Am I doing it right? Is it weird to contact people for advice on investment banking when I'm only a Freshman?

I feel like I should be learning how to start a business, how to open a website that adds value. But all I care about it making money. All I care about is how I will make money the next day. If I have a bad day in the market it doesn't affect me, I just really work hard to make it back and it works out. But it's just a constant cycle that I'm questioning.

Before I started trading, many people told me it was an empty pursuit and no matter how much you make, you will hate yourself one way or the other. I'm starting to see what they mean now

13 Comments
 
Best Response

On the assumption this isn't trolling I'll bite.

Great you found out you like it and its not for you. Lots of people do and unfortunately, lots of them figure it out too late. You seem smart, you have the prerogative of being able to try out different paths now and pursue them.

Having said that, because you dont find it as interesting or rewarding it doesnt mean others dont too and are just faking. I'm sure some do but it has been my experience that the vast majority of people in IB and buy-side passionately want to be working in these indstries. Thats why they tolerate the hard demands, because while theyre in there they (not always obviously) know they are adding value to their world/life. The ones who cant say this are the ones who look to get out ASAP, the ones that can stick around. Heck IB guys don't even make nearly as much money as they are perceived to and if youre in it just for the money youre gonna hate your life.

 

Thanks for the response.

On a specific note, I am pretty passionate about trading which is why I put a lot of time into it. I personally would love to work in S&T or PT but I know these are dying fields and are catered towards the math-quant people which isn't my thing exactly. That's why I'm pretty much gunning for IB. I don't want to come off as entitled but with certain sectors I really research into and buy into, maybe that could roll into "I want to work in IB covering a certain industry." I can see myself being very passionate about that but I know this industry is really though to get into and I'll take what I can get.

Array
 
"Pump And Dump" These last few months have been weird. I mean, I have a perfect GPA, make $12/hour at my part time job, have no expenses (CC is free), been networking (have met and talked to some amazing people in the industry) and will be transferring to the school of my choice next year which I'm excited about. I have my mind set on what I want to do and have been staying in touch with people who have given me invaluable advice.

I've been trading lately in a speculative fashion. It's been a huge swing. I've had days where I have made $500 in a single trade in one sitting, to being wiped out the next day. I remember making my first $250 on an earnings report and it felt amazing, I thought then and there I could become the 1-10% of traders who are consistently profiting and can live of it. I constantly work to make money, I have no interests besides making money. I really push myself to work a lot of hours as a student just to add more to my checking account and in a non-bragging way, I'm positive no college kid has as much as me which is the only reason I'm confident in this whole thing.

I research so much about equities and options, how to study chart patterns and hours on end just try to learn something new. I've learned a lot about trading (and investing) but is sitting in front of a screen trying to just squeeze out more and more money really valuable at my age? Most of my pals have moved on and they are having the times of their lives socially. I'm here trying to just make money and focus on my career and I just started school. Am I doing it right? Is it weird to contact people for advice on investment banking when I'm only a Freshman?

I feel like I should be learning how to start a business, how to open a website that adds value. But all I care about it making money. All I care about is how I will make money the next day. If I have a bad day in the market it doesn't affect me, I just really work hard to make it back and it works out. But it's just a constant cycle that I'm questioning.

Before I started trading, many people told me it was an empty pursuit and no matter how much you make, you will hate yourself one way or the other. I'm starting to see what they mean now

I think your priorities should be: a) Maintaining a high GPA b) Getting good internships c) Securing that dream job you want

Trading could be a time zapper, money zapper, and stressor if you're not careful. Focus on your studies.

Also, maintaining a perfect GPA isn't that hard over a three month period. If you haven't dropped or scaled back in trading before the advanced classes hit (Junior/Senior year), its going to be a lot to take on and still get all As.

"If you always put limits on everything you do, physical or anything else, it will spread into your work and into your life. There are no limits. There are only plateaus, and you must not stay there, you must go beyond them." - Bruce Lee
 

For sure. Once those higher level finance and math classes start rolling I'll have no time to trade anymore, have seen it happen to my other pals.

For internships, I have been networking quite a bit and applying everywhere, no luck yet but I think I will have something lined up this Summer. I know where I'm transferring to next year will definitely set me up well if I utilize everything they offer.

Array
 
"Pump And Dump" For sure. Once those higher level finance and math classes start rolling I'll have no time to trade anymore, have seen it happen to my other pals.

Oh ok cool

"If you always put limits on everything you do, physical or anything else, it will spread into your work and into your life. There are no limits. There are only plateaus, and you must not stay there, you must go beyond them." - Bruce Lee
 

Dude sounds like you should just stop trading. Use the mass amount of time youll have free to work on other areas of your life and yeah maybe have a bit more fun you think youre missing out on. There's no great utility to trading hardcore at college, especially if youre thinking IB. Sure, do a bit of trading, but do it in a way that makes you feel good as well. At uni I only made trades when i came across interesting ideas and had a great time researching them and then thought id test my hypotheses and made trades. Not to make money and definitely not to a level where it was draining my life and making me sacrifice other much more important things like health (physical, social, mental) and other interests/pursuits.

Make your priorities clear and if things aren't helping you be in line with those and develop then they ain't productive, which it sounds like all your trading is starting to become.

Sorry if I sounded a bit harsh, you said in your OP that all you cared about was making money and that definitely is not a reason to do trading or anything else. Do things you enjoy or which you know will get you doing things you enjoy.You should look into IB and ER, might be what youre after rather than trading especially if youre as you say not a math/quant guy.

EDIT: on the note of starting a business. Be careful. It can be a great experience but it can also be just as much of an unproductive time and money waster and unnecessary stress.

 

If you want IB what you're doing won't hurt, but they're are definitely things you can do to better prepare for recruiting and adding depth to your resume. The truth is that some jobs and extracurriculars matter and look better than others, so unless the part-time job is something that is in anyway related, it's only going to look like a time commitment, will not help you meet the right people, and may be tough to really talk about in an interview or networking. Unlikely to get anything in IB after your freshman summer unless you're well connected or lucky, look for other relevant opportunities. Don't pigeonhole your self to an industry group, not really helpful.

Doing well academically in HS and in your case CC is not indicative of doing well at a target or semi target. Plenty of people either are burnt out or just not good enough when they make the jump, it may just be too much. Remember, you're competing with a lot of people who went to targets, not CCs, and got very high grades there.

Also, think about how you tell your story and how you portray yourself. Saying you think you could be in the top 10% of traders is ridiculous before you even hit a bear market. Extremely few people can dick around and make it in high finance, so while you think you work hard, know that everyone else did too and don't come off as bragging about it comes off as entitled and shows a lack of self-awareness.

 

Thanks for the advice. My part time job isn't finance related, I'm pretty close to having something lined up for next Summer which is finance related, that should help I think.

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Definitely don’t go into your OCR first rounds next fall saying stuff like “I have no interests besides making money” haha I mean I’m all for securing the bag and would probably think you’re super funny if you said that to me, but it’s probably not going to fly with folks, for the most part. You seem fairly diligent and determined; you’ll be okay. Good luck with everything!

 

Haha I hear ya on that man. Honestly I wouldn't even talk about my trading/investing as work experience. More or less a hobby, from what I've read it's not very useful in IB. Maybe ER or AM, but even then that's questionable.

Array
 

I may be completely wrong in this assessment, but here's my take. I think you're using trading / researching / learning as a means to distract yourself from the fact that you're depressed instead of addressing and solving whatever is wrong in your life. You're isolating yourself and justifying it by spending your time buried in equity research reports, financial statements, books and charts -- being productive as an excuse for wanting to avoid things. It helps you feel better about yourself to be knowledgeable about stocks and make money at it because other people your age that you compare yourself to or envy can't ("no college kid has as much as me", which isn't true). I've seen this before with a fraternity brother and my actual brother who would spend all day and even weekends in their room looking at stocks. I could go on but I'll stop there.

That wasn't meant to belittle you in anyway, so many college students suffer from depression and experience it in different ways. Many are unaware that they are depressed because they do what I think you're doing and hide it from themselves in various ways. So if there's any truth to this, you should take some steps to address the root causes of the depression and work on yourself instead of your P&L. Social skills are absolutely paramount to being successful in finance, even at an analyst level, so you don't want to deprive yourself of learning them during your formative years.

If I was completely wrong, then I'll just say this. You're wasting your time since the real, useful, and important knowledge can only be gained from first-hand work experience. So just have fun with it for now because everything you're teaching yourself will be thrown out the window once you step onto a real trading floor upon graduation.

 

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