I'm a VP at a BB in NYC and I swear I've never seen such low caliber Associates and Analysts at any previous bank I've worked at. Not sure if it's post-covid lack of training, diversity hiring, lower standards, or all of the above. But these kids are seriously awful. They don't know basic finance, work is full of mistakes, they come to office late, everything needs to be spelled out for them like they are 5 years old. I literally don't understand how we've hired such unqualified people. Our MDs give a lot of work and these kids literally can't get anything done without handholding. There are a couple of exceptions but for the most part all around terrible hires. I don't even have unreasonably high expectations because I started as an Analyst myself and I know how it is starting out, but god damn what happened?
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All the alumni from my school I talk to are top bucket or near top bucket. Maybe too much hiring from schools that just don't have the chops.
I would like to agree but based on my experience this isn’t true. It’s mostly about how much effort you are willing to put into learning the job.
Enjoy the fruits of gender quotas in a world where constructive feedback gets you framed as a misogynist. Besides, if female A&A know that they will get promoted regardless then they don’t have much incentive to learn quicker.
Couldn't care less about race or gender if they successfully passed the interviews. But they get offers over people who crushed the interviews, to fill quotas.
Exactly my point. You will notice this trend in promotions as well.
Dumb question, but what is A&A
Analyst to associate
This is such a based take. If you feel so insecure about your female colleagues and peers that you feel the need to anonymously bash them *as a whole* on a forum, you need to seriously look within yourself and get some therapy. Women bankers work *so much harder* than men to get less respect.
I’m not saying the average quality of juniors hasn’t gone down (I’m A2A myself, I’ve seen it), but it definitely is the result of COVID laxness and Gen Z tendencies, it has nothing to do with gender
Hi- not in the industry just yet (sophomore starting to recruit), but I'd like to know how VP's and MD's feel about just pushing to fire what i'd think to be dead weight. I feel like there are a lot of students who quite frankly don't know what hard work is and once they get to the role they get absolutely destroyed.
Do MD's and VP's not have that much control as to who receives a full time offer?
We are basically limited to hiring from the summer analyst/associate classes. So even the mediocre hires get offers. There's effectively no separate full-time recruiting. And the summer classes are incredibly diverse by design, it's not merit based anymore and MDs are huge pussies that don't say anything. It's the VPs / Directors who have to deal with the shitty resources at the end of the day.
I'm sure D/MD (or even senior VPs) can look to hire outside of summer intern class to take in more competent analyst / associates (that might want to come back to banking). It's just matter of office power
Good ones are all at EB
Was at BB and agree with this, cream of the crop are at EB
A simple solution to this problem:
start paying more
.
wut even lol
Not just you. We were just directed today by our HR (aka "talent management") force that at least half of our MBA summer associates have to fall into the DEI category (which is quite broad to be honest at our BB, sure the same is true with other BBs/EBs). Quite sad to be exposed to how recruiting actually works once you're inside
What a coindicence, same thing happened to our team. We narrowed it down to about 15 people that we wanted to interview for our group (maybe 4 were diversity), but then HR intervened and forced us to bump up those numbers. Ended up inviting really lame diversity students and had to push out really strong candidates that just didn't fit into any of the diversity buckets (all of them internationals by the way)
Can confirm. Compared to when i was an analyst, VPs and directors are much more hands on now with materials (now a junior VP)
.
Very simply they don't have the skills to do basic work. Complex financial modeling? Forget about it.
Financial modeling isn't that difficult especially if you're given templates to simply adjust. It could be true your new analysts definitely suck.
Think some of it is a function of relatively anemic deal flow over past few years
More handholding required than I prefer with the recent hires but have also seen a strong response to positive motivation. Things like going to bat for them on reviews, pushing back on stupid deadlines etc. Which I don't mind, doesn't hurt to show appreciation for people who work hard. Sometimes it sucks spending more of your limited time managing down but it is what it is.
Part of me is also like when I was coming up you worked because it was a job and they paid you and that was the motivation. I guess times are different now, which is totally cool. Would have appreciated more people going to bat for me as well when I was a young'un.
Analyst quality has definitely dropped off.
And DEI not the issue at our bank. Almost all dudes, and a good amount of athletes. Just fucking lazy and no initiative
It's irrelevant. AI can already do most of the modelling needed in IB, and in 5 years no-one in IB will do models anymore as it will all be automated.
That would be nice but just can’t see senior bankers going for this. In their minds a 22 year old is a better bet than quantum computing.
Im sure they said the same thing about you back in the day. Except they didnt cry on the internet about it, they just told u fucking suck. Maybe try that.
Yes, this generation does not give a fuck. I will frequently get something back from an analyst that is so blatantly incorrect that I would have been scared to send it across and have been deemed retarded when I was an analyst. Nowadays juniors don't care if seniors think they are retards because woke culture has pussified the workplace so you can hardly say anything reprimanding without the risk of losing your job. What a time to be alive
"Do all junior bankers suck nowadays or just mine?"
(1) I'll put money on you not understanding what junior bankers are actually capable of doing and how that has changed over time.
(2) What do you expect when recruiting happens so early? You can't possibly know in a reliable way whether or not the junior bankers you hire are actually competent/interested in the job when you are hiring them before they even know enough to know how little they know. People like to cry about the diversity hiring/lower standards/etc, but the real structural difference is the recruiting timeline
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