Megafund Hours
How much variation is there between different megafunds for hours? I know it depends on deal, deal team, projects, etc. but in general I keep hearing that Apollo/Warburg/maybe KKR has the worst hours, Bain/Carlyle the best, and TPG/BX/some others in between (probably a reflection of location too with NY being worse than SF/Boston/DC). Is that accurate or more hearsay?
Apollo/KKR/BX are known to have tougher hours. Carlyle and WP hours is very dependent on group. Carlyle consumer is an absolutely brutal sweatshop, but other groups like healthcare and TMT are much more reasonable. Same with WP--I think healthcare and energy have shitty hours, but tech is good. My impression is Bain and TPG have the best hours on average but both firms are going to shit so....
I don't know if people understand that the "sweatshop" label is usually a good thing.
Unless sitting around the office all day, going home at 6, then getting no bonus or exit ops sound like fun.
Well I was thinking that there's a spectrum between leaving at 6 everyday doing nothing and getting weekends and late nights blown up constantly like in banking... and I doubt that any megafund, even one with poor recent returns like bain or tpg, will give you poor exit opps or bonuses. Even if the tougher funds give slightly better options or an extra $50k (and I'd imagine that Bain or TPG will open basically the same doors as KKR or BX, no?), I wouldn't trade that for a significantly worse lifestyle, be burnt out, not be able to have a social life or a S.O. like in banking.
Can you explain why Bain and TPG is going to shit? Bad recent performance?
He’s full of shit. Recent performance from both has been good
Not sure I 100% agree.
The better/worse groups listed above for WP/Carlyle are off. Out of the groups you named, I know/have known people in all of them: Carlyle+WP tech is miserable and WP Energy is probably one of the more bearable ones. Would be interested to know how the VC groups fare. Agreed on Carlyle Consumer, probably one of the unhappiest associates I've ever met. They didn't even try to hide it.
Second, the idea of a sweatshop being a good thing is preposterous. Its a good thing when you're a banking analyst, because you're being sought after for the on the job training (i.e., deal experience) you received in banking and so the more deal experience you got (i.e, the more you got cranked), the more attractive a candidate you were. It also designated you were a solid analyst getting good experience and be given opportunities to shine and plant your flag in the top bucket bonus.
The megafund world is quite different. For one, your comp is pretty much in already in the bag. There's very little variation in bonuses across the class, so more work higher ranked/higher bonus.
Next, while coming out of banking the skill that was sought after was deal experience/corporate finance/modeling... which was directly related to how much meaningful work you did across those 2 years... coming out of PE the skill that is sought after is investment acumen. This is not nearly as linear a relationship (vs. how much you got worked). So this idea of not being at a sweatshop MF being a bad thing for your career is nonsense.
From my experience/relationships, I agree with the above posted about Apollo and KKR are known to be sweatshops across the board... meaning whichever group you're in, you're getting cranked. All the others its group specific, so there are groups at BX/Carlyle/WP that are just as bad (if not worse) than Apollo and KKR lifestyle-wise. Small sample size, but had 2 friends in BX PE that went to b-school and were willing to go to any MF except BX... so my assumption has always been that you're a POW there. They both had this traumatized "I can't go back" look in their eye/tremble in their voice.
Back to the topic at hand... dor the avoidance of doubt, I consider a sweatshop environment one in which you're working until 2-3 almost every night of the week... and putting in full or near full days on the weekends as well. If you get paid the same bonus and have the same exit ops (which you will), you'd have to be a strange somebody to think that's a desirable circumstance to find yourself in.
Marcus - are you referring to hours during the thick of a deal process?
Yes, but I think the distinction is that you're almost always in the thick of a deal process at many of these firms... and when you're not, well then you've got 4 earlier stage deals that wouldn't be as taxing if it was 1 or 2 of them... but when you're on 3 or 4... then there's not much of a difference between that and being in the thick of 1-2 deals.
Very good to know, thank you
Anyone know how Silver Lake compares to the other mega funds?
Interested as well
as an aside, why do people focus so much on these distinctions as if they have the opportunity to choose between some or many of these firms? why is this relevant to know, unless you or someone you know is going to make a specific decision between these places?
When recruiting season kicked off, I had to choose which MF interviews to attend. I imagine many others were in the same position.
acronym, my point is that these jobs are highly competitive to get. thus, if you are using this to choose which firms to meet, my advice would be to go to as many as possible, as odds of landing any are low (just the numbers / nothing personal, you may be a stud/outlier who gets multiple offers from a few top firms)
I agree that recruiting is hectic, and you may run into situations in which you cannot attend all / may need to choose, but after working in PE for a few years, my advice would be to (1) meet as many firms you think may fit (2) analyze career progression + placement following 2 year PE associate stint (3) understand investment strategy, returns (historical + target), and firm trajectory (4) supplement with feedback on firms you can get from people who you know/trust vs. using 2nd hand commentary on online message boards regarding work-life balance. your call/I am trying to be helpful
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