NYC Neighborhood Suggestions for PE VP (early 30s with wife and dog)
Thank you everyone for all the help. These were extremely helpful suggestions. Lots of food for thought.
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Long Island City - Door to door will be 15-20 minutes. Manhattan rent for a 2 bedroom will be $7-$10k+ per month and it won’t make sense.
Manhattan is not a good place if you’re trying to balance dog/kids, space, and any semblance of budget.
Jersey City / Edgewater on the NJ side is another option although at 5 days a week that’s going to be taxing. Probably best value for money though.
a PE VP in NYC makes around $600K, $60K a year extra ($30K per person) to live in a 2b in Manhattan vs LIC is totally worth it
$600k is pre-tax. Effective tax rates at those level in NYC are ~40%.
So ~$375k post tax. $10k/month = $120k a year. So you're left with discretionary spend of ~$250k a year between a wife, dog, and baby. Daycare is ~$3-4k a month - so call it $40k a year. Left with $200k per year. So save ~50% of that - $100k per year. Absolutely nothing to sneeze at - but not exactly accelerating retirement in what will be a very taxing job.
Anyway to OP - folks here clearly have a different opinion. If you want to save some $$ - LIC/Jersey City is worth exploring, but nothing wrong with trying Manhattan as well. You'll either love it or hate it quickly and can always change.
UES and UWS are great, can’t go wrong with either (although distinct vibes, would spend some time in both). Personally not a huge fan of LIC but it is cheaper so will help mitigate some of the sticker shock but as a PE VP having a nice life in Manhattan is very achievable.
Personally not a fan of LIC either. It’s pretty soulless. UES/UWS are good options. Would also suggest Brooklyn Heights, Park Slope.
Fuck LIC. I don't know what the hype is. Pre-covid I don't know anyone who lived in that dump.
Upper west side/Upper east side for sure.
Agree, LIC makes a lot of sense for someone who's 25 and trying to live alone in a 1b for a little cheaper, but I would not move there as transplants with a brand new baby. Work is close, but getting literally anywhere else in Manhattan is tough
Thirding UES/UWS.
UES would be a super easy commute, just stay near the 6, could even walk on nice days. I would keep an eye on dog situation though - with an unfriendly dog it might be tricky. Central Park has limited off-leash dog hours but realistically you'll find off-leash dogs all the time... recall of random NYC dogs is varied at best, tough if your dog is reactive. The only dog park is Carl Schulz which is all the way on the FDR.
UWS is very nice and has more restaurants/suburban feeling than the UES, but will be a bit farther. Several nice dog parks if that's your thing. Keep an eye on the M5 bus, if you can live right on that route you will be fine commute-wise. I like the high 60s-mid 80s on UWS.
(edit -- I assumed you were buying, but re-reading the post I'm thinking you are renting now. Leaving my original advice here just in case) I'm sure you will get a broker to explain all of this, but 3 bedrooms will be $1.5-2m+ and for most co-ops you'll need to keep DTI around 25-28% (including mortgage + maintenance fees) and show significant post-close liquidity. Condos and sponsor units (board sales in co-ops) don't have the same very strict financial rules, but are more expensive. And absolutely stay away from land lease buildings, they're common on the UES - if you see any "too good to be true" deals it's probably a land lease (StreetEasy has a tag for them). Finally, 24h doorman is very nice to have with packages; and with a baby, I would give strong points to anything with W/D in unit - but laundry in building is usually manageable enough and it can be nice to get 5 loads done at once.
Good luck!
Hands down UES > UWS. The bus and walking situation is much better from UES. UWS... tough luck walking through Hell's Kitchen or Time Square to through places.
Not to be an ass but are you sure you want to move to the City? Sounds like you’ve spent very little time here, coming from Charlotte or something (“smaller city” doesn’t make me think Chicago/LA or even Boston or Dallas), you’re wifed up and pulled the goalie, have a dog who needs space, etc. Raising a kid in NYC with presumably no real support system in the area while you’re working for a new firm where you have no real view of the culture sounds like a recipe for a potentially disastrous home life. I’m sure you and your wife have already talked through all that but man, you have to make sure you’re going into this with eyes wide open.
But also ya, UES/UWS sound best for you.
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FWIW was raised in Manhattan by immigrant parents with no support system in the entire country and it was more than fine. You'll make friends quickly through your kids' schools who are often your immediate support system in this city (playdates when you have an emergency, etc.). Important to note, you'd be surprised how many single parents also do just fine in NYC so if they can do it so can you and your partner. A lot of people like to be really negative on NYC but if you find a neighborhood that works for you (UWS is great and a lot more laid back than UES), don't get caught up in the whirlwind too much, and make the most of it and you'll do great. Keep that optimism and positive attitude, will make it way easier to attract great people.
How strict is your 5days/wk in office? I’m in every day too but like 9-5 or 9-6 and do everything else from home in the suburbs because I also have a kid, dog, and a second kid on the way. I’d say go UES or LIC for your first year to feel it out and then consider the burbs. Yes, the commute sucks, but the grass is quite literally greener.
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I’m the only VP at my firm in the suburbs but have a few buddies at other firms that do it too. I also have a few colleagues at the principal and partner level that do it. I even know bankers who do it as VP/Director.
I’m most familiar with the NJ options (Chatham, Summit, Short Hills / Millburn) and Westchester (Bronxville, Scarsdale, Pelham, Rye), but parts of CT and Long Island work too. All depends on what you value. My personal door-to-door commute is like ~75mins, with the bulk of that on the train so I can read, send emails, etc. It’s not easy but also not too bad. Westchester or Long Island would probably be best for you on the east side.
There are so many dogs in UES, if yours is unfriendly - it’ll be a mess.
Currently live in LIC and work in midtown. The walk to/from work (30-40min) through the park is unbeatable. COL is competitive and my gf and I both agree it feels like the most “normal” part of NYC. Plus everyone has a dog.
Fort Greene near the 4,5 Nevins stop or Brooklyn Heights near the 4,5 Borough hall stop could work as well. Budget / space equation definitely easier down there and lots of families. Both trains run express through Manhattan so its like 3-5 stops to get to Lex & 59th and walk from there.
Agreed, my vote is for these two neighborhoods in Brooklyn if you’re looking for space for a young family, better bang for your buck, and still relatively trendy.
For sure do upper west side or upper east side. Close to the park for the dog and quieter areas still with cultural relevance. I would say I personally prefer UWS, but it is all up to what you are into. UWS you are close to the west side highway so it's easy to get downtown to good bars and restaurants. I think UES may be slightly roomier/cheaper, but it is the most quiet imo.
Hopefully your wife becomes friendlier after your move!
Would second UES. I lived in Yorkville and while I wouldn’t recommend that particular neighborhood due to its distance from Central Park, grittier vibe (but still nice), and inconvenience of the Q, other parts of UES seem like a good fit. Particularly closer to Central Park and between 60-80th st are nicer than being near FDR. You want to be west of the Q line and ideally west of Lexington. The 456 train will be superior for your commute and save you time imo. More reliable. I hated riding the Q. I’ve since moved downtown but did enjoy the safe and quiet vibe and excellent arts culture on the UES. Food was decent, lots of Jewish delis, Italian, wine bars, a couple German places, upscale grocery stores and cafes. Asian food was OK. Good luck with your move.
Is it your wife or your dog that’s the unfriendly one?
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I would suggest you actually look at Long Island City, Hoboken, Cos Cob, Greenwich and Old Greenwich. It will be less of an adjustment for your wife and dog.
But if your heart is set on Manhattan, any luxury apartment below 75th street is fine.
And, this is not a joke, if you’re interested in living in a luxury building downtown, 1500 sq ft, penultimate floor from the top, 2 bedroom/2 bath for 8.5k a month, pls let me know. Honestly, I’d go down to 7.5k for a great, no drama renter. Pet friendly building as well.
whats wrong with streets 75-95?
Too poor for my taste. I didn’t work hard in banking to live amongst the riff raff of Manhattan.
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If you can, move to Nassau County in Long Island. I assume you can probaby put some money down for a decent home near a large LIRR hub (like Mineola). School districts are fantastic out there too. Why bother living in the city? I honestly don't see the appeal given your situation.
A 20 minute ride to work via Uber during rush hour every morning would cost you $30+ every morning. No matter how much you make, that's just not feasible.
Some firms have comped Ubers to and from the office, but if you don't and you sweat a lot, you can (1) take the bus which also has AC and runs well (2) live near the office. I'd recommend looking into a gym near the office, worst case scenario, and hitting the gym before getting to work.
that's why I recommend UES over UWS, the bus lines are 1/2/3/lexington/park are so amazing
An Uber to work will cost $30-40 each way and can easily take 30-45+ minutes of standstill traffic during rush hour... meanwhile the subway is $2.90 and you can get most anywhere in Manhattan in 15-20 minutes. You will really get used to the temperatures here. It's only July and August that are really hot. The subway cars also have AC
I know a handful of people who refuse to take the subway... and honestly these are folks born into true generational wealth who don't even bother to look at their credit cards. They're also pretty annoying to go to dinner with because they are late taking cars everywhere. The subway system is by far the most efficient, learn how to use it and embrace it
I would highly recommend North Park Slope. You're right next to Prospect Park, great restaurants within a 15 min walk (5th Ave, Prospect Heights, Fort Greene, Clinton Hill), and you're close to the B/Q and 2/3 trains, which can get you to anywhere in Midtown in ~30-35 minutes door to door (e.g. B/Q is a 19 min ride to Rockefeller Center).
You won't save much compared to UWS/UES, and your commute time will be ~5-10 minutes longer, but once you're in the neighborhood, the quality of life is superb, you'll get to unwind with much lower traffic, a suburban feel, very family friendly, huge park (not filled with tourists), and trendier neighborhoods (UWS/UES were at their peak 20-30 years ago - now the trend is in downtown and Brooklyn).
TriBeCa is paradise
For a 3 bedroom apartment on a single salary? Only if OP has an 8 figure trust fund he's not mentioning.
Park Slope, Brooklyn is an extremely friendly, accepting neighborhood for bankers, particularly during Brooklyn Pride.
could not love the upper east side any more. upper west side is great too, but as other have said they are different vibes. upper east is more old-school but historic with a yuppie feel while upper west is largely upper class families and more diverse. the classic meme is upper east side is mike bloomberg and upper west side is bernie sanders. however, they are quite expensive neighborhoods. a 2br on the upper east in a decent building will run you 6-10k, add 1k on the upper west side. both have family vibes and are close to central park and tons of people with dogs. good public schools in those locations too.
Haven't seen it mentioned but you could check out Battery Park City. It's quiet with a neighborhood feel. A lot of people with families. I don't think it's that expensive since I knew a couple people who made decent but not that much money and lived there with wife + kid. Train-wise - you can catch almost any line from Fulton/WTC.
I would also try to avoid having to change trains in your commute if you end up taking the subway. If you go from UWS to Midtown East, you probably are having to transfer at some point or walk for a chunk (miserable if it's through an area that gets really crowded with tourists). My wife has commuted from Hell's Kitchen to UES for years and the transfer is a huge pain in the ass.
If your dog is unfriendly you should prioritize somewhere in Brooklyn, Queen, or Hoboken with private outdoor space
New York City is the matrix. If you have only ever lived here and only ever lived in Manhattan, you will believe that you literally could not exist anywhere else.
I took a job in LA and was hard-unplugged from the Matrix after living in NYC from '09 to '21. I recently moved back to NYC and 6 months later am moving to Rye. I have a toddler, a newborn, and a goldendoodle. I work in the City (3x a week) and my wife does too (1x a week). The City is gross.
I wanted a house, greenery, fun activities for my toddler on the weekend, and easier, less noisy living. I'm tired of seeing gross, disgusting people on the streets when I am out on the weekends with my family.
Unless you have enough money to live on either Riverside Park or Central Park, both the UWS and the UES. Good luck finding a park to sit in between 5th ave and the East River. There are none. The UWS is gross and gray. All of the 2 bedrooms in the middle have a view of other buildings or internal courtyards. Imagine burning $7K a month to look at an internal courtyard. Do you have a car? Good luck finding parking. You can pay another $1K a month in parking.
I really thought I was going to live on the UWS but I thought it sucked. I moved to Brooklyn Heights and it was/is delightful. I loved living nearing the Brooklyn Bridge Park. I'd probably move somewhere near there if I were you. It is great for SAHMs and dogs.
The UES is even worse. Gross. Gross. Gross. Unless you can get an $5mm+ condo.
The truth is living in NYC with a kid is true insanity. I have a todder. Especially once they can walk. It is loud, it is noisy, there are gross people everywhere, even in nice neighborhoods. You can never get nearly enough space unless you can pay $15K a month in rent.
Also, PE can be a risky, unstable job. You may get blown out in a few years for some unforeseen reason. I'd think about finding somewhere manageable from a cost perspective...like Jersey City TBH, so you can manage a decent savings rate if your wife decides to stay at home.
FWIW being a SAHM sounds horrible to me. Dealing with kids all day is really hard. Daycare is such a blessing.
If I were you, I'd have your wife keep working so she has something interesting to do / have a life outside of your and your kids, and live in JC to get a slightly cheaper COL. ALL of my female friends who went back to work after a baby breathed a sigh of relief after being around other adults and talking about real shit vs. baby stuff all day.
I know everyone is a MOTU on the forum and could never not live on the UES or not eat at Dorsia on the weekend, but you can. You are not in the matrix...yet.
As much as I love Brooklyn and think it would be a great fit, if you're working at 55th and Park and are presumably in a new-ish role where you want to be close to the office, the best you're going to do is UWS/UES. UES will be more convenient and unless you fall in love with the UWS, I would prioritize the UES.
For all the people telling you to live in the suburbs or Jersey, or Brooklyn, etc, yes, all of those would be better for a family, but for a young VP who wants to be in the city, I just don't see it as being super viable to live in Park Slope and commute 1+ hours to work each day...
Can't really comment on places that are aggressive dog friendly. Probably easiest to try and socialize your dog or not live in New York, haha. There's going to be other dogs and people around regardless of where you go, no way around that unless you pay 10M+ for some amazing apartment where you get your own terrace. That said, some of the places on the UES might have terrace/balcony space, so if you have a small dog, that might be workable.
UES is a great neighborhood, if you pick your cross streets right, you'll be a couple stops away from work and could potentially even walk/bike it very easily. I hear you on the heat/being sweaty. In the fall/spring/winter it's more manageable if you can keep the commute to 15min and if you have a little bit of flex in how you can dress. Summer's are brutal regardless, bring an extra shirt, try and work from home on hot days, or just get an equinox membership and shower before work if you need to.
I'm not sure I agree with this.
If he has a family, having a very nice 2-bedroom for $6k is doable in Park Slope. If you're close to the subways, getting to 55th / Park will be ~38 minutes door-to-door (check Google Maps). Unless he's joining BX or some other RE-heavy firm, he's likely to be in the office 4 days a week at most. This is only an extra 2 hours a week in extra commute (vs. 20 min in UES), for a much higher quality of life in Brooklyn with a toddler / family and more space.
Also, even as a first-year IB analyst in a brutal group a few years ago, my commute was ~25 minutes door-to-door. To say that a VP in PE can't afford a post-COVID commute of 35-40 minutes is insane, unless he's joining H&F.
Idk maybe man... I'm skeptical though, you'd know better than me if you've done the Park Slope to midtown commute, but from my view, you need at least two trains from Park Slope to get to 55th and Park, F --> M or F --> 6 right?
You think you're consistently doing that 38 min door to door at 7/8am each day? Feel like it's a 45/50min commute to me, and maybe more. That would be compared to a pretty consistent 15/20 from UES to Midtown East. A couple stops on the six, a mile-ish walk, a 10 min bike ride, etc.
I love Park Slope and Brooklyn, I live in Brooklyn now and would never go back. Completely hear you on it being a decent deal and way better for a family, but if I'm solving for easiest commute and the most suburb-y/livable areas of Manhattan to start for a year or two, I still stand behind UES as the best starting point.
To each his own though, really just depends on the person.
I'd lean to the suburbs for this one. A 30 minute LIRR/MNRR far beats a 20-40 minute subway in terms of being able to get work done. Look at Bronxville, Scarsdale, Larchmont, Rye, Manhasset, or Great Neck. All 6 are very nice towns around 30 minutes from Grand Central, and have some of the best public schools in the country. They also offer a good mix of walkability (sidewalks, nice town centers) and suburban life you may be more used to.
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