1st Year Analyst - Vent - take this personally or not?
I’m a first year analyst on a desk that interacts heavily with another team, call them Team B. One of my responsibilities is manning the phones as is common for first year S&Ters. I’m one of just 4 people on my team and the only analyst. Team B is more of a banking team so their setup is a little different (no phone duty as far as I can tell) and a little larger (5-7 people).
I’ve been on the team for almost a year now and while I can be kind of awkward sometimes, I generally try to engage when I can and I’d say I do good work.
I found out yesterday that my team would be having a lunch with Team B today. My MD is the one who organized it. I also found out that I’m the only one on both teams who isn’t invited - and that includes the analyst on Team B, as well as all their recently promoted associates, etc. Don’t think I was supposed to know that, as I kind of “accidentally” found it out, and my MD didn’t disclose the specifics of the lunch until about 15 minutes ago when he wrangled up the rest of the team to go. And even then he didn’t tell me it’s with everyone on Team B and our team but me, just that they “were ditching me”.
The lunch is supposed to be a “morale building” lunch, but I don’t think they realize how shitty this is for my morale. I bust my ass - came into work feeling like shit today - to try to be an asset and a good analyst and this is how I’m rewarded.
I’m sure if asked, they’d say “we need someone on phones”, but this feels like a personal thing. Like they just didn’t want me there. To make matters even worse, we’re not even all that busy right now and we’re more of a deal oriented desk, so it’s not like we have a position we could trade out of today anyways.
What am I supposed to do here? I’m actively considering quitting now - never felt so disrespected in a role in my life. I understand I’m an analyst but expect some semblance of at least the illusion of being included in team activities.
IMO i'd start searching for other roles. I'm a first-year in FI and my team flew me out when I accepted the job just to get dinner and drinks with me... Know your worth and find a desk that will value you
I would get out of there ASAP. Liking the people you work with (and them liking you) makes working so much better. Good luck man.
The sad thing is I do like my teammates. I get so many mixed signals from them. They’ll ask if I want coffee when they run and grab some, they engage me in convos here and there, and I respect them. But I’ve always gotten the feeling I’m the “odd one out”, and this specific situation has kind of sent me over the edge.
This is called manipulative behavior. Happened in my other job too where they keep you hot and cold.
Leave asap.
Get the fuck out of there and start looking S&T desks can be really petty (comes with the job and culture) but more than the actual action you want to make sure you like the people you work with. No job on Wall Street is worth it if you don't like your team.
Make sure you act chipper and put on a happy face because if they can be this petty, they may be willing to go farther and that's not a war you can win or even want to start. Act as if nothing happened. Know it's hard, but trust me it will pay off.
You should be looking to leave as soon as you can. Dude flat out, I really feel for you and I’m sorry you are in this mess. Wfh with covid made people take jobs and internships without getting a great feel for people on a personal level so try not to sweat realizing you don’t like them as much as you thought you did. Have there been other signs of a lack of fit? I went through something similar recently and landed in as of now a much better situation. Like everyone above has noted culture is so important and honestly if you think they are that petty imagine how much more you could learn with people that actually give a shit. You don’t need to bring up the culture part to why you’re leaving, could be “The team had extremely low turnover and I didn’t see a path to a book as a result” or something like that. Use your counterparts (clients?) you have a good rapport with looking for your next job. If they see something in you and are able to they will help you out.
I think I struggle to fit in in an office environment in general. I’m a very passionate / spontaneous person outside of work, many of my friends would describe me as such, but in the office I take the opposite, very cautious approach for fear of reproach / rebuke. I probably take it a little too far, and it’s somewhat exacerbated by some social anxiety.
It is difficult then to know how much of this is “fit” vs. something just seriously wrong with me. It’s really weighing on me at this point. Being left out of this lunch may seem innocuous to them, and there may even be a valid reason, but in the context of my general anxiety around them and how they seem to have loved / respected the previous analyst much more than they do me (long story) it was a real dagger.
Yeah I mean I can't speak to your behavior but honestly, just recognize you are still the same person in the office and out, just that in the office you need to be on the ball in terms of mkts. It's a good first step to recognize the anxiety, but to build on that it sounds like you gotta learn to recognize the energy in the room. If you think they are a rambunctious group then you are a bit safer to maybe go for a more risque story/joke, or if everyone is trying to stay focused then maybe be more conservative. That all said, my guess from that "it was a dagger" line is that you hit the point of no return since you can't trust them to be honest about why it happened so even if you ask them and they tell you xyz and it's truly a satisfying answer, it'll simply fester. Look, all it is just be your authentic self and whatever happens happens, I know that sounds like a really dumb corny line but at the end of the day we really do crave the acceptance of others and want to be loved and honestly we deserve it.
I know everyone is saying to get out asap. Just want to offer another view point as I was in a very stressful situation when I was a new analyst as well.
I remember the issue being such a big deal to me (wasn’t the same thing but same concept of being left out) and I received some great advice.
You may be a little awkward but don’t forget a lot of these people are even more awkward. They don’t always have good soft skills (or any at all) and really just don’t get it. You should cool down and give it a week. Just forget about it for a bit. And then reevaluate after. A lot can change in a week.
What cunts
First of all, I want to acknowledge your reaction is completely understandable, and appropriate given the situation. Yes, there could in theory be a reason they didn't include you, but from the context of your post, I am under the impression this is unlikely. If you are correct and they did intentionally leave you out, this does not bode well for your career with this team and firm. I would look elsewhere pretty quickly. If you are incorrect and for whatever reason they did have a valid reason for omitting you, then great you had nothing to worry about. The problem is you likely wont ever know. Do you have anyone you're particularly close to on your team that you can ask outright? I know you're the only Analyst but what about an Associate? If you don't have anyone that you know you can trust, I would just drop it and start reaching out to other firms.
I think the bigger problem you have is it sounds like you are cognizant of the fact that you dont mesh as well with your colleagues as others. I think this is something you need to work on. If it is due to being overly professional, drop the formality of your conversation topics and just really. try to get to know your team. It helps if you can get some 1 on 1 time with each person in a semi casual environment. Try to spark up convos around interests and to build from there. Connecting with your team is essential, especially in an environment where it seems everyone else is pretty tight knit. Regardless of whether or not you stay or leave, this is something you should work on right away. If you intend on leaving, you can practice with your current team with no risk.
Being well liked is extremely important in the work environment. Underperformers can get the promote over more qualified colleagues if they are more well liked. Being well liked is nearly as important as being good at your job.
It’s just me, a VP, a Director and an MD. I found out yesterday when I asked my Director about this lunch I had heard about (thinking it was with clients - just creating conversation), and he replied saying “you’re not on the invite?” It was at that point I realized I was left out by my MD - and as you stated, jury is out on whether it’s valid or not. My Director gave the weak rationale that someone needs to be around to answer the phones, but I could tell he was as perplexed as I am.
I’m not stuck on my team - I’m in a rotational program - but still I can’t help but feel strange about the whole situation. I may have oversold the extent to which I don’t fit in with my teammates. I’m definitely on the quieter side but I have gone out on work events with them, held conversations, etc. So really just trying to sift through all this.
I’m tempted to have a feedback session with my MD (been a while, and I’ve made a lot of strides) and try to understand once and for all if it was a personal thing or not.
Regarding your notes about improving my social skills… trust me I am trying. Feels like an impossible task at times. Sometimes I’m super savvy with the colleagues, other times I’m a total shell.
Start shooting your resume to headhunters and onto LinkedIn ASAP.
This has absolutely nothing to do with your social skills. Your MD has his/her unique, mysterious excuse for that I'm sure, but still.
was in a similar sitch. super close with team but fucked up bad a couple months in - was promptly doghoused, wasnt invited to some pretty imp social events. took a long way to unfuck things but all is well now though
my 2c is - seems like you were doing fine but just not meshing well with the team, but them not inviting you to stuff (esp for a 1st yr junior) is a low blow. if you feel comfortable enough to pull your MD aside for a chat def do that - but leaving/going to a diff team since u mentioned rotational - seems like the best bet for you. plenty greener pastures for juniors.
Out of curiosity, are you still an analyst 1? Or haven’t updated your title
was an0 now an1. same shiz
If I was you id get out it seems pretty bad for you to not be the whole one out of the group like its not just the favorites going its the whole group it seems. First maybe check and see if you missed something somehow but if not id advise getting out as well. For sure there is always wierdos so do not forget that. At my other job I had a VP who was super smart but he wanted to be left alone and the people who didnt bother him were the ones he liked, so there is always that. But from what you said its literally everyone but you and that does not sound good.
Planning on speaking with the MD tomorrow and seeing what's up, essentially saying "did I do something wrong".
I am very curious to know what he says.
Man talk about generation soft over here. Have all these people ever actually worked on a trade floor? Lets see you are on a desk where everyone else senior and you are much younger.
First off, the other analyst does he do your job, do you cover for each other? Basically why was he anointed to go on this holy lunch. Man its just lunch lord.
Give you a story I was a top jr trader and my boss, other MD and head MD told me to come join them at the bar late for a lunch, why cause I was picking up the tab for the group and got 1 drink after they were there for two hours (at least the waitress laughed). Traders can be aholes without even noticing or caring. To this day all 3 senoir people I am close with and I am one deciding who gets to lunch now.
Do not let stupid minor shit like this get you in a funk come in the next week and crush it and your job thats how you get respect. No desk where everyone is VP and up has time to care for the analyst these are not people who were in your spot 3 years ago. Also absolute shit attitude as a first year “oh we aint busy, we a deal desk”…till you bringing in revenue work those phones and crush it, let your MD worry about busy/non-busy.
Agreed on the don't let a one off instance mar your overall experience, but it seems his issue isn't that it's one off so much as his gut is saying he isn't fitting in rightly or wrongly since he started and is working for someone that is being ambiguous enough to fill him with doubt and then you toss in little things like this and it doesn't bode well for staying a happy camper. The recommendations to look for a new job aren't a recommendation to walk away but it is a get ready in case you really do have to leave before a person that might not give a shit about you ruins your career by giving you a bad rep.
Very good points but truly this is something you assess around 1 year into the job. Truly at this level you at working for the "firm" and not the "desk" many people get caught on this cause they hear stories of desk adding junior people and they are on the path to stardom in reality if you do great work and push hard you will be much better off. You want your MD to not block you and to help you join the firm longer-term not to to take to lunch and laugh with you. Even if the team is not "warm and fuzz" on OP, its better if they are like "no idea how that dude is socially, but man he works hard and does a great job" versus forcing the issue.
I actually had the chance to speak with my MD today and he informed me it wasn’t anything against me, and that he didn’t mean for it to come across that way. We also discussed my performance to date and I found out that he had given some decently high praise (albeit not absolutely raving - positive but succinct) of my performance back in December in a performance review form I hadn’t seen before / wasn’t privy to. He said we should have another review next week and implied that I’ve made great strides since then, with more details to come in the review. And aside from that I made an effort to connect with him on more of a personal level during our discussion.
I guess all this to say, don’t know why he didn’t invite me as “limited space” feels like a weak excuse (his non-rotational employees only excuse was stronger) but he still had positive things to say about me that I wasn’t even aware of, and he refreshed my faith in the progress I’ve made. So yeah I agree while I may not have the seamless relationship I’d like to have with him, he clearly views me as at least somewhat capable (exactly how capable to be revealed in our discussion next week).
lol, have you ever been to these lunches? every time I attended lunches with the big bosses those were the most boring hours in my life, period. I used to not tell my boss I'm going for a lunch so he would not join me, because I want to browse 9gag instead of talking about work for one more hour.
Hakuna Matata.
Don’t take this personal. Seriously, who would answer the phone? That’s a valid reason. You’re at work, not in some social setting. You mentioned that the other team is structured differently, maybe that’s why that analyst on Team B can partake. Could be a seniority thing as well. Seems like you’re in a good spot, the only junior on the team. Think this one through.
Tbh, it may even be that the cheap charlie MD was paying for lunch. Or he simply just forgot to invite you and came up with a silly excuse.
Don't over think it and be forgiving. Let it go gracefully, you might get invited next time.
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