General networking etiquette questions (physical trading)
Hi, hopefully there're some physical traders here who can clarify a few quick questions I have (although this also pertains to any industry in general I would think...)
What exactly is the standard etiquette for LinkedIn? I keep finding conflicting information on WSO.
Should I bother sending mass Connect requests to traders? (All of which will have a personalized note) I know that if you get 3 rejections in a row or something on LinkedIn that your account gets blocked or something to that effect -- so I am seriously doubting that it is a good idea to do this but I keep seeing this advice pop up...
Should I or should I not use InMail? I have found advice saying that InMail is better for putting my face out there while trying to cold-contact professionals. At the same time, I am also told to use email instead of InMail because some professionals don't even check their LinkedIn, often check their emails, and that sending an email is more personable and professional than using InMail. I have no idea how InMail works so I can't really decide which piece of advice has more weight over the other.
What is the standard email format for commodity firms? Is it still first.last@company(dot)com? How should I find someone's contact information if I can't guess my way to their email? Just use InMail?
(Possibly dumb question) What is considered appropriate conversation if I manage to set up a call with them over the phone? (Unlikely for me to go for coffee unless they're in NYC although it seems like most of my contacts in my bucket list are not in NYC). Is it ok if I ask them about commodities? Or should I focus primarily on their careers and what their careers really mean for them?
Thanks for the help for anyone who could provide advice. I know some of these questions are asked frequently but I'm not sure if things differ when contacting commodity/physical traders (not sure if there're differences in expectations, culture, and what not).
EDIT: Clarified first question.
1) Definitely personalise the note, but keep it brief and to the point.
2) I only ever used LinkedIn it's true that a lot of professionals don't check they're LinkedIn (I ended up having a chat with a guy 2 months after I sent a connection request), but lots do. It's a better setting in my opinion.
3) I can think of three different formats off the top of my head, so you can't bank on that. Either use LinkedIn or try an email format finder.
4) In my narrow experience, going straight for the phone call is way way more productive, if sometimes tricky to organise. My phone conversations have been way more constructive.
5) I would focus on both of those aspects career/commodities - but make sure you're asking questions rather than trying to show your commodities knowledge off (having a view on Brent is great, but don't try and second guess where crack spreads are going - same goes for other commodity equivalents).
Final note, culturally, these places are very different in my experience compared to banks. People are in general open to approach, but make sure you understand the difference between financial and physical commodities trading. It's also good to understand that it's one of few industries where you still need years of experience in to be successful (very few shortcuts to the top) - there is no substitute for experience in physical commodities.
There have been some really good threads recently on physical commodities on here so have a look at those for sure.
Thank you a lot for the response! To the first question though, what I was trying to ask was should I bother sending out mass Connect requests in the first place? (All of which I'll be adding personal notes) -- that's why I mentioned the possibility of getting rejected too often. Don't want to get blocked or something lol! Or should I send an InMail first and try to get them on the phone before I connect with them?
Do Both - Don't be afraid. There's no real formula for success here, you just have to take the risk and see where you get.
From my own exp about 9 out of 10 never responded to cold emails/linkedin messages. Phone calls are better because you don't get any miscommunication. Emails or messages can be interpreted in the wrong way. In saying that, its always hard to get past a receptionist or assistant asking why you need to speak with Mr/Mrs XXXXX. I would cold email, then follow up with a call within 1-2 weeks to give some substance for the phone call. I've made some good relationships with traders through networking, and even trying to work on some deals with one at the moment. Don't bank on the email/calls to be an entry to speak with someone though. Try to look for alumni's, someone who knows someone, or if its a small firm go there in person.
By the time I graduate, I (and career services) are fairly certain that I will be the one of the first alum connections that my school will be able to actively keep up with who is going into commodities (no one in my school has really gone for it before).
I know that this advice seems to have worked for you (since you were kind enough to give it) -- but it seems to almost completely contradict with the general body of advice on networking that WSO has advocated about cold emails and avoiding direct encounters from the get-go. How risky do you think it is to cold-call a trader or go to an actual office? I am actually fairly nervous about trying to do this because I do not want to create a bad name for myself among the circle of traders who know each other for the products I want to go into.
I'd only recommend going to the actual office it is a small trading house. Smaller houses tend to have around 2-10 employees, and usually the trader is the manager of the office. This is the sort of environment you can go direct, and I wouldn't suggest you rock up to Glencore doing the same. Apple vs oranges.
How risky do I think it is to coldcall a trader? It's really a subjective, because I am quite unorthodox to how I do things. It could work for some traders whereas might not work on others. But if the traditional emailing doesn't work, then my next step would be to follow up with a call. As a trader you will have to find channels by networking, and majority of the times I am cold calling, emailing, or being creative in my approach. If someone put in the same effort and found me, I'd be happy to have a chat. Maintaining the relationship requires more skill than establishing one, especially if you're trying to break into this industry.
I don't think Linkedin is bad per se as I have responded to messages in the past. A cold email would make me wonder how you got my email, and I'm not 100% sure I would respond unless you had plausible reason. Cold phone call at the office, forget about it, I don't have time for that.
I am a first year student based in UK and I attend a uni with almost no connection in physical trading space. I started spending a ton of time reading more about oil, coal and anything I could find about the commodity space in-order to choose what I want to do and I felt oil seems like a good choice.
I started sending LinkedIn request with personalized notes to the ones in the junior level like operators but I am getting almost single digit % response rate, any ideas how to boost that number up? Should I include something like whether they are free to hope on a call rather than texting on LinkedIn straight away or should I try sending email to their email id?
It would be great to hear the perspective of you guys in here
What personalized note are you sending? Operators are one of the busiest on the desk and highly doubt they are the best audience to your message. Junior operators around the same age as you? I would think they'd see you as a threat if you want to become a trader yourself.
I would connect with hiring staff or HR on internships.
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