So I have two years IB (small) boutique and two years at a private equity (small) fund. Once I spun out of the private equity firm I attempted to launch a start-up and ultimately crashed and burned. I am about to start business school (reputable school) in a one year program to get in and out quickly. The concern is the lack of internship with a one year program compared to a traditional two year mba program. Ultimately, I want to land another PE gig (along with everyone else).... but would be fine with IB.
Unfortunately, business school was a last resort for me and I have not had the best of luck to land a gig after my entrepreneurial disaster.... Should I take a pass on the one year program and go to the two-year program for the internship? When people have 2 years+2 years (IB+pe) and go to business school are they typically taking internships at IB's? or where?
Why in the world would you do a one year program knowing that in all likelyhood, your best shot on goal to get back into high finance (most likely IB) would be from a structured program with a summer internship? Absolutely do a 2 year program; if you're at a top 5 school you should have a relatively straight forward path to get into a good bulge bracket.
For the second part of your question, I have not gone to business school yet, but I have read that for the 2+2 + MBA folks, many of them end up doing their summer internships in non-PE industries because there are so few PE summer internship opportunities. If you're trying to get back into PE and can't land a very hard-to-come-by PE summer internship, it probably does not make much sense to do a banking internship because then your story has no credibility when you are trying to convince investment firms to bring you on as a senior associate.
I think most of these individuals end up with the post MBA PE roles either through a strong previous network or FT recruiting at a top school (H/S/W), or perhaps a guaranteed return offer from their pre-MBA PE firm if the person is a rockstar. We're usually talking about the most competitive people who have pre-MBA PE experience at legitimate shops and are at a top 3 school, so you can imagine this is a relatively small (MBA class.
The reason I have leaned toward the one year program is because I have a mortgage, car loans, and a wife. Responsibilities suck. The quicker I get in and out the better. However, I see your rationale... if I were single and had limited responsibilities... I would for sure go the two year program route. Kind of sounds like I am done with high finance...? Maybe I should just accept a crap FP&A role.... and say screw it.
That makes even less sense. If you have so many responsibilities and bills, why would you take such an enormous risk to do a one year program, without an internship feeder - by extension - without a JOB feeder? I think in your case hoping get a PE job is folly / too risky as well. I recommend taking the safe and reliable 2 year program providing a banking route, or risk getting utterly fucked with no job with a one year program.
If you have to go down the 1-yr MBA path based on your circumstances (which I understand), you might want to cast a wider net and also recruit for IBD opportunities at reputable firms. While it's not the traditional path to a post MBA PE associate as those types of opportunities are few and far between, doing IBD post school would still allow you to get back into the "high finance" game before you take another clean shot at PE.
Also your current recruiting situation may be a struggle, but given your experience and assuming you're headed to a decent school, you shouldn't have much of a problem recruiting directly for IBD as an associate.
I disagree with the "PE or bust" mentality (and this I'm saying after having been on the so-called "path" - IBD >> PE >> HF). Lots of interesting opportunities exist in the finance world that aren't "crap FP&A" jobs.
2 Years IB > 2 Years IB + 2 Years PE? (Originally Posted: 02/20/2010)
According to HBS admissions stats, 11% come from banking and 15% come from PE and VC. I was surprised by the high percentage direct from banking.
It seems like all of the best banking candidates go to PE, so it seems like it would be much less competitive applying directly out of banking. Does anyone know if this is true, or if I am making any poor assumptions?
How can you be sure the 11% that come from banking only worked for 2 years in the industry?
Well if they were associates or higher already, it would seem very weird that they would go to b school (such that after they get out they would face a demotion bc all mba hires are associates).
Also, the stats show almost half of the class has 3 or fewer years of experience.
http://www.hbs.edu/mba/profiles/classprofile.html
That makes sense. But from what I understand, if you want to work in Private Equity after business school, you will be at a tremendous advantage compared to your peers during recruiting if you have Pre-MBA experience. You will have no such advantage if you matriculate at business school (even H/S/W) immediately after your analyst tenure.
Yeah, that's true.
Well, is your end goal getting into HBS or working in PE?
I think CashCow is assuming that the admissions committee would evaluate bankers against other bankers and not against PE guys, but, like ews09, I'm not sure this is a valid assumption.
I think these schools try to keep percentages from each industry relatively constant over time, so I don't think someone directly from banking would be competing against someone coming from PE.
Also, more experience doesn't seem necessarily like a plus at these schools (especially H and S) who say they like younger people and have very high percentages with less than 3 years of experience.
Also, the majority of analysts from top banks go to the buy side (I would estimate at least 70% from GS, MS and top boutiques).
CashCow you are always on here throwing numbers around out your ass. You have made it clear that you are about to start as a first year analyst (although I don't even know whether or not to believe you based on some of the shit you say on here) so what gives you this magical insight? "I would estimate at least 70%..." Wtf? Where do you get off even making this estimate? I would estimate about a .00000000001% chance of the world ending in a nuclear holocaust in the next 46 hours. Does that make it a valid point that is worth sharing?
Well I think I am more qualified to make these estimates than a college junior with a criminal record hoping to go into sales trading, who knows absolutely nothing about banking, since I have had final round interviews at every major bank and have asked these questions.
Do you disagree with the 70% figure?
CashCow, you represent everything that is wrong with the site.
CashCow, as someone who has spent a decade in banking with an MBA along the way, let me tell you that you're wasting your time trying to quantify your chances. The b-school admissions process is extremely holistic. This is why average GPA's of admitted students tend to much lower than comparable GPA's at med schools and law schools. There are tons of students from no-name boutique banks and random Fortune 1000 biz-dev positions that get into top b-schools at the expense of GS/MS bankers, whether it's because they craft better essays, or display more maturity and leadership. Simply getting a prestigious job alone guarantees nothing. And you're completely wrong with your theory that applicants are divided into pools by job. Everyone competes against everyone. The class mix of backgrounds tends to stay constant simply because the mix of applicants tends to be fairly static - lots of consultants/bankers, a good number of PE folks, and lots of other business professionals.
Stop throwing percentages around. It's easy to do that when your entire student life has been based on quantifications - grades, test scores, admissions rates, etc. There comes a point in life when you can't quantify everything you do. That point is now.
gotem
I appreciate your advice, pierce_and_pierce.
I am just trying to make a rational decision on whether it would be wise to apply to b schools immediately after banking, or do 2 years on the buy side first. This seems like a relatively difficult question because some b schools like H and S say they like younger people, while others argue that more experience makes for a stronger applicant.
Looks like three people echoed my sentiments....
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