CNBC Debate, "Oops", Newt
Anyone catch the debate tonight? And if so, Perry's fk up!? Nails on the coffin for sure. I had to look away.
On a more serious note, Newt, who I haven' given much thought to, looked damn good. I know he's been in 3rd in the polls this week and you'll def see him move up a spot, if not to the top.
I cringed.
I felt embarrassed just watching that segment
Cain has proven to be a joke.
The Road to Newt....new name for the debates.
Newt Gingrich is a little bitch. Every time he's called upon he has to make some snide remark to the moderators or to other candidates. He doesn't say anything with substance.
It was inconceivable to me that anyone took Rick Perry seriously for even a moment, but seriously, what the fuck is this?
Also, Gingrich was a standard bearer for PNAC. That not only eliminates him from consideration, it earns him a savage alley-whipping if there is any justice in this world. This has to be the absolute worst Republican field since Jack Kennedy was elected.
It's time to grow up and get real, and get the right people in office. Wishful thinking hasn't worked, and it doesn't matter what 'should be', the simple fact is that Obama is the GOP's worst nightmare...and he didn't get there for no reason.
The only one that's got a shot is Romney, but he's in the exact same bind that Kerry was in 2004: he's really NOT the party's first choice and the enthusiasm just isn't there. It's very hard to win a federal election on the basis of "I'm a good idea because the other guy sucks" especially an incumbent candidate with approval ratings above 'abysmal'. These are just simple structural observations and would be true if the party alignment were reversed....in fact, this seems like a repeat of the 2004 election, just inverse.
The bright light for the GOP is at the end of the 2016 tunnel. They may or may not win in 2012, but the simple fact is that they'd do themselves and the country a huge favor to invest in some rational, realistic, long term team building and forgoe the short term silver/bronze medal. I know how I'm voting in 2012, but I see the fog lifting in 2016.
Could you elaborate a bit more on the specific things you mention above?
Do you have a video or transcript of her saying that? I hear people quote it all the time but I have never heard it myself or read it either. Just looking for some proof.
Regards
Thanks for posting that, I don't get much US news here in Milan (we've got a lot going on as some of you may have heard). Just brutal. I've been willing to bet Obama would win this race for a while now and I really don't see a reason to change tack. Newt doesn't have the slightest chance and unfortunately, Ron Paul will never get the traction he needs despite being the most intellectually honest candidate out there.
Romney has a slight chance, but he seems very vulnerable to negative campaigning. It really shouldn't matter but he is going to get killed for being a Mormon and his amorphous beliefs on social issues and Medicare. Add to that that he is the perfect target for populist ire and things look rather grim for the Republican field.
if perry wins the nomination obama's campaign can just run that clip as an ad until election day. jesus christ...
What the fuck happened to this country
zh had some lol tweets re: perry
I am a card-carrying member of the local Young Republicans chapter, and I cant believe the rodeo clown shit show that is this term's GOP presidential candidate pool.
The smart republicans (yes, some of us are smart) in my area don't understand how a Romney/Paul ticket is a no-brainer. Not only would we secure the religious hard-liners and southern bumpkins who would vote republican anyway, we would attract the independent voters. The GOP cant win against Obama without the independent vote, and Romney is the only candidate that could stand toe-to-toe against O in a debate.
Maybe I'm missing something, but how does either Romney or Paul garner the religious conservative vote?
Regards
That this is even a part of the political calculus in the 21st fucking century boggles my mind.
A Romney/Paul card would be the most competitive, since it would attract the most independent voters, but I don't think the "religious hard-liners and southern bumpkins" are ready to make that compromise.
Fuck that noise. I don't want Ron Paul anywhere near any public position of power. I am trying very hard to recall any position he has taken that I might agree with. Anyone who believes that the Federal Reserve should be abolished or that we should eliminate $1Tr in a single year needs a CT scan and a kick to the junk. I love how every time the dollar is brought into question that the saying "All Mighty Dollar" is thrown back and forth. I am sure it is to gain Joe's vote, but where is the mention of how a weakened dollar helps support our exports and such. And $1Tr in one year? If there was ever one way that Pinky and the Brain could have succeeded in destroying the world, it would have been to push a $1Tr cut through congress. That would turn this bad situation into one of cataclysm.
The only thing I like about RP is that he doesn't have any window dressing. I am sick of hearing the same message every time someone gets picked on to talk. We get it, Obama sucks, now shut up and say something meaningful.
It was nice for a change that the moderators did call out and pursue to an extent some of the candidates and their answers, but a little more would have been ideal. We should turn this into a social experiment and hook each candidate with an electrical shocker that is triggered any time someone evades a question or beats a dead horse on an issue. Might turn out to be a BBQ.
KYS
I read a great article in National Affairs that disagrees with you UFO. Romney is the tested and established candidate.
http://www.nationalaffairs.com/publications/detail/a-gop-dark-horse
Great article on the dynamics of the conservative vote. Romney is going to get the nod and the big question is who he will pick to be VP.
No one else will get votes from the center. I agree with you that Romney is a sure bet for the nomination....and Perry worries me because I think he's going to do as much damage to him as possible before he's cancelled.
I actually thought a Colin Powell vote vs Obama would of been great. Colin Powell has experience and a great war record. He defied Bush so you couldn't tie the two. Would of been a great counter to Obumbles.
I'm still not over the fact that Palin got tapped instead of Condoleeza Rice. She took everyone for a ride, cashed out, and left the GOP bleeding in a bathtub full of ice without a kidney....figuratively speaking she did this: http://www.wallstreetoasis.com/forums/be-careful-on-craigslist
Romney and Huntsman, realistically, are the only two who could win in the general election. For the sake of the Republican party, people need to start dropping out of this race before the inevitable mud slinging gets out of hand.
Powell wouldn't have secured the Republican nomination. This is an economy election.
Would have loved to see David Petraeus
The republican's core base will vote republican anyway. Is that not abundantly clear? Do you think religious conservatives and the conservative south will start voting for democrats because of a Romney/Paul ticket? Worst case is they don't vote at all, and I don't see that happening.
I would love to see a socially liberal Republican presidential candidate... there hasn't been a single Republican frontrunner that I've wanted to support
As I'll show in tomorrow's Bonus Bananas, even Reagan wouldn't get elected by the religious wingnuts in the Republican party today. He was too much of a centrist.
The evangelicals consider Obama the anti-crist there is no way in hell they will support Obama. This group should be ignored and the focus should be the choice between government expansion or a reduced role for the federal government. Alas both Romney and Obama will do the same thing no matter who wins, bigger government, more crony capitalism, and more bombs for the ME. Just hoping for the GOP to take the Senate to gridlock the system and make sure Obama cant pass any more massive liberal legislative overhauls.
Religion absolutely has a place in politics as it has a profound impact on your morals and ethics.
The great fear is that religion will adversely skew your judgment as the chief executive of the United States of America, hence the unease with Huntsman / Romney, and even Kennedy before that, but if you look back, religion and pseudo-religion in the form of deism and humanism played a HUGE part in the formulation of our government.
However, I think it's impossible to cater to evangelicals--the premises of that sect do not align at all with those of democratic governance. I'm fine with the idea of a devout Christian in office, but those who hold strong beliefs have a strong propensity to evangelize...
Personally, I think public policy issues should be discussed through the rational analysis of public policy, not through morals and religion. There is sound reason behind the separation between church and state.
Well it just isn't possible. People are religious and people are allowed to run for office.
Actually, that "separation between church and state" guarantees that religious person the right to freely practice their religion. Don't misuse or misinterpret the meaning, it's totally juvenile.
Regards
Maybe these evangelicals should spend a little more time learning to read so they can learn to render unto Caesar what is his.
I usually try to steer clear of politicized religion / atheism, but this really is true, especially in the South.
Quote from Dealbreaker: "JESUS, Perry" - George W. 'nucular' Bush
Wow, I've never heard of "render unto Caesar" before. That verse is just too perfect.
Romney would have to pick a really conservative running mate to have a chance. Marco Rubio would probably be great for that. And the Palin quote about Russia was not actually said by her, Tina Fey said that on SNL.
I'm just waiting for Huntsman to gain some fucking ground....don't think Romney could win the independents. And Romney would never choose Paul as running mate...their economic philosophies and foreign policies are nowhere near compatible.
Huntsman really seems like the only candidate who can beat Obama..
I love how people shit on Palin. She was the smartest, logical decision for McCain when Obumbles won the nomination.
You can't have a black VP against a Black President. You can't have two white dudes. You have to find another group. Women.
Palin was a governor, conservative and a woman. Let's not forget how energized the women were when Palin spoke, Unfortunately she wasn't ready for prime time and it didn't work.
Personally, the Republicans should not of even participated in the race. Obama was and is totally unqualified and was simply a hype/Manchurian candidate. It make the Republicans look bad to even run against Obama and make it seem as if this was a real election. Better to step away and let the drunk, foolish populace dig their own grave.
BAHAHAHAHAHAH, good one ANT
....wait, you're serious?
And McCain should have known she wasn't ready for primetime. The choice was terrible -- no way to spin that. Initial enthusiasm is great but as soon as she opened her god damn mouth I knew the Republicans were done.
If she was vetted thoroughly and still considered to be a viable candidate, then I have to question the competency of McCain's team.
I still watch her interviews during the election in disbelief as to how much of a moron she is.
It will be Romney/Cain or Romney/Bachmann
Cain and Bachmann are two of the dumbest choices imaginable. I'm guessing Romney learned something from the Palin debacle.
I would be surprised if any of the current candidates are on the ticket with Romney. I suspect he will look elsewhere, either a Senator or Congressman that's popular with the Tea Party, not gaffe prone, and relatively young.
Edit: I could see Romney wanting Huntsman on the ticket, but it obviously makes absolutely no strategic sense.
Edit #2: Pawlenty, or another popular current/former Repub governor would also be a possibility (can't think of any that make sense off the top of my head besides T paw), but I think it's less likely since Romney is coming from a governorship background.
You are right. The first black Presidential nominee, running against 2 terms of Bush and a largely negative bias could of been overcome by two old white guys.
You need to mute the enthusiasm. You need to split that black/female vote. Women tend to vote Democratic. They were juiced up for Hillary. They batter between Obama and Hillary was pretty brutal and female voters could of been split.
But I my argument has no basis.
Well pretty much no one agreed with you then and certainly no one agrees with you in hindsight.
Why is this even an issue? Why are moral beliefs rooted in Christianity any different than someone basing moral on science, Kantian ethics or putting their finger in the air? Why is it that the second someones morals comes from a religious stand point they are all of a sudden dangerous.
People are free to do whatever and people are free to think certain behaviors are immoral or sinful.
Everyone shits on religion yet I don't see Atheist charities sweeping the world and helping those in need.
So true...
Really? That was an impressive point to you?
It's not like atheists don't donate to charity- they just do it through (obviously) secular organizations. And yes, I know religious people tend to contribute more than the non religious, but just because a Christian donates money through a Christian organization it doesn't make them any better than atheist donating to the American Heart Society. The whole point of atheism is that it is not religion, so in its very essence it lacks organization. It isn't something people identify with, so its obviously not something that would serve as the basis of a charity.
Atheists don't start atheism based charities, they start secular charities. Ever seen one of those, numb nutz? What's Bill Gates' religion?
No, its not like that.
Policy decisions based on morals and religion may or may not always be detrimental. However, policy decisions based off of the rational debate of facts will almost never be detrimental.
[redundant post, deleted]
Newt is one of the least substantive people debating. At least Perry believes something. Whenever Gingrich speaks, he says nothing of value or just makes some snide remark.
Also, GIngrich is a moron. DO you know he wants the USA to invade North Korea and Iran?
http://phoebe53.wordpress.com/2011/10/15/gingrich-wants-attacks-on-iran…
mitt romney had the nomination secured before the race even started. msm has only created a very compelling narrative suggesting the contrary to keep us tuned-in and clicking. political platforms aside, the mere lack of poise of the other so-called first-tier contenders at the cnbc debate last night make this abundantly clear. notice: rick perry's blooper ("oops"). notice also: herman cain's misogynist faux pas amid multiple sexual harassment allegations ("princess pelosi").
Obama will win. Romney will get the Reb nomination but his own party doesn't even like him. I see it more and more, day by day.
If Obama wins re-election, the 2016 GOP field could be epic: Jeb Bush, Chris Christie, Macro Rubio, Mitch Daniels, Bobby Jindal, could all be potential candidates. I'm pretty embarrassed with how pathetic the field is this year.
Romney or Huntsman are the only ones who can actually beat Obama and wing independents. But I fear that a Romney nomination will lead to a third-party run from the right.
oops. double post.
It's funny to see even avoiding Romney like the plague for a more social conservative candidate when even Romney would get hammered by Obama (look at the Democratic attack ads - they're fairly brutal).
I can see Huntsman winning, but I doubt primary voters are collectively intelligent enough to vote for someone who carries himself as a centrist (his economic policies actually seem a lot more achievable and Reaganesque than the rest). Pitty.
Hopefully the GOP doesn't tilt Rockefeller or neocon for 2016.
What don't you like about Rockefeller Republicans?
Might as well vote Dem.
I disagree. The OG Republicans (Lincoln, Teddy Roosevelt) were basically Rockefeller Republicans and that tradition dominated the Republican party until Barry Goldwater and his brand of American conservatism hijacked the party and started the trend that led to seeing guys as ludicrous as Rick Perry being touted as legitimate candidates. The problem is Democrats aren't any better. Whereas conservative Republicans fight to see some ideal world which never existed be restored, most Democrats are blissfully ignorant of basic economics and vehemently oppose policies whose benefits should be obvious to all (free trade, restructuring entitlements) out of fear.
I would love to see a president who believes in free markets yet acknowledges the existence of market failure, who has the balls to ignore corporate money and opinion polls, in sum, someone who is "long-term greedy" for the sake of the country he has been elected to govern.
What is all this non sense about Romney as the gop darkhorse. the real DARK horse is none other than....
http://www.youtube.com/embed/3uwo5coKxuE
He's still got it.
"Because the Tea Party loves crazy more than they hate blacks."
LOL. Classic.
Haters gonna hate...
http://www.infowars.com/ron-paul-gets-89-seconds-to-speak-in-cbs-debate/
Regards
Wow. I had never had a definite opinion on Paul before that video, but geez, he went in.
Is everyone forgetting that the general election is won in the electoral college, and is totally different than the primaries? Romney (yes, he will be the nominee, Newt has way too much personal baggage and these millions from Freddie aren't helping either) doesn't need those extra hardline, tea party, wingnuts, evangelicals, whatever to win red states that are already red. This battle will be fought in Pennsylvania, Ohio, Florida, Virginia and Michigan. The fact that Romney is polling AHEAD of Obama in Pennsylvania should be the biggest clue that Obama has a real problem. Stop looking at general population polls, and start looking at the states. Obama is going to have to spend a lot of money/time in Michigan and Pennsylvania (when has a democrat ever even considered losing Michigan or Pennsylvania???) which will take away from his chances of keeping Virginia, Ohio or Florida. I think if Romney convinces Rubio to run with him, Florida is locked up. If there is someone who will help him win Ohio and/or Pennsylvania then that would be worth a look for VP too. This will be a fight and if ecoomy keeps sputtering, Romney probably wins.
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