Lone Pine: GOAT of Greenwich?
I think Lone Pine takes the chip for best HF in Greenwich. World class performance spearheaded by one of the most prominent investors of out time: Stephen Mandel. Anyone on WSO know shit about Lone Pine though 😂? Please share the knowledge with everyone lmao. The environment at Lone Pine seems to be way better than that of other Tiger Cubs, and returns are amongst the best of the best. Do you guys think Lone Pine is the highest paying shop out there? They've got MDs in their late 20s and early 30s according to linkedin. They had a sick year last year, so I would imagine a few hardworking young MDs became decamillionaires with 8 figure payouts. 7 year median tenure sounds relatively high (there's back office stuff factored into that number, so we don't know what it is for IPs but it's prob higher), so that must say something...
Also can anyone comment on the public and private/VC side of Lone Pine?
anyone?
Where'd you get the info about stuff like the environment, medium tenure, payouts, etc? just curious
Not the OP but here’s what I’ve found
Environment: read an article where they said how it was a really nice place to work. From whatever I’ve been able to find on WSO, Lone Pine seems to be like the least hardcore out of the tiger Cubs
Tenure: LinkedIn
Comp: I get the sense that lone pine is obviously one of the best shops out there, so I would imagine comp is higher than just about all the other shops. Last year they were up 25% I think. Bloomberg says they made $9.1bn for their investors. Steve Mandel made $1.8bn, 16% of which was from performance fees (again stats from Bloomberg). 84% of that was from profits on his personal investment in the fund. If the $9.1bn IS NOT excluding Mandel’s profits, the real number is $9.1bn - $1.5bn (Mandel’s profits). Maybe the $9.1bn was after subtracting out Mandel’s profits, who knows, but let’s assume that’s not the case. So ~7.6bn * 20% = $1.52bn GP carry. Like I said before, Mandel only took ~300mm from that GP carry, so that means there was $1.2bn left for the Lone Pine analyst/MDs. Now I’m not sure if I believe this, but supposedly there are 14 investmenr professionals at Lone Pine. Sounds kinda low to me idk. $1.2bn spread across 14 ppl is 85mm/person. I’m sure between Granat, craver, and Gaonkar and the other super senior ppl there (maybe 5 ppl out of the 14), they took $800mm of that $1.2bn (I have absolutely no idea how much they took lmao). So now call it $400 spread across 9 MDs/analysts and back office at Lone Pine. That seems way too high but it also sounds right so I’m at a cross roads here 😂.
Actually who knows maybe they took $1bn of it, and then the remaining $200mm spread across 9 MDs/analysts. Any way you slice that, I’m willing to bet that an analyst cracked $10mm. MDs probably made like $20-30mm. 8 figures is not unheard of for an analyst; I’ve heard stories of Pershing analysts making $10mm year 1 but that was probably an insane year. 25% for Lone Pine is really good but it’s not incredible. Just goes to show how they are super lean, and you can probably make a lot there just because of 1. How lean it is and B. The fact that they perform very well
Your incentive fee math is pretty off.
killer returns with some nice phallic imagery in the fund name. what more can you ask for?
its closer to 20 -25 investment professionals btw. still good.
No its 14, its listed on their 13f...
Yeah $300mm spread across 20-25 IPs makes a lot more sense, but I have also seen the 14 IPs number from a few sources so idk. If from the $1.5bn GP pool, $300mm goes to Mandel, and then the top 4-5 folks take like $800-900mm, there's $300-400mm left for everyone. That's a lot of money haha. I've seen MDs at Lone Pine who are still in their 20s: to be making upwards of $20mm at that age seems ridiculous but I guess that's what you get when you're at a place like Lone Pine. Do you guys think this was the case last year?
Do places like Baupost or Elliott also have these economics / payouts for analysts?
^^anyone know? Elliott returns are mad low so I would imagine it's a no for them, but maybe Baupost is similar to Lone Pine. No one likes Boston tho. Thoughts?
Elliott’s returns are “mad low”. Wow.
If Elliott's returns are "mad low," Baupost's recent returns must be "hella mad low"
Perhaps you can enlighten us then? I don't know their annual returns but the 12.7% they put up in 2020 was "among the best in a decade". These guys are not compounding capital at 15-20%+ anymore.
That said, there's nothing wrong with returning high single digits when you are a $45bn fund. Elliott is a (very) multi-strat fund with everything from private equity to structured credit investing. The value proposition to their LPs isn't about making the best absolute returns; it's about being able to put a bunch of capital to work in a variety of low/uncorrelated bets.
Let's also keep in mind the management fees and carry on $45bn are massive...
You guys have to understand that when you are a massive fund, you are a product for institutional LPs. Institutional LPs are looking for a lot more than just the best absolute returns. And you don't grow your fund to $45bn simply by being a genius investor -- you need to understand and sell to your customer base.
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Here is a BBG article on Baupost from 2017 (link below). The woman in the article was a principal (i.e., senior analyst) having worked at the firm for 8 years. She made $3.8mm in 2014. Per the article, it was the highest among her peers at her level at the firm. In that same year, Klarman made $200mm.
So you can make your own assumptions regarding what an analyst, principal, MD, and partner (including Klarman) makes at Baupost.
https://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2017-12-07/they-gave-her-a-3-8-…;
A couple of quotes:
"Still in her 30s, Rohrbeck would earn a $3.75 million bonus for that year, 2014. She heard it was the most of anyone in a similar role at Baupost, one of the largest and most successful hedge funds."
"In January 2015, when Baupost paid out Rohrbeck’s $3.75 million bonus, Klarman congratulated her on a “strong year,” according to her filing."
"The year of Rohrbeck’s big bonus, Klarman was paid $200 million, according to Forbes."
"Rohrbeck, who has a bachelor’s degree from Harvard as well as the MBA, joined Baupost in 2006 as an analyst. She specialized in real estate investing. After five years, she was promoted to principal, one rung below managing director, which is then followed by partner."
Don't disagree with this thread in that Lone Pine is indeed a dope fund--but, worshipping any particular fund is a recipe for sadness.
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