Q&A: Former Director of Corporate Development | Current CEO & Founder

Open to all questions about career progression, all things M&A, working for a Fortune 500, avoiding IB, quitting job for a start-up, MBA, etc..

Background

  • Former Director of Corporate Development for highly acquisitive diversified industrial company (14 transactions representing over $1.5 billion in transaction value)
  • 8 years of Corporate Development experience (promoted 4 times in 8 years from Analyst – Director)
  • Quit job in 2019 to start productivity software company
  • Decided to avoid IB after starting career
  • Started career in Big 4 valuations practice
  • BS in Finance and Entrepreneurship from non-target (but still recognizable (https://www.wallstreetoasis.com/forums/comprehens…)
  • Target MBA (Kellogg)

Feel free to ask me whatever you'd like, or PM me if you're more comfortable doing that instead.

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Comments (45)

Jul 27, 2020 - 5:03pm

Thanks for the Q&A. I got 2 questions for you.
Can you speak a little more to climbing the ladder in Corp Dev / Is 4 promotions in 8 years typical? When and why did you get promoted?

Can you also speak a little bit to the type of people you see do best in Corp Dev? Are bankers a good fit for Corp Dev or do you look for different skills when you hire?

Jul 27, 2020 - 5:56pm

Question 1. Can you speak a little more to climbing the ladder in Corp Dev / Is 4 promotions in 8 years typical? When and why did you get promoted?

I do believe there can be some variance across companies in terms of promotions so please take this response with that as context. There is not a set / defined promotion schedule like you would see at an IB / Big 4 / or Consulting track (e.g. 90% of analysts get promoted to associate or fired after 24 months) in smaller corporate groups. The typical analyst/associate should expect 2-3 years before being promoted to Manager, although 1 year is not out of the question, especially if you come into Corp Dev with more than 2 years work experience.

In general, as you get more senior, the promotions are based on availability and need as well as based on performance. Getting promoted from a Manager to marginally higher title (e.g. Sr. Manager) is more likely to be a function of pushing your boss for a new title or a function of moving into a new pay grade vs. a change in roles and responsibilities. My guess would be that in 90% of Corp Dev teams, there is no difference between Manager and Sr. Manager outside of pay grade or a frustrated employee pushing for a title change to show progression.

Beyond Manager, promotions and title changes are limited based on organizational structure. The year I left Corp Dev, we had 1 VP, 2 Directors, and 1 Analyst. It was not going to be possible for either Director to get promoted to VP unless the VP left the group. When I first started our group had 1 SVP, 2 VPs, 3 Managers/analysts. Whether it be the SVP or VP level, there is a point where title promotions are not possible unless someone leaves.

I specifically got promoted because I was in the right place at the right time and I like to believe I worked my ass off. A few years into my career the VP I worked for left the organization, which threw me into leading and managing deal teams earlier in my career. That same year, the company decided to make an organizational change and create VP of Corp Dev/Bus Dev roles at its business segments. The searches were going to be 100% external (HR heavily favored external hires vs. internal promotions), but after failing to find the right candidate for 1 segment, the CEO and CFO of the business segment made the push for my promotion into their segment as a Director.

Question 2 Can you also speak a little bit to the type of people you see do best in Corp Dev? Are bankers a good fit for Corp Dev or do you look for different skills when you hire?

If you are asking about junior roles, typical Corp Dev employees come from PE, IB, Valuation and Consulting. All those careers are acceptable to get into Corp Dev at a junior level, you just need an understanding of business valuation. Consulting is at a slight disadvantage, but it isn't insurmountable. Understanding the M&A process is helpful, but not a must at a junior level. As you get more senior, my opinion is the best Corp Dev professionals have real M&A execution experience prior to moving into Corp Dev or obtained in the first few years in Corp Dev. The best advice I can provide someone is to understand how to manage and execute a transaction (not just value a company or what an LOI is). Senior employees need to know the details of how to complete a transaction (negotiations, working capital, purchase agreements, tax issues, etc.). I've found that more senior consultants moving into Corp Dev typically struggle because they will not fundamentally understand how to execute an M&A deal. They will have to rely heavily on lawyers or other experienced staff and will struggle with bankers and potential targets.

Most Helpful
Jul 27, 2020 - 6:49pm

I've always wanted to do something entrepreneurial, I just never knew what and felt like I needed some real-world experience first. I definitely never imagined myself running a software company with my finance / M&A background. The push to go off on my own was a result of a few things:

  1. Finally coming up with an idea that I thought I could execute on. I can't code but felt like I could succeed if I partnered with the right people because I knew the ins and outs of the problem. We tinkered with the idea long enough where I eventually needed to take the risk and focus on it full-time.

  2. My career progression stalled and the company changed. The role and responsibilities of the job had changed to be more focused on deal oversight. Our VP was only a few years older than me and not going anywhere. I did not have interest in moving to an operating company based on the company changes I had seen. I could have looked for new jobs but I am not getting any younger and wanted to try something new.

The idea for Astute Review came as a result of the pains I experienced while in Corp Dev, after spending too much time far too late into my career making sure our pitches and strategy decks were BoD and C-Suite ready. I fundamentally believe that employees shouldn't have to focus on tedious (but important) formatting in general, especially PowerPoint. They should be focusing on literally any other aspect of their job (strategy, content, analysis, etc.), or be able to get home a few hours earlier.

How is it going?

I quit my job to focus on Astute Review in Nov '19, my wife had a baby (our first) in early March '20 and then we got slapped in the face with a GLOBAL PANDEMIC. By mid-March our entire pipeline froze or disappeared.

To say things are stressful is an understatement. The response changes day-to-day, but overall I think we are doing OK. There are so many variables at play and there is no doubt we can improve in all aspects of the business. With that said, it is very difficult to gauge how much of the slowed progress is a result of COVID vs. execution.

We're working on increasing our install base by focusing on end-markets where customers are more willing to spend money or even adopt new software at the moment (mostly banking and corporations less affected by COVID). We're struggling to find the right channels to market to end-users (Linkedin, Instagram, Google etc.) to increase awareness and adoption. Our end-user is typically not the purchaser so there is a bit of process to make an employee aware of the product, try the product and ask for approval to purchase -- We are actively working on how to solve this (suggestions are welcome!)

With that all said, we've been successfully gaining adoption, albeit slowly. The sales cycle is much longer than I expected for such a cheap product. We have happy customers in companies of all sizes and industries, but mostly focus on Corporate Finance, Corp Dev, middle-market consulting and banking.

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Jul 27, 2020 - 6:09pm

Just clarifying, you were a director within a business unit or for the entire company? Also, why go for an MBA considering you already have a role that sounds like its 3-5 years post-MBA?

Jul 27, 2020 - 8:03pm

Sorry should have been more clear and the answer is actually both. For context the company had a corporate HQ, business segments and operating companies within the segments.

I started at the corporate HQ until I made Director. I was a Director of a $2+ billion business segment that housed about 9 operating companies. The last year of my career was spent as a Director at the corporate level.

I really struggled with the MBA question and ultimately decided to go part-time for the reason you mentioned. I would not have been able to get the job I had right out of an MBA and the work experience I would have been missing, especially with one active deal in particular, was more valuable than the MBA to be honest. I got the MBA for option value and to gain some more education in strategy and management. I felt like I needed the MBA if I ever wanted to move into another role at another company. Most positions that hit my inbox required an MBA (or "Strongly preferred" but I interpreted that as necessary) and I also felt like I needed a Target MBA name on the resume since I did not go to target undergrad. Part of me felt like I needed to prove something to myself (definitely could have applied myself more in high school) and part of me wanted to avoid missing opportunities that historically only looked at top-tier MBAs. Looking back on it, I should not have obsessed so much about getting an MBA for the name, that was childish of me.

Jul 27, 2020 - 9:49pm

What was your all in comp at each level (analyst-director) ?

Do you expect to replace your most recent compensation via your entrepreneurial endeavors?

Jul 27, 2020 - 10:20pm

Here is the all in comp. Some of the amounts might be rounded as I don't remember the exact numbers, but they wont be more than a few thousand off. The ranges cover my entire time in each level.

All in Compensation
* Analyst: ~$100k
* Manager: $120-130k (Note: this was grossly under market)
* Director: $180-$245k

It is my intention to eventually replace and exceed my most recent compensation with the new company. I am not taking a salary at the moment.

  • Analyst 2 in IB-M&A
Jul 28, 2020 - 12:39am

Understand this is asked a lot (probably) but how big was the company? F500? F100? I know that CD pay is def less than bankers but was expecting a director level to be pulling in 300-400k but of course I could be totally off

Jul 28, 2020 - 3:16am

Hi, thanks for doing that! Can I shoot a couple of Q, too?

1: Can you touch on the start of your career? What exposure did you get in the Valuations practice and what projects & experience would you advice one to seek if they do such a position as their first job out of undergrad?

2: For how long did you stay there? What exit opps did the job gave you? Was the vals experience helpful for the MBA admission?

Thanks!

Jul 28, 2020 - 11:16pm

Absolutely, sorry for the delay here, it's been a long day.

Question 1 Can you touch on the start of your career? What exposure did you get in the Valuations practice and what projects & experience would you advice one to seek if they do such a position as their first job out of undergrad?

I think my exposure in general was fairly standard for any valuation employee. I had pretty decent exposure to senior employees (Directors, Partners, etc.) even in the first year of my career. I was able to eventually attend client meetings a make a few trips for work. This is all very typical of any valuation practice I've heard of. The technical skills I learned were beneficial, but the work was tedious.

The best exposure and experience I would suggest anyone moving into business valuation is to try and get on projects that are outside of Financial Reporting (PPA and Goodwill impairment) and Taxation related valuations. These jobs are few and far between in Big 4 (maybe not elsewhere) but I think this experience will 1. make you more aware of other job opportunities career paths and 2. help build the resume for when you eventually move on in your career (you will simply have more to talk about). I was able to get on several projects (Dispute/litigation and business valuations for businesses looking to sell to PE) that really gave me a broader base to talk about in interviews. This work also helped me realize that I needed to find a way to get involved with M&A deals before they were completed, vs. Purchase Price Accounting work after a deal is completed, which always personally felt more like a math exercise.

I would also suggest that you understand why every project you are working on needs to be completed. I cannot tell you the amount of times I heard a MD or Director say they didn't know the purpose of the work/valuation beyond "tax" etc. This always amazed me and really made the work feel unimportant.

Question 2 For how long did you stay there? What exit opps did the job gave you? Was the vals experience helpful for the MBA admission?

  • I worked in a Big 4 valuation practice for almost 3 years.
  • Here are the exit opportunities that I was presented with and feel like are realistic exits:
    Middle Market Investment Banking
    Corporate Development
    Other valuation practices that focused more on litigation on & solvency
    Internal valuation for reporting purposes in Private Equity
  • The valuation experience did not come up in my application or my interview, but I believe this is largely due top the fact that I spent 3-4 years in my Corp Dev job before applying for an MBA. I don't believe it impacted my application outside of the name of the employer.
Jul 28, 2020 - 12:02pm

Thanks for doing this.

I am in Big 4 valuation as well and feel at a disadvantage to bankers in terms of attaining these sort of roles. What advice do you have to maximize your experience at big 4 and have the optionality for Corp dev type positions?

Jul 28, 2020 - 2:01pm

I completely understand the feeling but you shouldn't feel that way at all.

I definitely felt that when applying too. I was fortunate/lucky in the sense that the company had historically not opened up their search beyond IB and PE, but recently expanded into valuation before I interviewed.

The best advice I can give you is to do your company specific research before the interview (listen to earnings calls, read a 10Q, 10K, recent deals etc.). After I got the job I was told that the main reason I stood out vs. competition was because I did my research on the company, on top of interviewing well. You will "want it more" than a lot of bankers who are pursuing PE and falling back on Corp Dev as a second option.

You will have the same technical skills as any junior banker from a valuation standpoint, potentially even better. You are not as aware of the M&A process, but that's something that you can Google for 15 min and get the rough understanding of.

To give you some additional hope, as I was transitioning out of Corp Dev we were in the process of interviewing for a new Analyst position. My colleagues at the time were ex IB, PE and Consulting. We interviewed a number of bankers and one valuation associate. The valuation associate interviewed head and shoulders above the rest of the group. He simply wanted it more. He did his research on the company and was predicting divestitures (correctly I might add, even though we could not tell him that in the interview) during the interview process. He knew our business and displayed that he really wanted the job.

You have the skills, just do your research, ask real questions, learn a little bit about the M&A process and you will be a strong candidate.

I am 100% serious in this offer. You can private message me and we can set up a time to talk in more detail if you would like. I have been in your shoes and understand the concerns.

Jul 28, 2020 - 4:27pm

Thanks for doing this - always interested to hear someone in Corp Dev with such a long tenure. Just a couple of q's:

  1. How did your job responsibilities progress change as you were promoted throughout your 8 years with the company? Were there any ad-hoc projects outside of doing deals (i.e. at the request of management/BOD?)
  2. What was the most challenging aspect of Corp Dev (i.e. deal-wise, project mgmt, people)?
  3. Coming from a transaction services (i.e. Big 4 FDD) background, what would you suggest someone in that role strategically focus on in hopes of transitioning to CD (I find that it's normally uncommon, but potentially doable with the right skillset/preparation)
Aug 3, 2020 - 8:54pm

These are great questions.

Question 1: How did your job responsibilities progress change as you were promoted throughout your 8 years with the company? Were there any ad-hoc projects outside of doing deals (i.e. at the request of management/BOD?)

The progression of obtaining new roles and responsibilities was more a function of gaining experience and building trust with portfolio.operating companies vs. obtaining a new title. There was a period of time when I was a manager where I was managing and leading deal teams just like I was as a director. There may have even been a period of time where I was doing the same as an analyst. I slowly moved from conducting business valuations, writing up IOIs/LOIs and helping portfolio companies put together PPT decks for internal approvals to managing and leading deal process.

Yes we did a lot of ad-hoc projects during my time in Corp Dev. We helped with some general strategy initiatives (competitive research, market research, white spaces, etc.) and also help source deals for potential targets. When I moved to a business segment, I also got involved with some operational related strategy work for a few companies who lacked resources at the companies.

Question 2: What was the most challenging aspect of Corp Dev (i.e. deal-wise, project mgmt, people)?

Hands down managing people on deal teams and dealing with internal processes. Not everyone staffed on a deal team is as interested/devoted to the DD process as they should be.

Question 3: Coming from a transaction services (i.e. Big 4 FDD) background, what would you suggest someone in that role strategically focus on in hopes of transitioning to CD (I find that it's normally uncommon, but potentially doable with the right skillset/preparation)

I definitely think that the transition is doable, but agree it is less common. My advice would be to:
1. Brush up on business valuation again and be prepared to explain examples of why you world or would not invest in certain industries /companies. It's a small sample size, but we would focus on that when applicants didn't come from banking
2. Do your research on the company (earnings calls, M&A,analyst reports)
3. Think about how your experience can help a corp dev team and highlight that. You are never going to stop a company from outsourcing FDD since you are just one person, but you this experience is valuable to any Corp Dev team. Your FDD reports always have deal and negotiation implications although you are typically unaware. Your FDD experiences give you a unique perspective of what new findings can change the course of a deal. This is just my opinion, but it will make for a strong interview if you can work in how your FDD will help catch red flags, true adjusted earnings etc.

  • Intern in RE - Other
Jul 28, 2020 - 5:42pm

What is one life truth you believe to be important that few agree with?

What is one career truth you believe to be important that few agree with?

Thanks for your time!

Jul 29, 2020 - 11:20am

These are great questions, I hope I don't disappoint with the response

  1. This is for the all Type A people on the thread. I will say that my wife has to constantly remind me of this as it is easier said than done. We are all so anxious about the future that we don't enjoy the present.

2a. Here is a specific one for M&A. When conducting due diligence, always get friendly with the engineers. They will give you the most honest feedback about the company and products. The engineers always get neglected in the meetings and they have the most to say.

2b. General advice. You will come across people in your career and you will have no idea how they got to where they are in life.

Jul 28, 2020 - 11:55pm

Not a problem, I hope the answers have been helpful.

I avoided ibanking directly from undergrad simply because it was not pushed as a career path. I went to a non-target school (WSO defines as Non-Target, but still recognizable). I think we maybe had 1-2 banks recruit. My college was more focused on Big 4 and management consulting as career paths for finance majors.

I interviewed at 2-3 banks after 2 years in valuation after getting a better understanding of what I wanted to do as a next step in my career. I decided to stop pursuing banking because every company I spoke with was not going to recognize one minute of my valuation experience. I was going to start in the exact same spot as the undergraduate incoming class. At the time I felt the technical valuation experience should have held some weight in a transition to banking (this was only validated when I moved to Corp Dev. I still find it ridiculous that these middle market banks had this mentality). I was getting my ass kicked for 2 years in my current job and I was not prepared to gut out another 2 years of crazy long hours and being on call all the time. If some people want to grind it out for 4-5 years doing this, that is fine. I just missed too many happy hours, cancelled too many dates and was way too unhappy to deal with several more years of being an Excel jockey. Luckily after I made this decision I got a call a few months later for a Corp Dev job.

  • Analyst 1 in CorpFin
Jul 30, 2020 - 12:51am

Hi, I am just starting my first rotation at a top FLDP and plan on staying in corporate finance for the next 3-4 years before re-evaluating the merit of an MBA and career shift. My FLDP is a feeder into a secondary rotational program that really rockets your career forward within the greater organization. The merit of an MBA depends on my ability to perform in this secondary program and where I want my personal life to be.

Anyway, my question for you is: what are the pros & cons of an early career in corprate development versus quickly climbing the ranks in FP&A/Commercial Finance? Perhaps added to this is what are the merits of working in M&A earlier in your career when your end goal is to be in corporate and not professional services?

For more color on my siutation should it affect your answer is after the 2 year FLDP stint, if you make it 2 years in the secondary program (2+2 = 4 yrs post undergrad) and go off-program then, you typically land as a manager. Three year in the secondary program lands you at a senior-manager with a bit of a quicker track up. Four years lands you at senior manager/director level. Five years lands you in the exeutive pay-band. The number of people that make it to year 4 and 5 are quite low % wise looking at each starting class. Company is a F50 (You may or may not be able to tell where I'm at with this info..).

Also, thanks for doing this and for the insightful and detailed responses above!

Jul 30, 2020 - 10:41pm

I think early exposure in Corp Dev has a few pros:
1. You get great access to leaders in the company. This is important for 2 reasons. First, you get to understand how decisions are made and how an organization really works. This is hard to quantify, but I think you will learn things that you will be able to use/apply for the rest of your career. This exposure can also potentially help you move within the organization (the most senior employees will vouch for you). Corp Dev typically creates opportunities within other groups.
2. Depending on how the Corp Dev group is structured, you are going to learn a lot. If you execute on a few transactions and get heavily involved you will learn more about legal, HR, Sales, finance, tax, than you ever would in FLDP.

With that said, if you know you like FP&A / Corporate Finance and are fairly confident you want to stick with that, then go that route. Just know that as you move deeper into FP&A, the harder it is to move to Corp Dev or something different. Corp Dev definitely gives you more optionality, but that may not matter.

On thing to consider as well with FP&A is to make sure you are comfortable with that Q to Q lifestyle. It's a personality / interest question for you to answer for yourself. I'm not wired that way. I could never do a quarter to quarter repetitive grind, but plenty of people can and do. I'd make a horrible CFO for that reason. It's likely not an issue now, but 32 quarters in, you may feel differently so it's important to at least think about now.

Jul 31, 2020 - 12:49am

Thanks for the response.

In the FLDP we get plenty of face time with execs, they really do push that hard on and for us. And many of the rotations have us working in some regular capacity with segment CEO/CFO/COO. So exposure to leadership is fantastic. The one thing I think that seperates the experiences I'll have versus the ones you had in corp dev, is you were part of a smaller more focused team that worked with these guys versus me, where, while I do get to work with people in our exec, senior exec, VP bands, they also see my entire class, the classes before and after us as well. So its easier to blend in.

The second point is something I haven't actually thought of. The quarter to quarter grind. You're right, I don't currently mind it at all but that could be something I may not like down the line. I've thought about eventually getting out of the finance side and jumping into operations/GM type roles. But that is obviously far far in to the future.

I guess I'll have a few more things to take into consideration 5 years from now.

Jul 30, 2020 - 7:33am

Thanks for doing this. You mentioned how consultants lacked m&a skillsets and it would be hard for them if they enter at a senior level. Is there a reason then why many corporate development roles look out for consulting skillsets?

I am someone trying to get into corporate development but come from an asset management background (coinvestments). Wondering how I can spin this into a corporate development role. Thanks.

Jul 30, 2020 - 12:47pm

That's just my personal opinion based on experience of senior consultants (7-10 years consulting experience) moving into a M&A heavy Corp Dev role. I could be wrong, I just don't understand why corporations do it personally.

I have not heard of anyone moving from asset management to Corp Dev, but that doesn't even come close to meaning it isn't possible. At a high-level, I can definitely see the case/spin. You are thinking critically and strategically about what makes a good investment. That was a big part of my interview process. I think you are applying the same (or very similar) thought process into a slightly different situation. If I were you, I'd think about investment decisions you've supported and also not supported and highlight that on your resume (decisions and positive outcomes) and in the interview (things you've supported and not supported and why).

Does that help?

Jul 31, 2020 - 3:54pm
Hirchajd:

That's just my personal opinion based on experience of senior consultants (7-10 years consulting experience) moving into a M&A heavy Corp Dev role. I could be wrong, I just don't understand why corporations do it personally.

I have not heard of anyone moving from asset management to Corp Dev, but that doesn't even come close to meaning it isn't possible. At a high-level, I can definitely see the case/spin. You are thinking critically and strategically about what makes a good investment. That was a big part of my interview process. I think you are applying the same (or very similar) thought process into a slightly different situation. If I were you, I'd think about investment decisions you've supported and also not supported and highlight that on your resume (decisions and positive outcomes) and in the interview (things you've supported and not supported and why).

Does that help?

Hey thanks for the insights. Yes it is definitely helpful. I would go edit my resume for the points you raised :)

Jul 30, 2020 - 2:22pm

Thank you for this! I am in a biz val group trying to lateral internally to corp dev. Is it typical for 2-3 yr associates to lateral over into corp dev at an analyst level? Do you ever see experienced biz val hires recruited at an associate level for corp dev? Wanting to know what I could expect in terms of leveling if I were to break into corp dev.

Jul 30, 2020 - 2:35pm

It's definitely possible. I knew of 2 experienced managers successfully move to Corp Dev in our group. I believe they went to Aon. I have not heard of Senior Managers+ successfully making the switch. After a certain period of time, I think you get pigeon holed.

Jul 30, 2020 - 9:11pm

It's going ok, I wish we were growing faster. Although we launched in 2019, I didn't quit my job until Nov, so we are still relatively new in terms of a full-time focus.

I'm sure there are a ton of things that we are getting wrong and that I can improve upon as with any start-up. What's difficult is determining how large of a variable COVID is vs. what is in our control. We are still gaining users since March, but we had a few large companies hit the pause button who were finalizing purchases after a trial. It's been slow.

Our largest struggle at the moment is figuring out marketing and how to gain traction with our end markets for qualified leads, without spending tons of money on ads. We need to get more junior staff interested in the product and push internally to drive sales based on convos with our end markets. It's also a fine balance to work on the product before getting more feedback on it. We need to take a lean approach and cannot build/enhance what we think people want..

If you want to PM me, I'd be happy to hear more about your idea. Quitting to pursue this has been the best decision I have made, regardless of whether I fail or succeed. I have learned more in the last few months than I had in a long time, professionally and about myself. It's honestly changed the way I look at the world and how I define what is going to make me happy with my career. It is interesting, intellectually stimulating, difficult, fun and scary as shit all at the same time. Some days I feel incredibly confident, others I feel like the dumbest person on the planet.

Based on where you are at in your career, I don't think anyone is going to fault you for giving something a try and failing. If anything people are going to view you in a higher regard.

Take a serious listen/watch to this short video. I find it very powerful.
Find Your Passion:

Jul 31, 2020 - 4:55pm

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