This is so ridiculous.
https://americanmilitarynews.com/2021/03/us-speci…
"In an Instagram post, SOCOM said, “On Monday, March 1, 2021, USSOCOM welcomed its first-ever Chief Diversity and Inclusion Officer, Mr. Richard Torres-Estrada. Mr. Torres-Estrada has nearly two decades worth of experience working diversity and inclusion programs and activities in federal agencies."
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Duplicate thread. This hit twice.
How does one make the special operations diverse?
By lowering the standards.
I think its more about actively recruiting non white people to join special forces.
In that case it shouldn’t be called “special operations.” All these fucking diversity retards fixing things that don’t need fixing.
Unfortunately at the current size of the military, it is being treated as some sort of federal jobs program. SOCOM generally operates autonomously, but they unfortunately still need to answer to whoever is in office. It's a shame, really.
Really doubt they'll start including tranny door-kickers in the 75th though lol
You should listen to some Andy Stumpf podcasts. He’s former DEVGRU and has said as autonomous as it is, it’s still part of the big Navy. Even DEVGRU and CAG have their inventory stuff and uniform stuff to deal with. That was eye opening for me.
Cleared Hot is one of my favorite pods actually, he has some pretty cool people on.
The special forces community is literally starving for people. They're recruiting literally everybody. If you can find it, Tim Kennedy speaks about how SF is having harder times finding people that meet qualifications. No arrests, no drug use, GT over 110, upper percentiles for ACFT, etc. 1/3 of the U.S. is obese. Crime stats and obesity stats are even much worse for latino and black populations.
I recently read “Left of Boom”, which is about a CIA Case Officer in Afghanistan. He blatantly says that a large amount of the intelligence community is Mormon because it’s difficult to find people who haven’t smoked weed and haven’t been into any trouble. Kinda interesting
I've read that book twice. So good
This says more about a crumbling American culture than it does anything else. But no one will touch any of these issues, so diversity and lower standards here we come! Simply put, we’re not really a serious country anymore, and I’m certain that we will be left in the dust by century unless the tide turns really quickly.
This affects our combat readiness. We have to set a certain standard for our elite troops.
Which is? Easy to throw around those terms. When you figure out exactly what those standards are, and exactly why they're being watered down in the name of diversity, come back. As noted on many other threads, the US "justice system" is horrifically prejudiced against people of color. Seeing as one of the hurdles to clear for being in the special forces is no criminal record, it means that yes, maybe the military is actively discriminating, even if unintentionally.
One of my relatives works for a defense contractor. He told me about a contract they were working on, the reworking of a portable element of a certain weapon, so that it could be made out of a composite material instead of steel. The reason was that the steel version was too heavy for women to lift. This was a fairly obscure thing, not something that would be covered in a news article, but it was costing tens of millions of dollars.
Here comes Ozy! Getting ready for him to pick fights with the multiple veterans in this thread alone who have claimed watered down standards and morale due to endless diversity bullshit. Keep on rocking you feisty SJW!
Many of us in the D.C. area have friends who were or are in the military. There has always been a lot of politics in rising the ranks of leadership, but our 4-star generals of today are nowhere near the starred generals of the past. It didn't just start today--for years now (decades?) you've had to be fairly politically correct/woke/whatever to rise the ranks. We have an entire leadership apparatus that is totally disconnected from the people they lead. What's a little scary about today is how you can actively see how the left is Venezuela-izing the U.S. military--they are in the early stages of purging their political enemies from the armed forces and creating a professional left-wing bureaucratic class that will remain regardless of the administration in power.
Although the American left is full of women and effeminate, limp-wristed, pencil-necked geeks, the Latin American left has been able to militarize actual fighting age and fighting capable males against political opponents. I'm curious what the next few decades will look like--if the American left is able to fully take over the military with a bunch of pussies who don't even believe in capital punishment and who look at the military as a social justice experiment. It will be an interesting dynamic to watch play out over the coming decades.
This is not necessarily a bad thing. First, great generals are borne out of great wars. We haven't had any great wars recently. Second, the commanding general/admiral in each major conflict has been competent and will be remembered in history books. Schwarzkopf in the first Iraq war, Westmoreland in Vietnam, McChrystal in Afghanistan, Petraeus in Iraq. Lastly, General Mattis does in fact have the star power of the generals of yesteryear. Waving the military service requirement for him to serve as SecDef was remarkable and he did deserve that. The last time we did that for someone was for Geroge C. Marshall. On the other hand, waving the requirement for the current SecDef Lloyd Austin, was total bullshit. Obviously motivated by the politics since he is black.
On a side note, the SecDef is supposed to be a civilian. I hate how ex-military officers have been hogging the post recently.
100% of starred generals in today's armed forces have gotten there via politics. 100% without an exception because that's the only way to do it today. That's often been the case in the past, too, but the politics of the day are different than in the past. Today, you can only rise the ranks by being PC, and that is only going to get worse in the coming years. Denying reality is not going to make it go away.
Long post.
As an Army guy, I always see outsized civilian response / criticism to these types of headlines. Do not worry when you see stuff like this.
The majority of the focus of this diversity and inclusion guy is going to be getting more diversity for the support jobs for SOCOM. There is NO chance that the lower-level leadership (battalion and below) of those 'cool-guy units' is going to lower the standards for the door kickers in Ranger Regiment, SF, CAG, SEALs, etc. No one who cannot pass the selection process will make it to those jobs. Ever.
So you then tell me, "Dude, the support jobs for SOCOM are important. Reducing the standards of the people supporting the door kickers will also reduce the efficacy of the door kickers." True, I do not disagree. But let me tell you a story:
I was recently at Airborne school. The Army has reduced the standards of the Airborne school since the Pentagon announced its need for more qualified parachutists in the Army. They took away the PT test, stopped dropping people for falling out of runs or otherwise being physically or mentally unprepared. Airborne school, if you are in decent shape, is the easiest course in the military. Airborne school is also a must-pass for almost every SOCOM pipeline for every branch: Navy, Air Force, Marines, and Army. I was at Airborne school with a female non-commissioned officer (NCO) from the US Navy who needed to pass Airborne to go be part of a SEAL team support staff. She fell out of every run and constantly complained about the easy physical requirements. Every officer & NCO in our platoon would constantly talk in her vicinity about how sad it is that she is a leader in the US Navy and falls out during 1/2 mile runs. For two weeks, we would constantly talk about, in her vicinity, how she was weak-hearted, embarrassing, a quitter, etc. with enough volume she could hear us. The pressure got so much for her, she dropped before jump week.
This phenomenon happens everywhere with the higher achieving people in the military. We police our own. We directly and shamelessly belittle complainers, fatties, and incompetent servicemembers.
Is it because we are mean or cruel? No. Is it because we do not like them as an individual? No. Do we question how well they can do their job if they cannot maintain personal discipline by running on the weekends and not looking like they participate in eating contests every weekend? Hell fucking yeah we do.
We do it because we care about the lethality of our military. Just because the Pentagon lets standards fall as a new policy, does not mean I am letting it go with the people I interact with on a daily basis. To me, giving up standards in one area is giving up standards in every area. Just because you are in a support role, does not mean that I expect anything less out of you. Just because the Pentagon sets these idyllic goals for the broader military, does not mean they can stop me from identifying and pushing out weak-hearted and weak-minded people at my level. Trust me, I will. While there not might be deployments right now, they will come eventually. When that happens, I only want the best door kickers in my platoon and the best support people when I need ammo dropped, my soldiers stitched up, or my comms fixed. The vast majority of us deeply care about lethality and improving the organization from within, regardless of what the Pentagon posts on Twitter.
Interesting point about policing from within. I suppose it's a great function that the 75th has RFS capabilities to maintain the same level of readiness.
I agree. It is a great function.
The problem with Venezuela-izing the military is that eventually--in the coming decades--I am 100% sure that a leftist president will order his leftist generals to go after the American public. The question is, what will the common enlisted man do when ordered to attack or kill his own people? In Venezuela, the enlisted men do as they are ordered. I absolutely believe that the typical enlisted man will do as they are ordered (as is the case almost every time in human history). I do not believe for 1 second that an American enlisted man possesses some kind of special "character" that will prevent this from happening. If Covid-19 has shown us anything it's that the vast majority of Americans don't even believe in the basic freedoms of the United States if those freedoms conflict at all with their comfort level. So the pool of people that the military is taking from consists of nothing more than Europeans geographically located in North America.
I think, at this juncture, I am completely ok with gutting the U.S. military budget and leaving the world policing to China (China is going to find out how much it sucks to spend incomprehensible sums of money being the global superpower and hated for every action they take to stabilize the world). I don't trust this new poisonous version of the American Left with military power.
You are really getting carried away here. The officer cadre swears to protect the constitution. If there is any obvious, overtly political act the top brass would not follow through with it. See how Mark Milley and the other joint chiefs put out a statement saying Biden WILL take office despite Trump's tantrums. You can expect that same spine if a leftist president does anything to undermine our democracy.
+1 SB'd
The policies from the top can be whatever they want, but the people who actually do the fighting will not accept people who cannot do the job. Especially when you are hundreds of feet underwater, deep into seas you should not be in, and away from any apparatchiks.
I also love the point about support staff. I would still like to stress that support staff are designated as support for a reason. It really is a simpler job and you do not need to be that capable to do them. Same thing applies to unrestricted line (SEALs, submariners etc. ) vs restricted line officers (doctors, lawyers, supply etc.) Being an admiral lawyer in the Navy takes a tenth of the skill it takes to command an actual warship out at sea. In other words, its difficult to fuckup in a support role. You have to be really really bad to suck in a support role.
Agree with your points, but your thinking is near-term. These political maneuvers will slowly erode the competence and lethality that you and your brothers value, and you’ll barely even notice it in real time. 20yrs from now I am certain things will be much worse.
This is just wonderful guys. Building back better!
Russia and China are eagerly watching these developments.
As a former Army combat arms guy, I wouldn’t join right now. Don’t regret it in the past (was 10+ years ago), was good at it and liked it, come from a line of military people on both sides, but genuinely believe the blue wave / pc agenda that we’ve seen in the last ten years is distressing. Defund the police, BLM, riots, PC garbage, affirmative action, dismantle capitalism - nah bro I’m sweet. I’d prob move countries before joining again and genuinely feel bad for patriots that are in right now. That’s one persons opinion - if you weren’t ever in don’t try and come at me.
It's not that bad man. I was a submariner.
Most people in the military are still red. The upper cadre is definitely being poisoned by all this 'anti-racism' stuff, but the only commands who have time to waste on that shit are the non-operational ones. When you have a mission to execute, ship to drive, or plane to fly, no one cares about 'equity.' You will quickly get axed if you aren't up to snuff.
That being said, I agree with you that its difficult to be openly patriotic. The amount of Americans who openly hate their own country is astonishing. Recently when Nike raised concerns for the treatment of Uyghurs in China, Chinese social media influencers started posting themselves burning Nike sneakers online. That's how much they love their government. I could not imagine that kind of thing happening in the U.S. All the self-hate is quite sickening.
That’s my point though. >50% of the military is red (and I’d guess a much higher portion of actual trigger pullers/combat arms guys are red) and are defending people that hate their country and aren’t willing to join themselves. I don’t have much else to say on it like I said that’s one persons opinion.
Yes...the Chinese blindly defending the genocide their government is waging is something the American people should aspire to do!! Agreed!!
China is going to clean our clock in the next war.
I don't think there is going to be a war. It's going to be the bully at the bar taking away your girl without you putting up a fight. Frankly, the American public is so soft, lazy, greedy, and depraved that as a nation we shouldn't be leading the world. The American public, in its greed, is willing to mortgage the livelihoods of future generations to pay for goodies today for itself. Fuck this generation.
Good times create weak men...
But in honesty, I don't see a full-blown war occurring with a near-peer anytime soon. The current battleground is in trade wars and whatever they can hack to disrupt the other's infrastructure or supply chain. Will probably just be proxy wars fought in shit-hole countries just like it has been since WWII. The loss of life and destruction would be so catastrophic that I don't think even China would enter a war with the U.S.. China and Russia know they don't need to invade the U.S. to destroy us. They only need to sow distrust in the democratic system and hurt the economy with a trade war. Decades of blue-collar jobs moving from the rust belt and the opioid crisis does enough damage without even needing to shoot a single bullet.
FUCK THIS. China won.
I'm learning Chinese starting today.
This is you at the Chinese restaurant isn’t it:
https://vm.tiktok.com/ZMeUWd9Hm/
Thank god Biden wasn't listening to the woke, amirite?
Take responsibility for what you did. I told you so.
Can you learn to STFU?
You don't even live here. Stop obsessing over what's happening in another country.
You must have a budding social life I bet.
I was in the Army and got out and went to school on the GI Bill. After graduating I really strongly considered Officer Candidate School and returning as an officer. I went through the entire process, the security clearance, the medical exam, the letters of rec, the application, all of it. I ultimately was offered a non-active duty OCS slot but walked away. Pissed the recruiter right off, that's for sure. But I just don't want to be in the military again. Too much forced diversity, too much anti-white and anti-men agendas, too political. It was like that when I enlisted but in the past few years they've doubled down and gone overboard.
I knew as an officer half my day would be making powerpoints about whatever SJW policy the military is forcing now, and it just wouldn't be worth it. At least in the civilian world I am around that shit but I can ignore it better and quit a job whenever I want.
Isn't it assumed that most of the active military (or at least SOF) is republican? And I highly doubt these SJW's are enlisting in swaths either, so the effect should be minimal right?
Either way, since the article is on SOF, I can bet almost every single one of those "cool-guy units" are conservatives, even the latino and black operators. Hell, google Remi Adeleke and tell me he's a liberal. I just don't see how the liberal agenda could flood into these elite units when your stereotypical liberal either 1) wouldn't enlist in the first place or 2) would not make it past pre-pipeline training.
Military guys please correct me if I am wrong on the above. But I would figure most liberals in the military are your regular sailor, cook, quartermaster, etc. I've yet to hear someone with a liberal agenda on any SOF-related podcasts (besides when Shawn Ryan debated one).
Leftists have been fighting in wars since the French Revolution and have a record of prolific murder of soft civilian targets.
Perhaps, but are these leftists passing pipeline and becoming SEALs, Green Berets, etc? That's why I have a hard time believing the elite units will suffer from this mess. I could be wrong though.
The military is overwhelmingly conservative, yes. The break down is interesting. Whites typically join combat arms roles like infantry, combat engineer, cavalry scout, etc. The logistics, cooks, suppy, mechanic jobs are mostly blacks and other minorities. In my battalion you could walk into Alpha company which was an infantry company and see a small handful of non-whites, but walk to Golf company, our supply company, and see only a small handful of whites.
Many of them joined for the Camaro and a steady paycheck. Most women we met were single moms. So there is a very obvious divide between roles and the kinds of people that join them. Pushing diversity and women is ultimately futile as the same people will always go for the same jobs. No matter how much you try to force it, infantry companies will still be majority conservative whites, supply companies will be mostly liberal blacks and the Hispanics and Asians fall in the middle somewhere.
Most people in the military hate all this political SJW shit and for many it's actively turning them off from joining or reenlisting and staying in. I know people personally from my time in who just got so tired of it all that they chose to get out and get on with their lives. I know a few also, such as my best friend, who planned on joining but were so turned off by all the forcing of political shit they just decided not to. I truly feel those pushing the SJW agenda to the military are so detached from reality that they don't realize it's actually hurting them by pushing away people who would otherwise join or stay in and be good soldiers.
I don't see this changing at all and only getting worse under Biden and then Harris when Biden inevitably steps down soon.
Thanks for the inside perspective.
Makes sense that the SJW movement is keeping good, quality soldiers out as opposed to SJW's joining these elite units. Unfortunately, I am also afraid that it will only get worse. We are too far gone at this point.
Biden has already referred to Harris as President at least a few noteworthy times. For all we know, she’s probably already driving the decisions at the White House.
Of course my experiences are all anecdotal, but I was in long enough to see it go from bad to worse. Crusty Iraq war vets would make fun of my basic training, but now I'm making fun of the current state of recruits and their basic training. And not just in a "my time was better than yours because I say so" kinda way, but in a "holy shit, how did it get so bad" kinda way.
This new extremism training the military is forcing down people's throats in addition to full blown SJW nonsense is just another example. You are literally training these young people how to kill other humans and to do it efficiently, but then turn around and tell them not to hurt people's feelings with their words and that they should feel bad about having white skin for reasons.
I'm ranting, but the situation is getting ridiculous and I am glad I got out when I did and made the decision not to rejoin when I was considering
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