Associates will get VP promotes with zero deal experience?
Does anyone see an issue with this / has this been the case in the past? I’m at a large BB and it’s not uncommon for 3rd year associates to be “tracking” towards VP with zero M&A experience. How can that be possible? Someone can be trusted to run a process with no experience?
Maybe they were on partial or failed processes, but regardless isn’t the failure to execute a deal from beginning to close a sign of sub-par performance?
This is not the case for all groups, but for some of the weaker/slower groups with bloated headcount.
Not ideal but what can you do. Know alot of people in this boat at lower tier BBs.
What’s even worse is having senior VPs and Directors who dont know how to run a process, which is a disaster for juniors who have to scramble to re-work things constantly
BoA?
every group is bloated at the ASO3 level these days so that's the norm. None of my associates have closed a deal in past few years.
How is failing to execute a deal from start to finish a sign of sub-par performance for an associate? The associate has very very little impact on whether a deal closes. Most deal failures have nothing to do with the bank’s performance.
i mean VPs run the process, so i think it would be helpful if they understood that process well
helpful yes. They're not going to be the decision maker on the parts that matter.
100% agree. Maybe the most senior person on the deal has some influence (Head of M&A for your region etc. Or maybe head of the coverage group), but anyone below that has zero impact
Generally (especially in this market / in bloated groups), seniors have their pick of the litter in terms of which associates they want to staff on live deals. Generally, weaker swimmers aren’t chosen and just get stuck with pitches while the good associates repeatedly get cranked and get all the deal experience.
So I would assume there is a positive correlation between an associate’s performance and how many announced/closed deals are under their belts, but correct me if I’m wrong. It seems weird to me that someone with no deal experience who is likely i) a bad performer and ii) never has run or even seen a process from start to finish would get promoted to the “quarterback” execution role of a team. Maybe I’m being too harsh though.
OP did say “failure to execute a deal from start to finish” implying that these associates do get staffed on deals but just don’t get to close them.
I agree with your point about good performers being staffed on more deals but OP is making a link between ASO’s deals closing and ASO performance, 2 things that have nothing to do with each other.
It's not ideal but not the end of world.
If you get to exclusivity and the management team decides to walk away or if you have an announced transaction that doesn't get regulatory approval, from a skillset standpoint, you're getting 99% of it. It's not like anything the associate does between signing and closing even moves the needle.
I'd be much more concerned with an associate that's been on several closed deals that doesn't seem to have absorbed anything (i.e., your comment on a deal falling apart somehow being the associates fault (or even the VPs) suggest you have no idea how any of this works.)
Youre on to something here but I tossed you MS because of this gem: "Maybe they were on partial or failed processes, but regardless isn’t the failure to execute a deal from beginning to close a sign of sub-par performance?"
I literally can't imagine a realistic fact pattern where a junior banker's performance scuttled a deal. I promise you said banker would *not* be on track for anything other than the unemployment line. Taking fees away from senior bankers is not the path to career success in investment banking
At the bank I work at, seniors have their pick of the litter in terms of the associates they want to staff on their live deals. Generally, the weak swimmers have no deal experience because they are not picked by the seniors to run the process. So they get stuck doing pitches constantly. They’re basically the “B team”, so I don’t see how or why they’d get promoted to a lead execution role if they’re i) likely a weak performer and ii) have never run, or even seen, a process from beginning to end.
Is it not like this at other banks?
In Europe, people are scrambling to keep a few reasonably good associates on board since the exit wave (and previous thinning of the herd) emptied the pool of 3-6y exp… talking from EB experience, I also cannot imagine these scenarios where the most sought-after level (more experienced than analyst, yet still deep in deliverables and actually producing models/decks) is “idle” the whole year and not staffed on stuff, even if lower probability… have to (almost) literally fight for getting associates on my stuff since each of them has >5 live deals.
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