Edited: made my decision and am very happy with it. Appreciate all the helpful comments on this post and hope it might help someone else in the future :)
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You have to tell us which groups...
Unfortunately, they were all generalist offers, so can't say much more on that front.
No as in Capital Markets, Classic, Financing, etc. Are they all IB/Classic?
I got placed in FIG. They give generalist offers??
Classic for GS, general for both MS and JPM (edited for clarity)
I know this sounds rote but just take GS. Their return offer rate is a little lower than MS or JPM, but it's not terribly bad, and if you got offers at all 3 you're probably more than capable enough to get a return.
The culture at GS is a little bit cut-throat and competitive, but it's Goldman and being there will open more doors down the road all things being equal. Also, the Classic offer guarantees you won't get stuck in Capital Markets groups, unlike JPM. And since their M&A is done mostly by the coverage groups, you're much more likely to get quality M&A exposure than if you didn't get M&A at the other firms. Also, the building and area downtown is much quieter and nicer than midtown, especially MS which is right in the middle of the Times Square cesspool.
MS has a very bro-ey, athlete culture and isn't doing as well lately in terms of deal mandates, overall performance, etc. Obviously still very top, but isn't giving GS/JP/BAML as much of a run for their money as they typically have.
JP is cool, good firm in general. Some groups have amazing culture, some have absolute shit culture with asshole MDs who have a stick so far up their ass I'm surprised it's not coming out their mouth. But idk, GS is better in pretty much every way unless you really want to be at a big universal bank.
cipranis Go with GS. It will play the best if you don't get a return offer and it's the best place to go FT when that offer comes. GL.
Note: other shops are very very good and you may get a better overall experience. But that's not really the point at this stage.
Both are generalist positions
Is JPM, GS and MS all structured the same (wth regards to IB)? (Originally Posted: 04/21/2012)
At first I thought that a job in IB meant that you specialize within one division, like M&A, Equity Capital Markets, Debt Capital Markets, Leveraged Fin., etc. You would eventually have to choose one of those areas. For example, you choose M&A and work on all M&A deals across all industries. But, I just talked to a JPM guy and he says he actually specializes in an industry, and does everything related to that industry (i.e. he works in Healthcare, but does M&A, ECM, DCM, etc. all within Healthcare).
Is this how it is at all the BB investment banks? You actually specialize by industry coverage, and do everything related to your industry? Any additional info is also helpful.
How did you get a generalist offer? I got placed into a specific group at one of them and I really don't like the group
How did you get a specific offer? Did they let you know over the phone? They didn't specify anything on my end.
Wtf I wish I have a generalist offer. My offer says Financial Institutions
All three of these firms hire generalist for NYC
They're not. JPM and MS both have separate M&A product groups. The coverage groups do get to do some of the M&A and offerings in their industry, but they work with the product groups (M&A, capital markets) to execute the deals. GS does not have a separate M&A product group, meaning M&A is all done in-house in each industry group.
Yes, it seems that MS has its ECM, DCM, Lev. Fin. in one unit (called Global Capital Markets), and then the rest of its IB activities in another (called Investment Banking). But then, if you click on the investment banking unit, they talk about "underwriting of equity and equity-related transactions, corporate debt issuance". But isn't that what ECM, DCM, and Lev. Fin. does?
Here is the link: http://www.morganstanley.com/about/careers/ourbusiness.html
My offer says FIG
So, for MS and JPM, M&A has its own division where they do all M&A across all industries, and then they have coverage groups for the rest of their IB activities like ECM, DCM, etc.? What does coverage group do then?
And just to clarify, GS does do what I thought, above? They have industry groups that focus on one industry such as Healthcare that does everything IB that relates to Healthcare, right?
They also break down coverage differently. It's subtle, but could be substantial based on where you want to go. For example, JPM covers chemical companies out of Natural Resources, but at MS/GS it's out of Industrials I believe. Little things like that.
Even though JPM and MS have M&A groups, many groups still do their M&A in house. For example, FIG at JPM and M&T at MS do their own M&A.
Everyone will tell you they do their M&A in house on their coverage group.
From what I have heard, most of the times the reality is that (in the case of a platform with both M&A groups and industry coverage groups) they both share the work, with M&A taking the lead of the execution and the coverage group managing the client relationship.
The degree of execution that the industry group will handle depends on the workload of the M&A group at the moment of the transaction.
This is true.^
But I know what Mossy said about MS M&T is true as well. Some industry groups actually do their own M&A 100%. Things differ by bank and group so you're best off asking directly.
GS, JPM and MS keep saying they're the best but GS doesn't even care
Damn man, congratulations on getting all 3 offers... that's insane
Whichever keeps you closer to industry/advisory rather than financing. There isn't that much of a difference in compensation, but there's a big difference in content.
GS TMT OR BUST !!!11
don't go to Chase or Mitsubishi... go to Warren Buffett!
Jokes aside, I would reach out to groups you are interested in at each bank. See if you will fit in well, then pick your offer accordingly.
I agree that you should probably just take GS. The whole idea of seeing which groups you get along with doesn't seem to make a lot of sense to me. I don't think there's that big of a difference and frankly think you'll find it difficult to differentiate in such a short period of time anyway.
It's a bitch to recruit out of Goldman. You really got to do the whole repeated doctor appointments or family illness thing
All I can add is that as a former GS employee, it does make a difference. I started there out of college, and people are more interested in that than in any other career stop that I've had, and I left GS in 2004. As an entrepreneur I get asked about my background all of the time so it comes up pretty regularly.
It's a cliché, but I'd recommend that you go for the group with the nicest people. Assuming all else equal, GS continues to hold the best brand value, and so I'd go for that.
Congratulations on your offers and best of luck.
MS
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