Just taking a temp check throughout the community.
AN1 at a MM bank. Started in June this year. The one live deal I was on is on hold and haven’t been on a staffing other than some random non-rev projects since. Been leaving at 5pm everyday for nearly a month with no after hours work.
Seems to be that way across the team unless they were already on an active engagement. Those who have deals closing/closed recently are in a similar situation.
What’s it like for you folks?
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At a MM bank as well. Similar for me
im at one of weakest BB’s in coverage and i do like 3-4 hours of work everyday lol its weird tho cuz some ppl in my group get sweated still. maybe they pinpointed me as weak analyst already lol only 2 months in tho so idk
My situation is similar. Our top senior analyst is still working like a madman while the rest of us are kinda in a weird limbo.
Not sure how we could be pinpointed as “weak analysts” so early into the gig. Didn’t even really have a chance to actually fuck anything up to be placed in bottom bucket. Weird.
Well, if it’s a senior analyst still getting crushed they could largely be working on legacy revenue generating projects, i think across the board pipeline for new transaction specifically is decreased. I’m at an EB and the mix between consulting like general advisory work and mandated transaction related work is probably 70/30 with pretty much all the transactions being ones that have been in motion for months now.
As a first year if you’re getting crushed right now it’s likely spreading you across a lot of that non essential consulting like work as seniors try to drum up business in a very tough environment. Public markets are closed so BBS are feeling the BS as well, but it will take a couple quarters before enough assets become distressed sells as they run out of money. Probably won’t see new processes really ran up until end of Q1’23 and that’s ambitious.
Nah you're fine that is normal - you just haven't been staffed yet. I don't know about layoffs as my IB years were before all this, but that alone isn't something to worry about.
At an EB/MM, just started in August. Have been on 3 live deals but one has closed and another may close in the next few weeks. honestly we've been really busy and finishing any time before 10pm is a blessing with the exception of a few random days where I've been lucky
At a Barclays BAML Citi BB in NYC and I’m putting in 80 hours a week.
Friends at other BBs also in the same boat not sure how everyone at MM banks are chillin
Y’all some lucky guys man
I’m getting smoked this job ain’t it
Also at an MM and have been experiencing the same - leaving around 6/7 nearly everyday
Some perspectives here from a senior VP.
There’s definitively less activity across products and banks. You should expect some level of layoffs.
Having said that, I’ve been observing in my group and also with colleagues at my bank and other banks (MM, EB, BB), the same phenomenon of some folks leaving early and having nothing to do while others are very busy.
My assessment (also shared with many at my level) is that the newest ANL/ASO classes are particularly weak (obviously there are individual exceptions), that juniors learned very little during their COVID-affected internships, and that the culture of WFH is hindering their learning, even several months or an year into their roles. And that results in seniors relying only on the juniors they know, or quite frankly, giving shit work to the new juniors and doing a bunch of stuff themselves.
When I was a junior (many years ago) I was cranking until midnight on a consistent basis. If had nothing to do, sometimes juniors would just stay around “just in case”, and would get themselves busy either reading/learning about a product/sector or practicing their technical skills.
One junior in my class went over a couple of model templates and cleaned them up, put some nice switches, created some cool outputs, etc. Others created templates from scratch to avoid manual work.
You need to continuously train yourself to run a marathon. You can’t expect to perform well on live deals when those show up if you’ve been doing 9-5 every day
From a new analyst’s perspective, I will continue to milk the free time I have to enjoy life and spend time with my friends. This is just a job, not my life. That doesn’t make me a “weak” analyst though. I can’t speak for the rest of these new analysts, but I think you’re right that WFH culture has changed a lot of things.
But what you might see as a fault, I see as junior bankers knowing not only their worth, but also how little our banks truly care for us. Covid showed us that life is short and fragile, and nothing is certain no matter how hard you work
Thanks for taking the time to read & provide your perspectives. Always great to see more senior folks give their thoughts in these threads.
While I see what you mean, I echo a lot of what the other response said. We’re in a different time now. Our $100K+ salaries just don’t stretch like they used to. To expect folks to stick around after hours with no real work to do is pretty out of touch with the actual world we live in now, respectfully. Additionally, with the amount of people out there working corporate jobs in tech/sales/tech sales making our salaries with actual WLB, it drives my point even further.
Majority of us AN1s are here to get the experience and leave. Unless your goal as an AN1 is to be the next 30 year old MD or next associate at a top-PE fund, it’s quite unrealistic to expect these new AN1s to care enough about the job to do all this “practice” work you mentioned.
Appreciate that. When I joined the industry I felt lucky and privileged to have this job, and was willing to sacrifice a lot on the personal side for it.
You mentioned many reasons why juniors today don’t feel the same way. I understand those reasons.
But at the same time, I appreciate the consequences of the current environment: the learning curve is not that steep, and after 6-12 months you still have juniors that can’t really model, or that take a long time to deliver a product with too many mistakes, or that don’t know how to spread a comp. And as a result these guys end up getting fewer staffings, and of lower quality, while the good ones end up getting crushed.
We all know who is gonna get fired first.
Incidentally, heard the same issues from a client at a mega fund, who can’t wait to fire some associates that don’t understand the job. Those analysts that were milking their free time and didn’t learn much are the ones that are on path to getting fired also on the buy-side
Yeah catch me never “practicing my technical skills” till midnight in the office when I can go home and spend time with my family and friends and do things that actually matter to me. This try hard mentality is why banking sucks. The bank will fire me and not think twice so why would I ever give them more than the bare minimum?
Recently left banking after 2.5 years, but the newest AN1's in my group were shockingly pathetic, dipping out early, unresponsive past certain hours, and just not very smart/driven (like legit would refuse to do work). This sentiment was echoed at other groups in my bankas well, and is a complete 180 from the mindset we had in our internship and first year on the desk. These guys will get exposed so fast in PE lmao, go get that job in "tech sales" if its so fun and great.
Fuck PE, I don’t wanna work IB hours after my analyst stint lmao
So yes I will genuinely enjoy my tech sales job or whatever else still pays me six figures while giving me the time, freedom, and sanity to enjoy what really matters in life
I’m admittedly not too in tune with the Tech sector, but isn’t general sentiment that the decade long gravy train is over? How many of these lucrative tech sales roles will be there over the next couple years as recession rolls in?
There’s some saltiness in your response. I was really just trying to open a forum for discussion. But since this was your approach, I will take the same.
I think your saltiness derives from getting fucked in the ass for 2.5 years and being too scared to actually stand up for yourself. Your subordinates who came in after you aren’t appearing to put up with the same shit. Are some of them lazy and incompetent? Sure. But the corporate world is changing. Your “misery loves company” attitude is something I can’t wrap my head around across all these threads.
WLB has eased its way into every industry but this. Those that are more technically demanding, at that. Your mentality is the reason why nothing has changed, and those trying to inflict that change are met with hardos like you who think because they sat under fluorescent lights for 100hrs a week are owed respect. You have an excellent career, but you are a fool. Sorry.
started at MM in July and I'm on 3 live deals, plus a few other things that come up
At a MM and a deal just got killed that I was working on, I’m getting really bored now, some days I’m busy from the moment I get in til 10pm others are looking at my emails til 5 lol. Pretending to work is worse than anything I’ve experienced. It low key makes me anxious with the amount of layoffs going on right now
At an MM and pretty regularly doing 15 hour days. Probably 80 hours a week is normal.
Definitely feels highly group dependent. I'm pretty sure some one of the other groups is under 50. Good for them, I'm sure that's a sweet spot to be in.
It’s quite variable for me (at a BB). Some weeks I barely even log in, other weeks I’m getting cranked until 1am every night.
AN1 at a second tier bank in London, and the same. The past 3 weeks have been extremely quit, entering office at 9:30 - 10ish, leaving around 6, no work at all on weekends. Most other analysts are in a similar position.
AN1 at a BB coverage group - entire group is getting killed rn with fairly consistent 2 am or later nights and full days of work on weekends. Not sure if it's MDs desperate for deals or if what. The class was definitely smaller this year so that may be a factor.
mostly pitching? what's the deal mix if not
what are people's hours like now? I'm on one deal while other first years on my team seem to be on multiple
I’ve been averaging 4 hours of sleep over the past 8 months. I finally managed to get a legacy deal off my plate that had been live for almost a year. We’ve been seeing significant uplift in our sector and quite frankly I’m a few weeks away from losing my shit. I’m staffed on 4 live deals, two of which don’t have an associate as we are massively understaffed. The truth is that things are going to get worse in the summer when everyone starts leaving for PE. I’m not sure how big my bonus needs to be to make this all worth it and getting promoted won’t improve much since associates are currently stretched thinner than analysts.
In the meantime, I keep getting inbounds from college kids with a 100% conviction that this is what they want to do for a living.
Point is, enjoy the free time while you have it. The tide can turn when you least expect it and it only gets worse from there.
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