MBB VS BB Decision
Hi guys,
Just wanted to check-in with a second opinion. I have a couple weeks to decide between Bain and Citi IBD (don't know group yet but should have pretty good pick). Spent the summer in banking, had an ok time, but had enough second thoughts to apply to consulting as well. Pretty sure I know where I want to head, but wanted to confirm a few things. I do realize there are a couple of related topics on this subject but I'm hoping to get the most up-to-date word on the street.
In making the decision, I bucketed the following categories and just wanted some confirmation.
Banking:
Salary (pays 40-50k more)
HF exits
Less Traveling
Consulting:
Better life (extra 20 hours of life per week)
More variety of work
Stronger grad school exits
Since I do have interests in PE, the real thing that I'm trying to figure out is which path will yield better PE exits. Conventional wisdom seems to indicate that banking will place better, and a quick Linkedin search seems to verify this. However, I've been told repeatedly by various people at MBB that the differential is a result of selection bias and not placement potential. What do you guys think - solely from a PE placement perspective and everything else aside, which will be the stronger platform? What are PE funds looking for? I already have some modeling experience.
Thanks!
Why not do a similar linkedin search for people in PE with consulting backgrounds and see for yourself? I'm not being snarky, I just don't know the answer with certainty. I think that the reality is that either could get you to PE, and both can get you to top b-schools. Like in most decisions, I think this one just comes down to which job you'd rather do- you can get to where you want to go with both. That being said, in my opinion, if banking---> PE is a beaten track, why make things harder for yourself than they potentially need to be?
If you don't mind sharing, what did your second thoughts about banking revolve around? I think if they were about something like hours, you could get over that and banking could be a good pick. However, if you hated the work/would dread the thought of doing the work you'd be required to do, going into banking probably isn't worth it, even if it would make a PE exit easier (given that you would enjoy the consulting work more- if you'd dislike both equally then back to banking in my book).
Congratulations on the two offers- yours is a nice problem to have.
Understandable about wanting to get opinions from here to evade selection bias. Sorry, I can't be of much help in that regard- I'm not in PE and don't know enough about it.
The bottom line is you will stand a great chance of getting into top MBA programs whether you are an outstanding candidate in banking or consulting. Admissions depends more on your story and career progression than what industry you're in.
One thing I will say is that to my knowledge megafunds (if that's where you want to go) recruit much more heavily from banking because of the modeling skills you develop (someone correct me if I'm wrong). BB IB---> MF PE----> top b-school seems to be quite attainable.
Truthfully, you will be able to get into PE or b-school from either starting point, and I think one (consulting) would make b-school easier, and the other (banking) would make PE easier. However, none of your goals are out of reach with either so I reiterate- do what you'd enjoy more for the first few years. You'll be better at it, will stand out more, and that will translate to easier PE/MBA entry than if you did something you enjoyed less and didn't stand out as much.
One last thing- do you have consulting experience? You already know what you don't like about banking, but you want to be wary of going into consulting and accidentally hating it. If that isn't a concern, consulting may be the way to go for you- enjoy the work, top MBA prospects, and PE is certainly attainable if you decide you want it. Given you seem more certain about an MBA than PE, and consulting makes an MBA easier than IB would, that might be your best bet.
You did your SA at Citi and came out wanting to check out consulting, which pretty much answers the question for you. Take the MBB gig and don't look back.
OP should focus on doing what you enjoy. If you are interested in consulting than Bain. If IB than Citi. U should remember where you wanna end post 2 years at said firm and go from there. See what provides u with a better fit and try to find a match between the two yr goals and ambitions and the said firm goals and ambitions. Personally, I would go with Bain.
if you can't get into PE after Bain, it won't be because you're from Bain. However, it'll be a lot tougher if HF is your goal.
If you had a top group offer locked up, that would be one thing - you could grind out the two years, even though it seems like you don't want to, and hopefully go top MM PE or maybe MF (although that's somewhat of a stretch). That being said, I'm pretty sure some of their weaker groups still need headcount (HC/FIG), so theres a real chance you'd end up there if you haven't already locked up a group.
I'd say that most places you'll want to go (PE) will give you looks out of Bain. I'd recommend you go there. Seems like you'll be happier, and I doubt your exit ops will be weaker.
OP, first off congrats - this is a nice problem to have. Second, one question to consider is what PE firm would you like to pursue. I think a good group at Citi and Bain means you can get interviews with some fairly large funds. At the MM though, there are many many more PE shops, and I think in general for such places are largely made up of ex-bankers. Yes there is selection bias, but I think there's also an element of training and wanting someone who has gone through the banking model, financial models, standard deal procedures and a small team not wanting to train up someone who has potential but requires some initial help. On the flip side, there's no rocket science to financial modeling, whereas it's difficult to teach the skills you pick up at a MBB.
I think if you choose Citi, you'll be able to cast a wider net - get interest in your candidacy at more firms outside of the MFs and large funds that have big enough teams to consider MBB vs top-BB bankers. So at MM PE shops that run lean and may favor bankers for training. If PE doesn't work out, I've seen bankers move into corp dev or even (rare, but happens) consulting. And then after that they can go to B-school. Or for those that intend to switch careers, there have also been those who stay in banking for 3 years --> B-school or promote-to-Associate --> B-school.
I think if you choose Bain, you can still pursue both larger funds that value the name and MM PE or smaller funds as well. But you just need to invest some personal time to practice financial modeling to get ready for case studies and prove that you are just as technically sound and modeling-capable as banking candidates. And MBB place well in B-school like you said, so there's that.
Bain gives you the most diverse set of options, which is valuable in my mind. Either way, you should be fine.
agree with poster above who said to pick Bain and not look back.
there is a good chance your interest in PE will change. if it doesn't, it's not like Citi IBD is going to set you up for top flight PE jobs. unless you are a real star, you will be on track for okay-ish MM funds. Bain happens to have the leading PE diligence practice and will give you decent PE options if you still want them in a few years. more importantly it gives you much better overall optionality for the future (including b-school) while providing a much better lifestyle/culture. the compensation discount just isn't important at this stage.
You interned with Citi and after your banking experience you decided to apply for consulting... Go with the consulting gig and don't look back.
If PE is the ultimate goal, then by all means do banking. I recently spoke with a former Bain guy who did exit into PE, but he said that it was hard to do from consulting simply because many PE shops don't hire ex-consultants
I'm still a student so take this with a grain of salt, but I've talked to a lot of people in both industries (including at Citi and Bain). If this were a better bank it would be different, but from what I've seen Citi and Bain are pretty similar in terms of overall PE placement. You might get interviews at more funds from Citi, but there are enough consultant-friendly funds where you'll have a good shot.
I don't think the "variety of work" point is really valid though. In banking you work on a variety of financial transactions/situations, often simultaneously, and in consulting you work on a variety of strategy/ops issues, one at a time. And despite what some people say, I've heard directly from consultants that the work can be just as menial as banking. It's just a question of what you're more interested in.
Thanks for the feedback. Just a quick note, I did not summer at Citi but do have banking and PE experience at smaller shops. I did get the chance to run through a couple models at both places. I don't have any consulting experience. Really hard to say which I am more "interested in", so that will be the center of my discussions with various professionals over the next week or so.
Kanon - I read your response in detail and appreciate it. +1 to you.
Yeah in line with my point earlier about making sure you'd like consulting, keep in mind that as a first year consultant you're not going to be developing and implementing groundbreaking ideas...you simply don't have the experience. You'll almost certainly be doing the consulting equivalent of first year IB analyst work, which could also be as unenjoyable to you- don't make a decision based on disliking the menial parts of IB work without knowing what you'd be getting into in consulting.
I'm expecting menial work going in no matter where I go, but is the consulting balance really just as bad? Anyone with experience or at least intimate knowledge of both have any additional comments?
I don't know why people are saying you'll have more options out of consulting. If your goal is PE or HF, you will decidedly have more opportunities made available to you coming out of banking.
It may be helpful if the people recommending you go to Bain for the broader universe of exit options are more specific as to what those options actually are. I don't see that much of a difference, really.
B-School: yes, slightly easier coming from Bain; but its not exactly like the top b-schools are brick walled off if you do a few years in banking.
HF: You'll have a very very difficult time getting into the HF scene from consulting.
PE: There are PE shops with consulting DNA that prefer ex-consultants over ex-bankers, but they're few and far between. You're much more marketable from a banking background... by a multiple.
Corp Dev: I don't think there's any perceptible advantage here.
Regret your choice and try to lateral to the option you didnt pick: I'd probably speculate that its easier to go from banking to consulting than from consulting to banking. I haven't met anyone that's dont the latter without an MBA. We had 2 guys while I was in banking that left to go to consulting. Pretty small sample size obviously.
The question to ask is: do you enjoy the work on consulting or banking more? PE firms are not homogenous in that firms vary a lot in how much emphasis they place on making operational improvements vs financial engineering. The former type tend to place as much value on consulting experience as they do on banking experience and if you prefer consulting work, these are the types of firms you would probably target.
Marcus Halberstram gave very good advice.
I would also put it this way. Yes, MBB have recently gotten a leg up on the BBs in terms of prestige. But you're way too young to be that risk-averse. Your best shot (seriously) at getting into PE is after a banking analyst stint, and that's right now. Go for what you like. And if you like finance... most consultants I know (and I know a good bunch of them) DON'T like finance. They don't talk about it and they don't think about it, it's just a client base for most of them. Go where people will share your interests.
Think about it this way. If it goes wrong and you need to apply to b-school... You got the Bain offer, which is the most valuable part of the whole process, and the part that b-school admissions committees will certainly take note of, when you explain that you chose Citi because you wanted to chase your PE dream. Pretty hard to fault you for that.
I interned in Consulting this summer. I'd say it the working/life balance really depends on which office you are based. Same for the travel. So which office that offered you?
Just a quick update, I've signed with the consulting route. Thanks for the tips guys.
Good choice, see you on the top 30 under 30 list in a few years.
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