Moving to Switzerland
Hi,
I have a background in Quantitative Research in the HF and banking space. I started as a quant researcher/quant developer (I was doing both) in HF and later moved to a bank. I'm based in London town. I've been offered a role in Zurich. The role isn't extraordinary well paid - 145k CHF. I probably would take the role because I want to move to Europe and I've got friends in Switzerland so at least I won't be alone. I'd also reconsider permanent relocation because my lifestyle at this stage seems more suited to a place like Switzerland.
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If this does not work out and after 1-2 years I come back to London, would you think this would look bad on a CV? I mean the company has an office in London but there is no guarantee they'll let me keep the same job and move to London.
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Switzerland isn't exactly the Mecca of quantitative research. More of a wealth management place. Would you think experience from Switzerland would be looked less relevant than in London? I know it's mostly what I do on the job but I also question what the quant research is over there. Is it really quant research?
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I'm on a higher salary in London, and London (apart from rent) is relatively cheap to live in. Yeah, you can easily blow a few grand on a night out but you can also go cheap - the spectrum is huge. Any experience with relocations to Switzerland?
Any opinions or experience be appreciated no matter how short or small.
EDIT: I'd add that comparing is fairly hard. I've heard "Rent in Zurich is more expensive than London" but London is so big that it really depends. I currently live in an area which is more expensive than Zurich. I really don't know how far 145k CHF in Zurich goes. I definitely don't think I'll be struggling but have no clue what will catch me out in terms of "Oh, I didn't think about this".
Back when I used to kick around London and Zurich a lot while living in NYC, my perception was always that London was more expensive than New York and Zurich was more expensive than London, but I don't know how things are now, to be frank.
All I'll say is that if I were getting paid $145K in NYC, I wouldn't think of that as compensation that would afford any manner of above-average lifestyle, so I'd then imagine it would buy me even incrementally less in both London and Zurich.
Subjectively, I think Zurich is a cooler place to spend some time than London, so at the very least it's interesting experience and I can't imagine anyone would look down on it if you wanted to come back to London.
Interesting. I've got a few friends who came back from NY and say that rent there is a lot higher than London. At least the more central parts. It would make sense as pay in NY is generally higher.
I'd say the spectrum in London and NY is a lot wider than Zurich and you can find both more expensive and less expensive - depends on what you're looking for. Therefore, the experience varies by person.
My 2c, gf is Zürich based:
-Rents are actually not that bad, plenty of quiet places outside Zürich with a very convenient commute
-anything service related is very expensive, such as eating out, haircut
-you've probably already run the numbers but keep in mind income taxes are low, and capital gains taxes basically don't exist
I can't give much insight to quant and if this move is a good one for your career, but I would suggest that this would also be a lifestyle move. If you like the outdoors Switzerland is heaven. I suppose you need to decide whether you want to continue being ambitious and pushing your career, or if you are content to chill and enjoy life/the outdoors. I don't think anyone would discount the experience, but I do think it would be harder for you to hit promotions and seniority in Zürich (assuming you aren't Swiss German).
Many thanks. I've heard that in France, it is hard to progress up if you're not French. I've heard this from very close friends who are not French and close friends who are french. This exist everywhere to a degree. I've worked in places in London where over a few years a Chinese manager hires exclusively Chinese. I'm not blaming - he hires people he knows and naturally he knows mostly Chinese people. I've worked in groups where 30% are Italian and in my team the figure was 70%. People from other teams assumed I was Italian too because it was an open secret. Same with companies where a group has predominantly french employees. Progressing in such places just feels like going against the odds. Do you have any experience or could you elaborate about your statement about progression in a Swiss company if you're not Swiss (German)?
I'd just add my 2c. Services are not cheap in London either. A haircut at a basic barbershop from Google is around £30 (35CHF). Anything more trendy/hipster and you're looking at £60. Basic male scissors cut - I'm talking about 15 min and if you can do it in 10 do it.
For me it's more of a "Am I imagining some lifestyle that will be unsustainable on 145k.". The lifestyle I imagine is that I'll be able to easily afford a 1-bed flat and a car and driving to various European cities on weekends.
Regarding the progression, it's basically more of the same as you have described. The only personal anecdotes I know are actually positive outcomes, people who have overcome that and been successful. But they also continue to parrot the same story about 'the Swiss mentality'. You also need to consider that the overall market is smaller, so it is harder to job hop for a payrise or promotion.
Point taken regarding London - if you are used to paying a price for premium services, the prices themselves won't be so different.
You can easily live comfortably and enjoy life on that salary. Could you put kids through private school and live in a big house? No. But have a nice flat, do weekend trips, eat out and invest/save for a flat deposit? Sure. My impression from what you've said is that you won't need to make any lifestyle sacrifices.
And also as soon as you leave Switzerland (weekend road trip to Austria, Italy etc) everything is very cheap in comparison.
Lived in Zurich the last 3Y. 145k base is enough to live well, from your post it doesn’t sound like you need too much to get by.
A good apartment will set you back 3-4k, city is a lot smaller than nyc or ldn so the trade off commute/living space is not as bad as in the other cities.
In terms of career, sure nyc and ldn are the more ambitious cities, but I would argue moving from CH to ldn is harder if you had no prior experience in ldn. Also if you switch to one of the two large banks in CH it’s fairly easy to move, given most of the internationally oriented desks are run by expats or well connected Swiss. The quant teams usually work together with all the other hubs in the world, so the share of foreigners is a bit higher there too.
German helps but is not a must to progress.
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