Over the weekend I read this article in deal book http://dealbook.nytimes.com/2013/05/24/what-gets-you-up-in-the-morning/ and it got me thinking about life and finance in general. Although I'm only a junior in college and am only working as a summer intern right now at a pension fund I have begun to seriously question my goals and life plan.
From grade 10 I wanted to be a banker, I did a careers project on it, it fit my skills, it made sense and the blinder went on. Ever since then I have closed my eyes to the world around me and focused on banking. Now as I begin to really think hard I'm not sure if that's what I want.
I enjoy learning about finance and strategy in school but I'm starting to question the value to society overall that banking creates.
So I pose to you two separate questions. How do you feel about the value that you create for society in general? And know that I know that I want to contribute to something larger than myself, what are ideas where I can apply finance in a constructive manner for society.
I know I will probably be shredded beyond believe for this post but I'd like to see what the WSO thinks about this.
I will just quote what a house mom once lectured her new strippers :" creating value for society' ,those high deep bs are not for us average joes to think. they are only for those rich and powerful bastards who are bored their asses to death. So none of you should worry about that until you feed yourselves pretty well. Now, forget it and go make some damn money first"
Just couldn't help thinking about "how much value" strippers create for the society.
Bro, just because you work in finance doesn't mean you can't add value in other aspects. For me, working in finance is the means to an end of being more capable and knowledgeable of ways to help others in the long run.
Make money; slay hotties. Everything else is just conversation.
Finance (banking) creates value for society by raising capital & funding investments. You can look at it big picture or in detail. Big picture: finance funds businesses, ideas & innovation, allowing for progress in society. Details: everything from Joe the Plumber's savings account, to his mortgage, to his car loan, to his kids' student loans, finance (banking) made those things possible.
Are you philosophically satisfied with your career path now?
Haha, yes. these are all public services. I think that while these are valid "purposes" for banks to help society function, you are seriously deluding yourself if these are actually "value adding" characteristics.
rofl, personally, i don't believe in "value adding" characteristics. i'll leave it up to baby jesus to keep tabs who's done what for the good of mankind.
but if OP wants to question the validity of finance as a career path on the grounds that it doesn't add value to society, i'd argue that finance is just as "value adding" as any other field. simply put, if banking didn't add value to society, it wouldn't exist.
Yes there are certain aspects of banking that add value to society. Banking as an advisory role to help business grow is adding value. I didn't mean to single out banking as the only culprit, it was just what I was striving to be. What about PE and hedge funds? The value they add is limited and the amount they get paid is inverse to the amount they contribute. Buying cheap companies, loading them with debt and making 2 times a multiple of capital, who benefits? And sure it's important that Microsoft’s stock is adequately priced, but that only really matter when they want to raise more capital.
I'm only a junior and have no real experience with this yet so if I'm talking out of my ass let me know. I just want an open discussion and for someone to challenge my views.
If investment banks did not add value, then why would anyone pay for their services?
Once you make a lot of money you can begin changing the world. You can't change the world on someone's expense as most hippies believe.
You are talking out of your ass.
So you're content that banking adds value to society? Great. Next topic.
"that only really matter when they want to raise more capital" - Great! Happy you understand one of the more important aspects of market efficiency.
"the value they [PE and hedge funds] is limited" - according to you, they are STILL adding value...
"amount they get paid is inverse to the amount they contribute" - wonderful. If you work as a gas station clerk, and you got paid a million bucks an hour, no crap there would be an inverse relationship between salary and "value" generation. But as you said, they DO create value.
I would be happy to challenge your views, but it seems that you did so yourself.
There is really no dispute that they create value, the more important question that nobody is looking at is "who" it is creating value for.
This is a better way of putting it. PE and HF create value for the GPs and LPs but not much else. You could be part of a company that does more than that though. A company that creates products that make life better for a larger number of people, wouldn't that be more rewarding? Just referring to the article, basically contributing to something that is bigger than yourself
Adding value is such a load of shit. Well, not really, but it's a marketing gimmick to get you thinking about helping other people before you help yourself.
Get yourself in the best position possible and then you can worry about adding value. For most people that's going to be several years to decades into their careers.
One must consider who is gaining and in what form. How I see it, there are two distinct ways in which one can help society:
One can help individuals who are currently struggling. One can feed the needy and all of that to basically elevate the lowest rungs of society: the minimum, if you will.
Alternatively, one can try to elevate those who are capable of helping themselves: the maximum of society. One can fund innovation. There is a plethora of extremely bright people with great ideas who are starving for capital.
So the question becomes whether you'd rather see every person on the planet today live better, or whether you'd rather see humanity as a whole farther along in 100 years. If you're comfortable with a large variance in the socioeconomic levels of people on this planet, which I am, then you favor the latter.
Maybe it's all of the disassociates that I've done, but I don't care too much about any individual human being or group, including myself. In the grand scheme of things, we're all unimportant. What is important is the continuation and progression of humanity. So with my life, I'd like to contribute to that advancement as much as possible; preferably while fulfilling my selfish desires as well.
I view it like this: I am unlikely to be a revolutionary scientist. If I dedicate my life to a field of STEM, I'll likely end up as some mid-level researcher with a drinking problem. Meanwhile. I've met quite a few people with both a strong propensity and passion for the stuff and they could never make it in finance. So why don't I do what I think that I'll be good at and enjoy, they can do their thing, and together, we can make tomorrow a better place?
Poor people can't help poor people.
On the money, as usual.
Socrates?
Helping doesn't have to be in the form of philanthropy.
Why did everyone assume I meant poor people? Society isn't a synonym for poor people. I'm talk about companies that produce thing that people use. Why do people who enjoy finance not strive to work at GE and help a company that provides electricity for 1.5 billion people across the world. Or a similar corporation that produces tangible value to a wide range of people.
I've actually thought about this a lot. I still haven't decided if I care or not. Part of me feels nihilistic and says fuck it and part of me thinks I should try to transcend the making money at all costs attitude. I've been on this site for about a year and I bookmarked this response I gave someone who asked what you should say when an interviewer asks the infamous "Tell Me About Yourself" question.
Why did I bookmark it? I still can't tell if it's funny or sad.
Anyway, it's getting late, so I'm heading upstairs to bed via my private elevator in my townhouse.
Why would a monkey shit on this, isn't this what you're all here for?
Nah, bro. We're trying to create value for society over here.
Awesome. +1
I am definitely a net negative on society.
Figured you would appreciate this one, Eddie...
Truer words were never spoken.
Read about the Enron guy: http://online.wsj.com/article/SB100014241278873233725045784669923059866…
This is an interesting question that a lot of clever people have been asking recently.
You can take a look at these, for instance: http://noahpinionblog.blogspot.co.uk/2013/01/how-much-value-does-financ… http://www.bankofengland.co.uk/publications/Documents/speeches/2012/spe…
http://www.amazon.com/Finance-Good-Society-Robert-Shiller/dp/0691154880…
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