Pre-Workout Supplement as Pre-Office Supplement?
Anyone here who has used a pre-workout supplement like Jack3D Micro or Muscle Pharm's Assault know that they provide a serious boost in energy - likely from the 3,000% doses of various things - that far outlasts and outdoes things like Red Bull and 5-hour energy.
Has anyone ever used these in the office? How was your experience? I stopped using mine a while ago, but am thinking about getting some when I start FT.
And before any safety freaks start talking about exploding blood vessels, I'd take it in very small dosages (10-20% of the serving size) since I only take a half serving when working out any way.
Check out yeahright's comment below
disregard this comment:(Nope, I'd be careful about that though. Not because of the exploding blood vessels, but over time your body adjusts to it. If you can, switch off with something simple like coffee. It keeps your body from adjusting (or at least keeps it from adjusting as quickly).)
I've definitely done Jack3d or AmiNO Energy before work and currently am on a solid two old-formula oxy elite pros to start the day regimen. (It has some amphetamine-like compound in it that provides "focus" and was taken off the market - but you can still buy it.)
Commercial Real Estate Developer
If you are taking the old Jack3d with 1,3 dimethylamylamine, trash it now. It is dangerous for you at any dosage and has been banned by the FDA after causing several heart failures. It also destroys your ability to produce.
Otherwise, pre-workouts for work are pretty pointless. The primary ingredient that provides energy is Caffeine with a huge dose of sugar limiting the crash. Some products have beta-alanine which provide a tingling feeling that give you a sense of focus, it is a peculiar feeling if you are not used to it.
Also, now that Jack3d does not have the banned ingredient it really is a garbage product. Amino energy is like-wise garbage. Products you should consider are White Flood by Controlled Labs which is by far considered top in it's class and Muscle Pharm Assault, already mentioned. NO-Xplode by BSN is also okay for someone who reacts to small dosages and does not need a stronger product. This can be due to caffeine tolerance or just being a bigger person.
Also, do not cycle off and take things with caffeine instead, thats what you need to cycle off.... 3-4 months on and then you should take a break. You will probably get headaches for a while as your body adjusts to it, easy way to remedy this is to take Green Tea Extract supplement pills which have a tiny dosage of natural caffeine and can help as you take a break from pre-workouts.
I'd rather not poop at the office, so na
Are you kidding? I poop at the office every day, it's practically a ritual.
This. Caffeine is what gives them the energy kick anyways. It's not like you'll need any nitrous for getting a "pump" while cranking out spreadsheets. And just like caffeine, you'll develop tolerance to preworkout and have to start taking it in larger doses.
A healthier alternative would be beet (or maybe it's beet root?) juice.
caffeine vyvanse ephedrine usually what I'm dressed in
I used to take a C4 preworkout if I was getting drowsy while studying. It worked really well for me. A little stronger kick than coffee.
Preworkouts do have diminishing effects over extended periods of use however. If you ever get to the point where you're getting little returns from a full dose I'd kick it for a while.
Conversely, it is also "fucking awesome"
Just because some moron with heart problems still took it and died from it or someone didn't think that you should probably drink a lot of water with it doesn't mean it isn't "fucking awesome" either.
Commercial Real Estate Developer
True to some degree but there are alternatives that do the same without the risk. It's not like its steroids and going to make you stronger. It just "feels" more awesome.
Agree with CRE, I always use to take it and I never had a problem accept for the itchiness (beta alanine). Nothing gives one a better buzz than ephedrine/caff though. If I am ever pulling an all-nighter that stack is my go to although I agree with yeahright stating they should be used sparingly.
The problem with the jack3d is the crash. Assault works well as does C4.
With that said, I found sipping on a drink I juiced (celery, lemon, apple, etc) throughout the night works just as well and is healthy!
On a different note Hdrol works great for insomnia and you don't even feel tired the next day/crash!
I don't know why more people don't just drop by CVS and pick up some bronkaid. Cheaper and more effective than pretty much any other OTC energy supplement out there.
You mean the only legal steroid on the market? H-Drol is just a designer steroid chemically mirrored after Halodrol. Limited sides surpringly and still legal in US and UK. Still need a post cycle treatment supplement.
Granted, I've always been one for uppers, but I used to go insane with this stuff when lifting for football in college. Never found anything that came close to it. Like CRE alluded to, most people that had heart failure probably had pre-existing conditions
Hah, unlike the old-formula oxy elite though, that stuff is DEFINITELY off the market
Commercial Real Estate Developer
Still have a 90 ct bottle of the pre re-formulated OxyE...
Really though, I can attest to MP's Assault. It really is a solid product. It keeps you focused and feeling good for a few hours, but doesnt make you feel like you are floating above your own body. If not being used for serious weight training, for sure dial back the dosage.
Confirmed. Only benefit I noticed from jack3d type stuff is that when you get to the gym, you're genuinely glad to be there as opposed to "ah shit, I'm at the gym. Let me see how quick I can get outta here". If you don't have trouble getting yourself to go, there's pretty much zero benefit imo.
I second this-I'm trying to make my last tub of the old stuff last as long as possible as I ween myself off it. Whoever made the comment that it won't make you directly stronger, just more focused and "happier" to be at the gym is pretty much spot on. I have described it as the "adderall of working out."
Snorting creatine is the only way I power through a productivity slump.
Creatine isn't used for quick energy lol...
Where do you get 75% from? Like most pills, it's largely filler. But the active ingredients are 25mg ephedrine and 20mg, I believe, of some exorbitant.
The other ingredient is 400 mg guaifenesin, which is the active ingredient in Mucinex (a decongestant).
Also, ephedrine as a standalone>any stimulant based energy supplement there is. Fewer withdrawal symptoms and side effects than caffeine. Only downside is that you develop a fairly rapid tolerance.
I agree, the old jack3d was so much better than that new garbage. I'm personally a fan of DS craze, that's the closest one I've found to the previous version of jack3d.
Do you even lift brah...oh wait
only bout tree fiddy
Pretty much this. The EC stack is fantastic for energy. It also helps manage appetite, improves focus, and slightly improves lean mass retention when cutting.
The ephedrine promotes LBM retention while the caffeine does the opposite. Overall, it's a slight net positive.
Anabolic Xtreme - Slim Xtreme was absolutely awesome before it was banned. Granted it was found to have adderall in it, but man it was awesome
Isn't it techinically a pro-hormone because it needs the 3b-HSD enzyme to convert to its active form? Either its the same shit in the end
Yes, technically its a PH
Not sure, but it was very effective. my favorite + go to. epi as well
As full PH/DS cycle with PCT and support supps?
C4 is very solid -- I feel like I like it more than jack3d and the watermelon is jolly rancher wonderful.
the fat burning pills are super solid too
Why are you all on so many supplements?
Just stick to the classics. That's how dad did it and that's how America does it.
Agree with RustyFork. If I didn't know any better, I'd think everyone on here was training for a triatholon or Mr Universe. Most of this shit kills you in the long run, no matter how FDA approved or safe it is.
I only do whey, casein, and multivitamin. Thinking about adding creatine...would that help with both cutting/bulking?
Might. I was really into lifting (I called it bodybuilding at the time) for a while and know about all of this nutrition shit because of that. I've tried lots of supplements (never pro-hormones or steroids) and the difference was always either undetectable or so marginal that it hardly even made sense to take the stuff. Like, I really don't wanna remember to take my BCAAs 3x a day or to drink all of this shit in the morning.
The only that I notice an immediate effect from is stims. I used to take caffeine and ephedrine (200mg + 25mg), but I've found that I only really need 80-100mg of caffeine to be optimal usually. Unless I'm very tired. Used to take a lot of Vyvanse for studying and stuff, but I've mostly stopped that too.
I don't really even use whey powder anymore (I still work out, but not as seriously). Just lift and eat protein and you'll be fine. The best post-workout supplements are a blunt and Chipotle.
I took a final one year and a kid I kinda knew missed the whole semester, spent like 48 hours straight cramming a semester of material, did blow in the bathroom before the exam, and walked out half way through. Never saw him again.
Edit: Take fish oil. Das dat shit I do like. I take 1g 2x per day. Just not after working out because it's an anti-inflammatory.
Okay, before asking anything else, how does the guy who did blow in the bathroom factor in to any of this? Or has something flown far over my head?
Secondly, why is it that with every discussion even remotely related to fitness, someone on here feels the urge to comment about their "past experience" and "time spent" "bodybuilding" and then proceed to imbue us with some "sage advice" that, contrary to all fitness and generally practical advice, is somehow appropriate for everyone reading it? Asking WSO here. Maybe I'll start a topic on this.
On to business:
Nobody is talking about BCAAs. We're just talking about pre-workouts, which ones we like, which ones we don't like, and which might be "good" to take while working for the adventurous among us.
Nobody cares that you were "into" lifting and there's no way to vet your knowledge, so there's no use in preaching it here.
If you knew so much about nutrition and supplementation, you would know that these supplements sell for a reason. The proper thought is that "people don't use them in a way that yields optimal results," not that "they don't do anything." AKA, it's more likely that you didn't use what supplements you took properly, or expected too much, rather than that they didn't "work."
Creatine monohydrate, speaking from my own experience, is good for lifting. If you plan to incorporate heavy cardio into your routine, I don't recommend taking it. Ultimately, I think it's dependent upon the type of cut you're doing, and that it's generally good for bulking. Read up on what it does and see if it fits your overall goals.
Okay folks, thanks for all the advice. I'm going to shell out the $30 or so and get MP Assault, since I haven't tried it yet but continuously hear good things about it. If anyone is interested, I can post about it here later tonight after my workout.
I used Jack3D Micro - the new formula - since it came out, sometime last summer or fall. I have to admit that the "serving size" of 2 scoops was way too much, and made me feel like I was going to die if I worked out too hard. I once nearly passed out after an especially rigorous leg routine; that's when I decided that J3D needed to happen in smaller doses. Let's hope that MP Assault is better!
MP Assault is good, I used it in college for going to the gym. Solid focus, pump, and no crash as such (though I would usually go to bed shortly after coming back from the gym). The only downside in my mind is that it has pretty large serving sizes (because of extra ingredients and carbs thrown in) as opposed to something like Jack3d.
Heard good things about C4 and Craze as well. Also, I remember seeing assault for a buy one get one free on bodybuilding.com a few days ago.
EDIT: Just checked Bodybuilding.com and assault is buy one get one free on all sizes
I'm not sure, but I remembered about him for whatever reason so I thought I'd share.
And I never said supplements don't do anything. And most people here aren't vetted. It's an internet forum.
I was just stating my opinion that for the average person, supplements are overkill and you won't see the difference. In lifting and in life, for the average person, proper nutrition and rest far outweigh anything else you can do. Aside from steroids and actual drugs.
Supplements for work? Just go in and do the job. Take some caffeine if you're tired or need to concentrate more than usual. Office supplements? Fucking investment bankers... I hear they have an Adderall vending machine at GS.
FML lol. Just bought MP Assault at vitamin shoppe and cracked it open to see the scoop size. No refund for me. You're right though, this scoop is fucking huge. It's as big as a protein scoop. Smells really nice though, as do most pre-workouts.
I'm glad to see that you're not one of those keyboard bodybuilders. But if you're not kidding about that GS vending machine, well then lol...
I never buy supplements from GNC or vitamin shoppe, though i really only get whey protein most of the time. Amazon or bodybuilding.com always has the best prices. It's only with the occasional insane sale that vs or gnc will have comparable prices.
And yeah, Assault has a decent smell and taste, but it gets pretty old after a while. I bought 2 tubs of the blue raspberry once and was regretting not switching up flavors by the end.
Never taken for anything except physical activity, but if any of you are looking for a serious workout try Dr. Jekyll or Mr. Hyde. Dr. Jekyll is more for endurance whereas Mr. Hyde is more for strength. I've tried plenty of pre-workouts such as Hemo Rage, both versions of Jack3d, Hyper FX, along with a few others. I definitely recommend Jekyll for one cycle then switch over to Hyde. Such great workouts.
Edit: Both are usually around $35 at Vitamin Shoppe.
Great thread and topic.
Look into Alpha Brain by Onnit. Best supplement for work, focus and sleep.
You're welcome. https://www.onnit.com/alphabrain/
Speaking of nootropics, my friend said that NZT is real. Is he fucking around and I'm being a dumbass, or is that stuff real??
Edit: epic user name lol.
I wish... I've never tried the typical ADHD prescribed stuff that gets around... but some people swear it to be close to NZT. Alpha Brain is a tamer and natural boost in that direction, focus difference is noticeable for test day or at the golf course, though it does not speed you up like others do, which is good.
A couple of concerns regarding Jack3D. Note: I use this (new formula, not old) before workouts.
Don't use this to stay up in the office; it cranks you up, so you'll be more likely to lose your temper and become someone who your colleagues don't really want to be around. I've seen an analyst on this throw a dealtoy at another and then start crying hysterically only to realize his moodswings were because of taking Jack3D.
Also, if you're taking the old stuff, be careful about using it before drug test. Could result in false positives.
I've been taking preworkout for years (Superpump, Jack3d, C4, 1MR, Craze, No Xplode, and others) and don't recommend this at all - I thought this was a joke post. Here's why I don't recommend it,
1) No one really knows the side effects (especially long term). None of that stuff is FDA approved. I don't know scientifically what it does to a person, but I know through experience with myself and others that there is a definite change in the person mentally. Mood swings, less of a short term memory, trouble sleeping - all this may have an impact on your job performance
2) You aren't even using it for its purpose. Ingredients were put in there specifically for someone going through intense training sessions. Using it to sit in a chair for hours on end is waiting for a disaster to happen.
3) You will get addicted to it. If you stop taking it for awhile you won't feel the same and eventually you will become dependant on it. PWO are supposed to be cycled on/off every 8 weeks. Most likely you'll keep staying on it past the 8 weeks, which compounded with the above reasons, is an even bigger disaster waiting to happen.
4) You will become tolerant to caffeine/other energy products/to the PWO itself. A cup of coffee may as well be a cup of hot bitter water. Caffeine pills will be like tic tacs, and energy drinks will be like a can of coke. You will also notice that the first time you take a scoop of PWO, you'll REALLY notice the effects. By the fiftieth time you will not notice those effects nearly as much, and will end up upping your dosage to 1.5-2 scoops. This amount just keeps growing and growing as you attempt to keep feeling the effects of what you took the first time.
So in summary, two points from this -
1) You'll notice the above points make it sound like you are taking some sort of drug. That's because you are. Similar side effects, and similar caveats. Why not just take a bit of cocaine, at lease we know whats in it? (just kidding don't do that)
2) The PWO market is already a sketchy one. Even when used for its purpose and as directed, you are taking a risk. Read the side labels of a PWO and you'll know what I mean. When you use it for something other than its intended purpose, take higher doses (which you will), and don't actually cycle off (which you won't), it's not going to be a pretty result.
Completely agree on #1. It's a crazy workout boost, but the side effects on behavior are noticeable. Worse still is that the effect lasts for hours after you're done working out. It's like you have to plan your day around the fact that you might be a weirdo because you're hopped up on J3D.
As for MP Assault: just worked out on it and I think it's pretty good. First use, so I'm not fully acquainted with the product. However I got a great workout and no shakiness, no noticeable behavior changes (that I can see), and I think I'll even sleep well tonight. J3D definitely never let me sleep; I actually only used it if I got to workout in the AM.
You're not the only grown up in this thread. Some people are willing to do shit that you aren't. That doesn't mean that the risks are unknown to them.
You can't form a physiological addiction to workout supplements. I've taken them on and off for years and not once have I had a nervous breakdown on account of low Proprietary Blend content pumping through my veins.
Chill the fuck out. I'm asking a fun question in jest. If I can get a job at a bank, I'm fairly sure that I can judge the effect on my performance and life in general that some sugary powder with tea extract has.
You quite obviously have never tried cocaine.
Thank you for calling that puss out.
I work in banking and sometimes go to the gym during lunch (always take a PWO). There has been a few times where I've taken a couple scoops and then have gotten an email/call/other engagement which fucked up my gym plans and I personally can't say I've enjoyed trying to do work on them. The initial feeling is intense enough I actually have a hard time concentrating (I once inadvertently ran down to my VPs office and almost bulldozed the secretary).
I've taken smaller doses (think 1/3 - 1/2 a scoop) in a futile attempt to push myself further during bad hours. Unfortunately I can't say it's much more helpful than a sbux with an add shot (addy is 10x better and is less intense in many ways). Take a small dose and see what happens, I highly doubt it will result in 'disaster' as mentioned above.
Yes the risks are kind of unknown, pretty sure that's why the question was asked in the first place.
You can form the same addiction you form from caffeine. You cycle off PWO after being on it for awhile, you'll feel like complete shit for a few days. Some people can deal, others can't, I'm just putting it out there (which again was why the question was asked I'm assuming?).
Sugary powder? Have you used PWO before? I've seen PWO used for stupider reasons (mixed with alcohol as a cocktail) and unfortunately had a friend that went through some pretty bad mental issues from abusing PWO. It fucks with you if you abuse it.
No I haven't. It was a joke.
Just putting my experience out there, but if you want to have your rebellious moment, then go for it. You sound like a real hardcore dude.
That's not why the question was asked. Your reading comprehension might be off...
Caffeine and pre-workouts are not the same. And since it's not the same for everyone, here's my two cents: I feel perfectly fine after using them for a long time and then stopping.
Anyone who suffers mental problems from a PWO likely has much bigger problems to worry about.
I asked a fun question to the grown up crowd, and if the "Before safety freaks start talking about yada yada...." line in the topic didn't give it away (reading comprehension, again?), I am specifically not looking for people to preach on the dangers of using anything. If I start a thread on the best kush to use, are you going to come in and say that weed is a gateway drug and about how one of your friends got messed up using it too much?
Now please don't respond, I honestly don't care about this issue enough to give another reply. Or be a pussy and reply since you now know that I won't.
The only benefit I received from pre-workout junk was the mental placebo of thinking "well, I just took this shit, no backing out of the gym now." Most of that stuff, and energy drinks, are sugar and B12.
Take a multi V and a B12 supplement and drink some water before you go to work. That should be sufficient. You don't want to be that guy with pit stains and sweaty palms.
The best alternative is to actually lift weights before work. Get your fuckin swolle on before you crank decks and ride the endorphin high all day. The pump makes your dick look extra vascular so when your boss checks out your dick at the urinal he knows who the top dog really is.
Dunno about now, but pre-workouts were definetely not junk a few years back. Still remember when I took a scoop of SuperDump 350 and I ended up having to skip the gym and then I started shaking for an hour...after I took a massive dump of course
Interesting topic. Jack3d Micro is, in my opinion, too intense for the workplace. I have taken some of the more intense workout supplements including ALARM along with Assault, NOXplode, any I would not want to be on them when I am in a board meeting or say trying to give a presentation since most make me sweat excessively. On this note, you should be drinking a lot of water after the dose which means you will need to be running to the restroom frequently (something to keep in mind) when you need to leave a conference room 5+ times within say an hour, it does not look good. However, to study for a professional exam I am taking, I have tried AminoX which is mild (one again, in my opinion since these supplements have varying effects with different people). I assume ADHD-related medication would be a better idea since it is not geared to exercise, rather a psych-stimulant. Good call on taking the powder in smaller dosages though
Take preworkout before sex.
Tried it. It's like whiskey-dick without the ability to forget shit the next day.
+1, especially if you have something with L-Arginine. Just don't take NO-Xplode unless your girl is German and into that sort of thing.
I'm a seasoned lifter and I'd have to agree, I've seen people take things 10-20x as powerful as Jack3d and they were just fine. This probably isn't the forum to be asking these kinds of questions, 99% of the general public thinks a pre-workout is the equivalent of cocaine and the protein powder/creatine = steroids.
IMO I'd reccomend against it as you'll davelop a tolerance within a month, but, if you dont mind cycling 1 month on - 1 month off then go for it. Also, take the full doseage, otherwise just buy a placebo pill and convince yourself its adderral
Send me a PM and I can go into detail if you'd like.
Work out before you go to the office. Take before workout as directed.
"Not me. Im in my prime"
the ones with beta-alanine could be useful... never thought of that.
If you think Jack3d Micro is too much you should definitely stay away from the real Jack3d. Lucky for me I stocked up when I found out they were pulling it and I have like 10 jars in my house.
I use pre-workout at work all the time. It's gotten so bad that sometimes I will mix in a scoop of White Flood with a Rockstar and sip on that throughout the day. My daily routine is 1 SF Rockstar right when I get to work, 1 after lunch,and then a scoop of White Flood immediately after work when I hit the gym. I'll probably die young. On a side note: White Flood > all other pre-workout/intra-workout supplements
Live fast, Die young and leave an aesthetic corpse
that's the way to do it big guy
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