VP Promotion Chances at Megafund
What are chances of getting directly promoted at a megafund in NY (BX, KKR, SLP, WP, EQT, CVC, Bain and the like.)? What percent of associates get promoted?
I am an international and weighing if it is a worth the switch or stay in my current seat and have more certainity in the US. Any internationals here who have got promoted?
This has probably been answered a few times in a disaggregated manner on this forum, but like many other questions on this website … the crappy answer is “it depends”
At a H&F, you’ve got a 2 and out program unless you’re one of the top associates they want to keep. At Blackstone and KKR, certainly possible but not “the design” and most of your class will be gone before VP. At a Thoma Bravo or Warburg, the design of the firms are to promote from within, so materially higher chances there.
If you’re optimizing for promotion internally, just need to do your DD on which firms are like the last bucket. Thoma Bravo, Warburg, Bain, and Vista come to mind for me.
Yes KKR and CD&R have promoted internationals to Director/Prinicpal and Partner, very common in MF PE if you started as associate.
I worked at one of those firms, very common is extremely wrong. It is very common for people to be kicked out after 2 years. That's the case for 80+% of the people. Look at how many VPs both firms already have, there is an extremely level of VP bloat at almost all large cap funds even with only 1-2 promotes a year out of very large associate classes. A lot of associates stay in PE, but go down market to MM or LMM PE. Very few stay within large-cap PE. The senior associate market is far more competitive than the associate one given that 1) a lot of firms promote associates within and thus don't look for senior associates from outside and 2) you are often also competing with MBAs for those spots.
Former MF associate, agree with all of this. One additional point - if you're joining a MF that splits out into sectors (e.g., KKR), you also need to look at the pipeline ahead of you as there may just not be a spot for your to get promoted into if the classes ahead of you are full + someone is tracking to promo (or perhaps someone is coming back from MBA around when you'd be up for promo). There are cases where if you're really well liked, they may try to find another group where there is space for you to stay but that is unpredictable + you may not want to join the other group.
All this to say the base case is you get pushed out after 2-3 years at a MF
current KKR PE in North America, one principal is Canadian, one partner is Canadian, one director is from Hong Kong, and 1 partner and 1 principal are international (haven't 100% verified this last one), and this is just what I know of them.
What do you consider to be VP at MF like BX where they have assoc / SA / Principal type of ladder? Is promotion to SA considered VP elsewhere?
i think post mba title is fair equivalent
hijacking the thread a bit, but what UMMs have best promotion odds? especially curious about Francisco, Hg, Veritas, Clearlake, AKKR, and TA
Probably a first-time fund like 26North, Haveli, or Patient Square, or at least a young firm like Arcline. Generally the quicker your fund grows, the more need there is for VPs, and the younger the firm, the less bloat there is at the VP level. All of the firms I listed should have VP staffing by now, just not bloated yet given how recently they were founded. Same reason Vista and TB were so good for promotions in the 2010s. Apollo has always had good promotion odds largely because nobody wants to stay past two years, it makes the WLB and culture at other MFs look chill.
On the flip side, those firms are all younger and much smaller in fund size and reputation. I know people at 26North and they get grinded far harder than most MFs and UMMs, in part due to founder team and lean deal teams. Really smart group, and I think they’ll do very well, which isn’t surprising given the pedigree (founded by Josh Harris, run day-to-day by Mark Weinberg, Brookfield’s former managing partner). That said, I wouldn’t take an offer from 26North, or any of the others I listed, over a MF unless you’re sure you want to be at the firm longer than two years.
what about Carlyle or TPG?
No mention of Apollo which has solid promotion odds similar to TB (maybe better)
Apollo has great promotion odds because 80%+ of their associates would rather cut their own arm off than stay. I have yet to meet a single well-adjusted human who did their associate stint at Apollo and then happily stayed.
There is also a massive amount of self-selection to exit PE which also makes the numbers look worse than they should be. A given PE fund isn't always getting its top associate to come back for VP. Sometimes they do have to go to the 2nd or 3rd preferred associate because the top 2 decided to do something else.
Yes I think this way more the case than people realise. I’m sure if you’re an Analyst or Associate you can’t imagine, but quite a few top performers would rather blow their brains out than stay
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