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Big Law, but oh you said WLB....NVM
Pls rank big law firms. Also, will any hire undergrads?
The reverse of Big LaW is WLB.
Hah. This is like the argument that poorer Americans don't want taxes to go up on the wealthy because they imagine they'll be there one day, and don't want higher taxes on their hypothetical future selves. I would also argue that the range of what you do in real estate varies greatly, and that might also have some impact on pay. As is repeated ad nauseum here, if you work in debt origination or investment sales, you might make hundreds of thousands of dollars really early if you enter the industry at the right time. You might also have years where you barely pay back your draw. So it is hard to compare some of these feast-or-famine roles with steadier gigs. But the average teenager or college student posting on these boards doesn't really care about that, they want to know how to be Jonathan Gray as quickly as possible, without understanding that just won't happen again, or not in the same way.
Moreover, even if you're a project manager in a development role, you might be willing to take a smaller salary if you actually have responsibility. Yes, your peer in acquisitions at a major fund might be making double what you are, but if you're "the guy" running a couple development deals without someone looking over your shoulder, you might be gaining experience for an eventual move into your own thing - an exit that someone doing acquisitions at a $10b AUM can't really count on, because no one is giving that guy the kind of money to run the kinds of deals he's got experience with. If I buy Class A, 9 figure trophy office properties in major urban areas as my W-2 job, how am I going to replicate that if I want to start my own fund? Whereas if I spend my time building multifamily housing for a developer, I have a very reasonable chance of finding someone to finance my project if I can gain site control.
None of which is to say that any of us should be suckered into the "but it's great experience!" bullshit argument as a substitute for good pay, but there are good reasons why experienced CRE professionals might stay in a role that is underpaying them by 10-15% or whatever if they've found a good stepping stone.
I work at a mid sized but reputable fund and make close to $300k with only 5 years of experience. I occasionally leave work early on fridays, I play intramural sports, go on dates, etc on weekdays. We only work the occasional weekend when there’s a big push up to investment committee
What’s the catch? I’m on the west coast. The NYC guys grind like there’s no tomorrow and they 1) put the same amount of equity to work as the west coast team and 2) get paid the same
If you want to have a life, get out of NYC. People there work even if they’re not busy.
This is a legit great post!
I will say, the UGs, interns, and others on the outside looking in can basically only fully grasp pay and prestige..... actual work quality, excitement, life outside of the office, even real prospects of career progression... are all concepts I don't think people grasp until 25 or maybe even 30! Soooo.. let's rank by pay and prestige!
Will say... getting north of $300k in one's 30s (and certainly 40s) in NYC or even secondary cities doesn't seem that impossible in a lot of institutional/corporate roles that also allow one to have a life. I'd think successfully "climbing the ladder" (to use the worn out phrase) is probably what most who get to that level do, or have some successful professional practice that is "controlled" enough to allow for life balance (like appraisers, consultants, accountants, and even some lawyers and brokers.....). Of course, "deciding" to have a "life" probably has costs vs. those willing to go 80-90 hrs+, but that is part of it right? Accepting say $350k total comp when you could make the run for $750-1M!
Ironically, it seems like a lot of those who have that set up (be it in NYC or elsewhere), had to do shitty jobs or tracks in their 20s (like made well under the $200k threshold potentially) to be in the comfortable zone in their 30s. I'd note appraisers and bankers (commercial not investment) fit this model quite often. Or as others say, promoted up the proverbial "LifeCo/pension fund/SWF" tracks as an institutional example. Thus, if you hit your 30s and wish you had taken that path, then may be hard to shift without another 10 years of suckiness. But maybe can jump right into based on experience/skills (hard to say, too personal to generalize).
"I'm tired of top pay questions. but here is my top pay question for someone with 10+ years of experience." LOL
I'm mid 30's at a PE firm = $1.3mm cash comp, $10mm carry.