Canadian Undergrad - Ivey AEO fin mod vs. UW Math/BBA double degree

Hey WSO,

So I think I've gained a little insight which undergrad program I will be choosing and it's looking like it will come down to Western Financial Modelling (Ivey HBA AEO) vs. Waterloo/Laurier Math Double Degree.

I've compile a couple main factors; the main one being the career/job aspects. Obviously and HBA with financial modelling would be aggressive for IBD but it seems UW has way better S&T opportunities. Also 5 work terms (UW) > 2 work terms (Ivey). Waterloo seems to be really good for insurance/risk kind of finance but I don't really think I'm in for that kind of stuff. If can be top of my class in DD, will there be IBD offers? Don't the big5 Canadian banks love DDs?

Some other factors: obviously Ivey is a target, UW is not, Social Aspect - I was initially in a f*ck it, just care about the academics/jobs, but I realized I'm only 18 who probably doesn't really know what he wants... Western is way better in this aspect and actually has decent girls compared to UW :. Another is tuition, Ivey is F$cking expensive!

Lastly, I initially though Ivey as potentially redundant because of the possibility for an MBA in the future, if I DD --> Top MBA either in Canada/US, won't I get the best of both worlds?

Discuss!

*** I know these threads are repititive but I felt that all the available ones were comparing QueensC vs. Ivey vs. Mcgill and there weren't many threads for Waterloo vs. Western at all.

Comments (31)

Apr 17, 2011

pm tobywashere, I think you and him have a lot in common. He will probably tell you that Waterloo would be where to go, whereas I think Ivey would be best for you, as you have not mentioned Queen's. Ivey has the deepest network in all of Canadian finance, whereas Waterloo is still emerging. Plus, UWO was just rated 4th in North America for the greatest party school by Playboy.

Apr 17, 2011

I think it depends more on what you want to do. If you want S&T, pick Waterloo, otherwise go to UWO. Top DD students get IBD offers without trouble, but there's nowhere near as many opportunities as UWO, and from what others have already said in previous threads, the better S&T opportunities are at Waterloo.

Apr 17, 2011
monkeyspells:

I think it depends more on what you want to do. If you want S&T, pick Waterloo, otherwise go to UWO.

Agreed.

Proboscis

Apr 17, 2011

Although Toby knows his stuff (For the most part), his reasoning sometimes is a little wack and he's a little delusional, no offense just imo - i've read his posts and stuff and think he'll find good success in S&T.

"Know thyself"

Apr 17, 2011

The thing is, I know its definitely possible to get IBD in big5 Canadian banks from DD, I've talked to some upperyears and all of IBD, S&T, even hedge funds who have hired DDs. If I'm confident in my abilities to be near top of the class, it seems DD is a lot more versatile.

The thing is, I'm a little bias towards Waterloo, I'll admit it - I guess I don't really know the full potential of Ivey because I don't know enough about it.

Anyways, what do you guys think of my comment on MBAs and Ivey redundancy?

"Know thyself"

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Apr 17, 2011
immaculatedx:

The thing is, I know its definitely possible to get IBD in big5 Canadian banks from DD, I've talked to some upperyears and all of IBD, S&T, even hedge funds who have hired DDs.

Have you talked to Ivey kids who landed offers in top IBD, S&T, HF, Megafunds, etc.? Ivey also dominates Big 5 recruitment, so whether it's Wall Street or Bay Street, you'll have the best chance of landing offers in either setting.

immaculatedx:

Anyways, what do you guys think of my comment on MBAs and Ivey redundancy?

That could be a good thing - you won't need to forgo two years of salary and end up with $200k+ debt.

Also, I wouldn't think of it as purely redundant, I would say Ivey gives you experience. The pedagogy at Ivey revolves around the case-method, which you would typically see in MBA classes (ie. Harvard MBA). So in a sense you could really shine as most of your other classmates will be behind the learning curve with regards to the whole case-method structure.

And besides, couldn't you more or less say the same thing about any business degree (ie. Laurier BBA)?

Apr 17, 2011
Optical_Illusion:
immaculatedx:

The thing is, I know its definitely possible to get IBD in big5 Canadian banks from DD, I've talked to some upperyears and all of IBD, S&T, even hedge funds who have hired DDs.

Have you talked to Ivey kids who landed offers in top IBD, S&T, HF, Megafunds, etc.? Ivey also dominates Big 5 recruitment, so whether it's Wall Street or Bay Street, you'll have the best chance of landing offers in either setting.

immaculatedx:

Anyways, what do you guys think of my comment on MBAs and Ivey redundancy?

That could be a good thing - you won't need to forgo two years of salary and end up with $200k+ debt.

Also, I wouldn't think of it as purely redundant, I would say Ivey gives you experience. The pedagogy at Ivey revolves around the case-method, which you would typically see in MBA classes (ie. Harvard MBA). So in a sense you could really shine as most of your other classmates will be behind the learning curve with regards to the whole case-method structure.

And besides, couldn't you more or less say the same thing about any business degree (ie. Laurier BBA)?

Good points. I honestly don't really know many upper years - I have some friends in first and second year but I don't even think they're gonna pick/make/choose Ivey HBA after AEO.

Regarding money, I think I could save a lot more going from Waterloo --> MBA because of all money I save in my first 5 years of undergrad. 5 years at Western = 25 + 325 = 85K with only 2 internship workterms, while Waterloo tuition is 5*8 = 40k with 5 work terms.

I also do know Laurier does use the case study method and that 3rd year is pure case studying. I know Financial Modelling and HBA would definitely be very powerful and that's why I'm not longer set on UW.

"Know thyself"

Apr 17, 2011

I have been noticing the value of an MBA decresing from what I have read on these forums. However, Ivey does offer a Master of Science in Management course that I feel is unique and new, specifically designed for kids with the HBA. Also their accelerated MBA for HBA grads is 8 months I believe.

Did you apply to Queen's Commerce? My decision is between QC and Ivey now, with a slant towards QC.

Apr 17, 2011

I really didn't like the atmosphere of Queens when I went and visited; that and the whole clique thing was a turnoff so I decided not to take someone else's spot.

My point about the MBAs was that I could go to Waterloo and get my DD stuff done and then get a brandname MBA in either Canada or the US and that MBA would be just as good as w/e Ivey could offer me.

ALSO, I could really just transfer to HBA1 after DD in year 3 if I really regretted my decision - all in all I think I will most likely DD it out unless I get really convinced for Ivey.

"Know thyself"

Apr 17, 2011

have you gone to visit western's campus yet?

Apr 17, 2011

Admittedly no because I was so set on Waterloo initially :\ I hear it's really nice though.

I've been to Waterloo a few times though.

"Know thyself"

Apr 17, 2011

I'm not 100% sure on how the DD works, could you choose to be from Laurier or Waterloo? If so, I'd probably choose Laurier as my 'home school'. I think they will be pouring a TON of money into their career development wing in the next couple of years. Hell, they were the only university to have a 4th year business student phisically call me and ask if I had any questions. I was very impressed with their attempt to attract top students - plus they offered $20K.

Apr 17, 2011

The program is the same regardless but you can apply from UW or Laurier. The main differences will be of scholarship, first year residence and coop streams.

I got the student call and we had a chat about the double degree and career options. And yes I got the 25K scholarship (Its a 5 year program)

Im most likely going Waterloo though for their coop stream.

"Know thyself"

Jan 22, 2014

.

"The code of competence is the only system of morality that's on a gold standard." - Francisco d'Anconia

Apr 17, 2011

Sure your first thread was weird but yes I acknowledged you knew your stuff.

Yeah, valid points about the MBA, honestly I'm not thinking that far ahead I'm just using it as a debating point.

and thanks for the info about the transfer in 3rd year, I didnt know that :\

..... HOWEVER, I do know someone who transferred from Systems Design at UW to Ivey ... so why not DD?

"Know thyself"

Apr 17, 2011

When people ask you, "so, where are you going next year?" whatever you reply most often is where your heart is. go there. From what I have seen you would like to go to Waterloo so if you have an emotional connection with there then I say do that. A successful candidate will be able to land positions no matter where they go in Canada.

Apr 17, 2011
bankster:

When people ask you, "so, where are you going next year?" whatever you reply most often is where your heart is. go there. From what I have seen you would like to go to Waterloo so if you have an emotional connection with there then I say do that. A successful candidate will be able to land positions no matter where they go in Canada.

Hey Bankster - you're right. The problem is, I think I'm biased to the point where people think I'm actually from Waterloo. There's nothing that awesome about Waterloo - I'll admit, Its just I guess I was set on it so long; I was pretty stupid not to consider other options.

I'm seriously considering Ivey now.

"Know thyself"

Apr 17, 2011

I've actually been lurking on this site for a couple years now and this is surprisingly my first post. I just graduated Ivey HBA and will be working at a global IB in Toronto. I saw that someone mentioned you talk to graduates of the various programs. I cannot speak to the other programs and I am sure each of them have their strengths and merits. However, from what I've seen in Canada having gone through summer and full-time recruiting is that Ivey students seem to get an overwhelming amount of finance jobs. Friends of mine will be working in L.A., San Fran, New York, London, Toronto, Calgary, Vancouver, etc. If you have any specific questions about the program or UWO shoot me a message and I would be glad to discuss.

Cheers

Apr 17, 2011
Leafs4thecup:

I've actually been lurking on this site for a couple years now and this is surprisingly my first post. I just graduated Ivey HBA and will be working at a global IB in Toronto. I saw that someone mentioned you talk to graduates of the various programs. I cannot speak to the other programs and I am sure each of them have their strengths and merits. However, from what I've seen in Canada having gone through summer and full-time recruiting is that Ivey students seem to get an overwhelming amount of finance jobs. Friends of mine will be working in L.A., San Fran, New York, London, Toronto, Calgary, Vancouver, etc. If you have any specific questions about the program or UWO shoot me a message and I would be glad to discuss.

Cheers

Thanks, I pm'ed you.

"Know thyself"

Apr 17, 2011

You can't transfer to Ivey if you're doing coop. If you want to verify this, check the Ivey website.

"The code of competence is the only system of morality that's on a gold standard." - Francisco d'Anconia

Apr 18, 2011
tobywashere:

You can't transfer to Ivey if you're doing coop. If you want to verify this, check the Ivey website.

Where on the ivey website does it forbid students in co-op programs? I don't recall this and I've had old colleagues that did co-op in their old programs and got into ivey...

Apr 18, 2011
Kanon:
tobywashere:

You can't transfer to Ivey if you're doing coop. If you want to verify this, check the Ivey website.

Where on the ivey website does it forbid students in co-op programs? I don't recall this and I've had old colleagues that did co-op in their old programs and got into ivey...

On the transfer FAQ, it says it basically says it would be hard to get in because they would not have all the required marks at the time of admission - exceptions ofcourse can be made especially for outstanding students

"Know thyself"

Apr 17, 2011

It said it was possible, but very unlikely.

"Know thyself"

Apr 18, 2011

I thought it through really hard without any bias and I think that it is 60/40 in favour of Ivey atm - thanks for any advice given guys - and sorry for all the repetitive threads :\

"Know thyself"

Apr 25, 2011

I was given a conditional offer to Ivey coming from Waterloo Math/Chartered Accounting (and yes it is a co-op program). So this is very possible if you have good grades (my average was around 90%).

Apr 25, 2011
mpochwat:

I was given a conditional offer to Ivey coming from Waterloo Math/Chartered Accounting (and yes it is a co-op program). So this is very possible if you have good grades (my average was around 90%).

Nice average! What made you want to transfer?

Apr 26, 2011
mpochwat:

I was given a conditional offer to Ivey coming from Waterloo Math/Chartered Accounting (and yes it is a co-op program). So this is very possible if you have good grades (my average was around 90%).

Conditional on what basis, if I may ask?

Apr 25, 2011

Didn't you have a coop term in the winter of your sophomore year? How did you work around the issue of completing your second semester sophomore courses in time to send to Ivey? Or do they just make an exception for you? I'm doing the double degree, but I want to keep the Ivey transfer option open.

"The code of competence is the only system of morality that's on a gold standard." - Francisco d'Anconia

Apr 26, 2011
tobywashere:

Didn't you have a coop term in the winter of your sophomore year? How did you work around the issue of completing your second semester sophomore courses in time to send to Ivey? Or do they just make an exception for you? I'm doing the double degree, but I want to keep the Ivey transfer option open.

You send your application based on your last transcript by the deadline. Then you send your summer marks later on, if your borderline or conditional. Ivey works with co-op students from other schools. Ivey really works with anyone as long as your proactive in your application process and ask the right questions.

Apr 25, 2011
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May 11, 2011