Question about finance rotational programs
I am looking into whether a finance rotational program makes sense for me long term for post-MBA. I know that some firms expect you to continually rotate for a long time (e.g. once every two years and it goes on for about 20 years, and that you are always in a mid-level range), but to me that sounds like you are not advancing vertically. Also, since I am interested in the corporate development or M&A role, it seems like most large firms put that as part of your rotation but can never guarantee that it can be a permanent position.
I am considering other finance roles outside of corporate and wonder if down the line whether it is possible to get into a F500 finance role without going through the rotational program.
So my question is whether these rotational programs are really worth it or if they disguise some of these trade-offs during corporate presentations. If anyone who is in one can shed some light on these aspects that would be great.
Directly from the CEO's mouth, most rotational programs are a scam to keep talent for as long as possible at large corporations while not paying them a lot. The thought process is that the employee will be happier from learning new skills and the firm doesn't have to pay as much since you'll be lateraling horizontally and not upwards. We're implementing this at one of our portfolio companies and it really helps trick most employees since a lot of people get bored with their jobs and quit but a rotational keeps people around longer.
Pretty sure this only applies to rotation programs that don't include a promotion as part of the process and/or do not allow for tracking. Not to mention the idea that keeping someone via a rotational program is retarded. Its, by definition, something that ends in ~2 years. Thats a terrible way to keep someone around, be it 'for cheap' or otherwise. The actual purpose of a rotational program, in my experience, is enticing people that would otherwise go to other firms with this sweet sexy opportunity to see all different parts of the company and throw a bunch of accomplishments at them (ie we have sent people to all of the M7 business schools) to get them in the door. Then you can separate the wheat from the chaff and keep those that you think are rising stars by offering them sponsorship for an MBA, etc. etc.
Wow, that's kind of the nagging feeling I get in the back of my mind from corporate presentations but it gives a different level of insight when someone inside the company actually admits to that instead of sugar coating the "well-roundedness" of rotating consistently.
Usually rotational programs operated so you rotate but after you rotate you end up in a specific area. So thee logic doesnt make sense.....
Most FLDPs are accounting in nature. Usually, they don't tell you where you'll end up. It's on you to use your rotations to network...
Why not just get in as a Financial Analyst? Who needs the rotations... You do two years of rotations and they give you a job as an analyst anyway...
The benefits are only there if you plan to spend the next 20+ years with them. This is because you'll build a multi-departmental network, learn multiple aspects of the business, and others will see you as someone building a lifelong career with the company. If you're planning on jumping ship, skip it. How much work do you plan to do in your first six months of any job? It takes three months just to get settled, so you you won't develop transferable skills.
While I'm not in an FLDP, my group is a rotation for the programs. They basically are given one task for their entire six month stay. Half the time, they're doing useless trainings. Only accept FLDP positions if you truly want build a career with one company.
First of all, the obvious, at the vast majority of companies the FLDP participants make a decent bit more money than the non-program FA's. I make roughly 10-12k more than someone not in my program. We also get bonuses that the non-program participants don't get.
Secondly, it is no easier to leave as a non-program participant than it is as a program participant. In fact, it's probably easier to leave because of the perceived prestige and it's definitely better for business school applications. The jobs are the same as an FA you are just doing them at a more surface level because you are there for less of a time.
Thirdly, you definitely don't just get a entry level analyst job at the end unless no one wants you (which means, you didn't do a good job). Most people after the 2-3 years will end up in an SFA role.
Lastly, while it's true a lot of what you learn is specific for that company, when you leave the program and make manager or SFA much faster than the non-program FAs, you'll have an easier time jumping into higher roles into other companies as well.
They suck a bit because they kind of strand you for a few years, but they are undoubtedly better for your career as someone coming out of undergrad.
Just curious,
For your company...how does housing work for people in a 2 year, 4 rotation FLDP? Does the company pay for all housing...or help you find 6 month lease?
Also, do you think that FLDP for a solid company is a better/faster route to management compared to doing 3 years at Big 4 and jumping ship after you make senior?
Thanks.
Comment above was actually directed towards AllDay. But thanks anyhow!
Agree with allday above. They're all a tight group of kids. They go drinking together, and help each other when find apts, etc.
I'm in Development Finance, so there aren't really many accountants in my space. One VP has an MSA + CPA and I believe was big 4. Most people are ex-wall st. guys (MS, Citi). Everyone has a graduate degree or two (a few PhDs, and lots of engineering degrees). Funny that the highest guy probably has the least formal education.
So I can't really speak if you'll go farther, faster coming from big 4. In this dept., you wouldn't have a shot without a graduate degree of some kind. Might be different in more accounting oriented (tax/audit/FPA) roles. This is at an F50.
Once again, I agree with allday on 90% of the points. I know here, the pay is the same (just don't know about bonus). Like he said, it all depends on your ability! If you're good, people like you, you network, get seen, etc. you'll advance no matter where you are. The FLDP is a fast track within that specific company (and maybe the same industry if you're lured away, lol).
As an FLDP, it's easier to switch (during those two years) because that's the nature of the job! Once again, it's a difference of know a lot about one area vs know a little about a lot of areas. Having a small tight network who can vouch for your skills vs. having a broad network that kind of knows what you can do.
Also note, Financial Analyst is a broad term and can mean many different things. It depends on what you're actually doing for how much you get paid.
Thanks a lot for the info... How would you compare Undergrad FLDP vs MBA FLDP? I know most FLDP sponsor just part time MBA and I don't think the salary growth is very high..Are they both fast-track, or is the MBA one the true fast track and will likely get you to senior manager and up?
I'm thinking that maybe working in IB, or Big 4 ->Top 10 MBA -> F500 MBA FLDP might be safer/faster path to management...what do you think?
The company I work for only has undergrad FLDP and it really places into accounting roles. There is a graduate DP also, but it's not specific to finance/accounting. Honestly, I've never met anyone in the graduate DP, so I can't say how they compare.
They say career path for an undergrad FLDP is (after completion of the program): year3 Manager, year8 director, year13 VP. Obviously, this varies for everyone based on things that allday has said (ability, network, fit, etc.).
The plan you lay out above is alright; but, with 3 years IB/Big4 and a top MBA I don't see why you'd need to do an FLDP. There's no safe path to upper management... it's all politics, if people don't like you and you can't get anything done, then you won't go anywhere.
Don't get me wrong, I think FLDPs are great! I just don't think they're the 'be all'.
Yes, but usually part-time. Because if you leave, they will hate you. They drop 200k and two-years into training you... They don't want that to walk out the door. Most do local MBAs, not top MBAs (just state schools in the area). I was at lunch the other day with a group of them; a few had taken GMAT already, a few were studying for it. Some were not planning on it for the immediate future. Just depends on who you are and your long-term goals, I guess.
Once again, if you do FLDP and leave they will hate you. On the other hand, a competitor would love to steal you away. So it goes both ways.
I myself am in a local, state MBA (same one 80+% of people here do). The reason I'm so-so on the idea of an FLDP being better than FA is because everyone in my group is tight. Any one of them would stick their neck out for me and vouch that I'm very good (which they have done many times already). None of them would do that of a FLDP guy. Largely because they don't spend enough time with FLDPs to really know you and what you can do. It's a difference between being in the circle right away, or waiting two-years and MAYBE being in a few circles.
As allday said though, if you're good, it doesn't matter where you go.
Do you get any raise in pay or be considered for promotion to manager after finishing your local MBA? Because if you leave and go to a good MBA and join another company as MBA hire I know you'd get around $100K, but not sure how it works for FLDP'ers getting PT mba. Thanks!
1) I would think it would be easier to jump upward within the same industry. Going outside the space and upward would be tougher (because you have to learn the standards of another industry... whole new learning curve).
2) CPA is good if you want to shoot for controller/CFO jobs. Just know, in accounting roles you're basically doing the same things again and again (year after year).
If you plan to work in corp fin, I'd double in Accounting and Finance. They call it call it corp fin... but 90% of these jobs are accounting roles (require some knowledge of tax/audit/etc.) If you decide on Econ, you might be limiting yourself from the number of roles you could fill. Just depends on where you want to go.
Ya, moving within the same industry is always easier. It's also easier to move out to a different industry the younger you are. If you are a Director in Telecom you are going to have a tough time getting a Director in Oil and Gas job. But, if you are an FA/SFA in Telecom it will be a bit easier to make the same move.
CPA is good as a lot of jobs require accounting knowledge. It's not required, though. The head of accounting for one of our sectors doesn't even have a CPA while our head of M&A for the entire company does. I, personally, plan to get my CFA but that has more to do with the fact that I want to make the jump out of CF than that I believe it's better for my current trajectory.
So, just a Finance degree and No Accounting degree/CPA won't limit your future promotional opportunities in F500 Fin, as long as you enter a FLDP and perform well?
If so, do you think Econ double major with Finance has any value, or should I just save a semester of tuition and travel/study for GMAT?
Lastly....do all FLDP start in June/ July? Or do some start in December for people graduating early?
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