Unpacking Corporate Banking at Citi/BAML?

bankeeng's picture
Rank: Monkey | banana points 38

Does anyone have any insight as to Corporate Banking at Citi?

I understand the roles completely differ depending on the bank and where it is housed, but these two are both located under the IB arm.

Comments (45)

Dec 11, 2018

Pretty confident they are both 85k base for first year. Maybe 30% bonus?

Dec 11, 2018

Can confirm Citi 85k base

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Dec 11, 2018

A user in an older thread about Corp Banking comp mentioned that as of 2015, Citi is paying 85 base with a 25-40k bonus for 1st years

Don't confuse motion with progress. You can run in place all day, doesn't mean you'll be moving forward.

Dec 11, 2018

Do a search.. Loads of information about CIB corporate banking gigs on here.

Dec 11, 2018

85k base with 25-40k bonus sounds way too high for first year analyst. I will say 65k-75k, 5k signing bonus with 10k-20k annual bonus. Salary is pretty much the same across all cities as far as BB is concerned.

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Dec 12, 2018

It's 85 + 5 + 20-25

Source: old coworker who's a 1st yr in CB at Citi

Dec 12, 2018

Can't post the link, but search "Corporate Banking Analyst Salary And Bonus" and you''ll find the thread from 2014 stating that comp. I do agree 40k sounds high, was just stating what I read from that thread and the user did mention it depends on tier. Can confirm Citi pays 85 base (have a friend there) and JPM does too fwiw. Bonus is around 30-40% (translating to ~ 25 to 34k) from other threads i've read regarding Corp. Banking pay. You'll find more threads regarding this by searching, hope that helps OP

Don't confuse motion with progress. You can run in place all day, doesn't mean you'll be moving forward.

Dec 12, 2018

Corporate banking pays the same base as IB but a smaller bonus - this has been the case at every bank I know.

Dec 12, 2018

This sounds about right. At least for the more junior levels. I reckon if you break it down to the hour the corp banking grads have a better deal.

Dec 12, 2018

commercial banking =/= corporate banking in a CIB org.

Dec 14, 2018

Wrong. Interned at Citi in S&T and a close friend worked in Corp Banking. Believe it or not CB, S&T, and IB all start out at $85k base. Sign on might have been lower. However, he mentioned bonus was 25% to 50% of base.

Dec 19, 2018

Have a couple of friends in BB corporate banking roles and they confirmed first years start off with $85K base and 25-30% bonus (consistent with my bank too)..not too shabby for a 9-6 gig

Jan 9, 2019
Debtbanker:

Have a couple of friends in BB corporate banking roles and they confirmed first years start off with $85K base and 25-30% bonus (consistent with my bank too)..not too shabby for a 9-6 gig

You sure it's only 9-6? I was under the impression that CB can be 60-70 hours quite easy. I'm sure some lower deal flow groups are more 9-6ish tho

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Jan 8, 2019

Currently a first year analyst in CB. Base is $85K as others have mentioned. Top bucket CB bonus is typically higher than a low IB bonus, which translates to a range of $30 - 50K. During busy times hours are almost the same as IB, but with fewer weekends and better predictability on project timelines which also means fewer all nighters. Anecdotally, the second year analysts I've asked have made closer to the $50K end of the spectrum.

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Jan 8, 2019

Just accepted a CB position at a BB. Mind if I send you a PM with some questions regarding hours and such?

Jan 8, 2019

I think it could be helpful to others have the info listed in the thread, but if you have any questions that could be sensitive for whatever reason feel free to PM.

Jan 8, 2019

Sure, didn't know if you wanted to keep things private and such.

  1. Typical hours in workweek?
  2. Being in Corp. Banking at a BB, does it allow you more interaction with IB?
  3. Heard rumors that after analyst years, possible options are either direct promote or if at a BB, they might allow you to internal transfer to IB. Have you heard this?
  4. Best Pro and Worst Con of being in Corp. Banking thus far?
  5. Any advice to an incoming analyst to hit the ground running you wish you had gotten?

Thanks!

Most Helpful
Jan 8, 2019

Standard caveat that I can only speak to my own experience.

  1. Standard week is around 9AM - 8-9PM, so around 60 hours with some variance. During particularly slow seasons we leave around 6PM, while during busy times we'll leave around 11PM-2AM. Long hours are often a result of multiple longer-dated (1-2 week timeline) projects coinciding rather than an unexpected firedrill, so true all nighters are fairly rare since you have some control on scheduling. The real advantage in hours over IB is that we rarely work weekends (I have yet to work a Saturday and only a handful of Sundays)
  2. Yes. CB probably works with the widest range of groups out of any division since your job is to service client needs with whatever product/team they need, but we work the most with IB by a fair margin. We all sit together, so if you were to step on the floor you would have no way of knowing who is in CB vs IB.
  3. Direct promotes are definitely possible and the most preferred outcome from a senior perspective. Most of the seniors in my group have had experience in other divisions, but most particularly IB. If you perform well and have senior support, lateraling to IB is a definite possibility and probably fairly easy in my opinion since you'll have been cross-staffed with IB on deals and they'll know who you are. Keep in mind CIB analysts are treated as one class and go through the same training (versus CMO or S&T analysts) specifically because they're expected to work together.

    Having said that, I can't imagine why any sane person would want to switch from CB to IB if they plan to stay in banking (versus jumping to buyside). The pay to work ratio is skewed heavily in favor of CB.

  4. Pros:
  • CB teams are way smaller than IB teams so you have less internal competition, fewer assholes, and better senior exposure.
  • Pay is pretty close and the work-life balance is hugely in your favor, especially as you move up. Like I said, a top CB bonus is higher than a mid-bottom IB bonus, and you'll probably work less and deal with less bullshit to get that same number.
  • CB work covers a broad range of corporate finance initiatives whereas IB has an episodic, narrow focus. The pro for this from an analyst perspective is that the work you're doing (typically some variation of cash flow/credit/capital return analysis) has usefulness/relevance to the client, even if it gets dull. You'll (hopefully, probably) never get bullshit assignments like compiling a 100 page pitch deck covering 50 different company profiles as potential acquisition targets that will never see the light of day as IB is notorious for.
  • A good chunk of CB seniors formerly worked in other groups within the bank but wanted a better work-life balance. In my experience, this dynamic seems to attract seniors who are reasonable human beings who'd prefer if their juniors also have a healthy work-life balance. This is very often not the case in IB, and the people you work with will make or break your experience far more than company prestige.
  • You'll go through your long hours and miserable moments together with your (CB and IB) classmates, and they will keep you sane

Cons:

  • If you want to jump to PE, being in CB will put you at a notable disadvantage considering how tough and well established the pipeline already is. I never had any interest in PE so I didn't care, but if that's a goal for you further down the line then IB is definitely a better platform to recruit from. Credit focused buyside roles like credit investing, mezz/debt funds, or non-"finance finance" roles like Corp Dev, Strategic Finance, etc are equally open to you.
  • IB typically runs the operating model while CB does the credit analysis, so you'll be at a disadvantage in that respect. If you're recruiting for buyside, you'll have to practice modeling on your own (this is true for IB analysts as well). Modeling isn't rocket science, but I do wish my role involved more deep diving into that.
  • As mentioned above, CB teams are a lot (as in 5-8x) smaller than IB teams. This makes it harder to find alumni and collect data points on how CB career trajectories typically evolve.
  • All your friends will think you work in Investment Banking or Commercial Banking no matter how many times you explain it as no one on this planet has heard of Corporate Banking apparently
  1. I'm only a first year so there are others who can provide much better advice, but I have found that a bit of extra thoughtfulness can go a long way. Spending a little extra time to re-check your work, think about how your slides fit into the larger story being told, or come up with a little extra analysis that you think may be helpful without being asked can be surprisingly well received by seniors.
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Jan 9, 2019

Legitimately the best response I think I've gotten on WSO, SB for you my good sir.

I most commonly hear that the biggest advantage that CB has over IB is the hours and it's reassuring to hear it from a 1st year like yourself. 60 hours is definitely feasible.

Glad to hear that CB and IB work so closely together which would help a lateral transition should I act on that in the future. Goals wise, not too sure about PE. Like you, it doesn't attract me, but the IB world has always attracted me, hence why I asked those questions related to IB.

If you don't mind I have two more questions.

  1. You said "CB and IB typically go through the same training program." For obvious reasons I know you cannot go into too much detail, but can you explain the standard training program? I also received word that we incoming analysts would be going through a initial training program and was curious what that would entail.
  2. Haven't asked the BB yet, but was curious if they offer analysts gym memberships to local gyms/clubs. or have a gym in house? Obviously banking is stressful, so it would be good to take care of the body and mind which is why I ask.

Thanks again for all your insights! Truly very helpful.

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Jan 9, 2019

I find that 60 - 80 hours is fairly sustainable long term, particularly if you have your weekends. The weekends add a crucial mental break for personal activities, and prevent you from becoming one with the Cosmic PIB.

I suspect that once you start working, you'll become more focused on getting out of sellside finance (whether that's to buyside or a non-finance role) than you will about lateraling to IB. Regardless, you'll figure that out in due course and I wouldn't worry about it now.

  1. The standard training program is generally focused on 1) making sure all analysts have a base working knowledge of finance and 2) preparing you for your Series 63 and 79, should you be required to take those. The end result is that training is essentially a 9-5 summer camp for post-college kids who now have money. In other words, you will spend most of your time getting blasted and then dealing with the ensuing hangover, followed by a week and a half of frantic series prep. It's a great time and you should make sure to enjoy yourself as you will miss it when you're full time.
  2. Most BB's have good quality in-house gyms or offer discounts to local memberships. As a bit of unsolicited advice, in addition to physical exercise I find that it's important to do some emotional/mental maintenance as well. What that means for me is taking time to physically write out things I'm grateful for, as well as areas I'd like to improve upon. It's easy to get caught up on the downsides of the job (particularly as its fun to bitch with your classmates) but just try to keep in perspective that 6.99Bn/7.0Bn people on this planet would trade places with you in a heartbeat.

I'm avoiding doing work so feel free to ask away.

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Jan 9, 2019

Wouldn't you think if one were to try to go to buy-side, it would be extremely hard from CB?

I think that's one of the only reasons why I was also considering lateralling into IB after the analyst years (if that option were available, if not oh well).

  1. I know banking is notorious for working quite a bit of holidays or pulling hours when others are off which usually creates FOMO, but what's it like in CB? Guessing since you just passed holiday season, you probably have the best insight.

Thanks for the advice on the gym and keeping mental/emotional maintenance in check. Trying to solidify my eating/gym routing while in my last months of college to hopefully transition that into the workforce to stay somewhat sane.

Jan 9, 2019

+1

2nd year analyst working in CB group of large asset manager. Can confirm most CB analysts graduate to debt-focused buyside or DCM roles. Also have only worked 1-2 weekends in my time.

Jan 9, 2019

That's really interesting, I had no idea asset management groups would have CB teams as well. Is your work similar to CB in the sense of relationship management and acting as a gateway to other services? Trying to picture how a buyside (?) CB role would work and would love some insight on it.

Jan 9, 2019

CB group acquired by large asset manager*. Prior to that we were under a regional mainly commercial bank. The former just sounds better lol.

My work is mainly relationship management and underwriting. The group is pretty remote and doesn't really jive with the rest of the firm's operations but there are some cross-selling opps. Mainly a diversification/AUM add for the asset manager.

Jan 9, 2019

"Credit focused buyside roles like credit investing, mezz/debt funds, or non-"finance finance" roles like Corp Dev, Strategic Finance, etc are equally open to you."

Where are you getting this information from? I hear it all the time, but yet to see it happen on linkedin, but maybe I just don't have the right connections. I think breaking into corp dev from corp banking is pretty hard, the job functions are completely different.

Jan 9, 2019

Combination of what I've seen and online research. One reason could be that CB roles have much more variance than IB, so doing CB in one specific environment may lead to opportunities not present in others. That's just me speculating though.

I would disagree that Corp Dev and CB functions are completely different for a couple reasons:

  1. Capital Return analysis is one of the major functions of a CB group, and we consider M&A to be a major form of capital return. Consequently, we look into how M&A would affect debt capacity, credit ratings, cash flows and other metrics and we're constantly discussing acquisition opportunities with clients.
  2. CB is supposed to help bring business to other divisions of the bank and obviously M&A is hugely important to IB. Jointly pitching M&A with IB is a major part of CB's job, so CB juniors get a lot of exposure/cross-staffings on potential acquisitions.
  3. Once an acquisition goes live, companies often raise/refinance debt and see significant impact in many other categories. CB's bread and butter is debt and credit analysis, so we're involved there as well.

The connection is not as direct as IB to Corp Dev, but similar enough that it should be a viable exit. This may not be the case for CB functions that only focus on giving out bank debt.

Jan 9, 2019

This helps a lot - I sent you a PM. I have a few other questions for CB.

Jan 9, 2019

If possible, just like I've been doing, do you mind typing up the questions for everyone in the thread to read.

Might be nuggets of gold for us incoming analysts or those trying to transition into CB.

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Jan 9, 2019

Basically my question was - How does someone who is qualified for corporate banking lateral into Corporate Banking? I have only applied online and it has gotten me 1 phone call interview which led nowhere. So how does someone get into CB, because I work in middle market lending and partner with banks/asset managers on their loan syndications.

Jan 10, 2019

@thrwawy maybe you could offer some guidance on this question?

From my own experience personally, I applied to over 30 firms over a span of a weekend, reached out to workers of the firms and got to know the business/role/responsibilities, etc. and luckily stumbled upon an alumni who was working in CB at the time.

Leverage LinkedIn to the fullest. Literally type in "Corporate Banking Analyst" in the "people" search bar and filter it by location/bank/etc.

Networking and crafting your story as to why you are qualified will be your key points in breaking in. Then again this is just one POV, hopefully others will respond with their POV's.

Jan 10, 2019

Aside from the Analysts, who else did you reach out to network with? Doubt Analysts have any real input on hiring decisions on a candidate. You mentioned applied online, was that how you received your corporate banking interviews? Online applications have not done the trick for me yet - so I was looking for another avenue to lateral.

Jan 10, 2019

Analysts may not have any input on the hiring decision but making friends with them will open the doors for any internal positions that open up and they ask all the analysts if they have any references in mind.

I also reached out to alumni, but mainly used LinkedIn and WSO's networking guide.

Yeah, by applying online over the last semester was pretty much how I got my first round of interviews. Then from there, it was just practicing and being myself.

Jan 12, 2019

Unfortunately my answer for this wouldn't differ much from the standard network hard, build relationships and prep your story. You're competing against a smaller number of people interested in the role relative to IB, but there are also far fewer spots so it probably comes up as a wash.

Jan 9, 2019

What is the difference between Commercial and Corporate Banking? Sorry for the dumb question but the definitions are different depending on what bank you go to.

Jan 10, 2019

+1 on your username.

WSO has some really interesting articles in explaining CB and I have posted the link below.

https://www.wallstreetoasis.com/forums/why-corpora...
Commercial banking in my POV would be like walking into your local bank (WF, PNC, TD) and speaking to a teller or branch manager. Super dumbie-downed version, so hopefully I don't get backlash but that's more or less what I always thought Commercial Banking was.

Hopefully that helped somewhat.

Jan 10, 2019
NonTargetHardo2019:

Commercial banking in my POV would be like walking into your local bank (WF, PNC, TD) and speaking to a teller or branch manager.

What you're describing is retail banking. Commercial banking is much more similar to corporate banking, servicing middle market clients instead of large corporates. The lines between the two can be blurry and vary by bank, but a typical cut-off would be $1B in revenues.

Jan 10, 2019

Thanks for the clarification. Always good to get more information on a matter.

Jan 12, 2019

And like the user said above, the line is blurry. Some banks have the cut-off at $2-3B so you can be working in commercial banking with clients that have a $500-10,000MM market cap.

Jan 12, 2019

Would agree with this and also add that the credit analysis itself can be more rigorous in the commercial bank because the credit quality of the client is more ambiguous and demands more sensitivity. The credit analysis required for a mega-cap tends to be simpler and so the focus lies more on other strategic elements of the relationship. This has its own pros and cons from a junior perspective.

Jan 12, 2019

What were corporate banking bonuses looking like at the associate level this year?

Jan 13, 2019

Should absolutely be noted that the 85k base/20-25k bonus at year one only applies to some BB's (and maybe Suntrust for some reason...). At Wells, BAML, and anything smaller, starting pay is 70k + 10-15% bonus. That first comp range is more applicable to first year associates at non-bb's. Also, 60-70 hours is a little high. Would say it's more like 45-60. But I'm also honest about hours, whereas some people like to overinflate for some reason.

Source: was an Analyst and Associate at Wells/BAML CB

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Jan 13, 2019

New York office?

Jan 14, 2019
Jan 14, 2019