What is the "McK/B/BCG" of asset management?? (e.g. - the unanimously agreed upon top firms)
If one wants to have a successful management consulting career (or eventually wants to become a ceo), chosing a firm is simple...go for the top three...McKinsey, bain, or Boston Consulting group. If one wants to have a successful accounting career, again, chosing a firm is simple...go for the big four...(I've never bothered to look them up).
BUT...
If one wants to have a successful Asset Management career, chosing a firm is not so simple....
So, my question is this - What are the unanimously agreed upon top firms in the field of asset management (e.g. what mck/b/BCG is to management consulting)?? If I had the qualifications to work for anyone in asset management - and wanted to be very successful eventually - what would be the best fims to work for?
Thank you very much in advance for any help!
Best,
Blue
BlackRock is one. Also all banks have private banking/ asset management arms. Jpm has a really top notch asset management division.
http://finance.yahoo.com/news/Our-Top-Two-Picks-in-the-ms-2315326085.ht…
PIMCO. Fidelity is also well-regarded.
PIMCO, blackrock, wellington, fidelity
also, asset management divisions of goldman sachs and JP Morgan are top notch.
blackrock gsam jpm am pimco fidelity State Street Global Advisors
I would add Capital Group to this list.
Vanguard
I realize it's like comparing apples and oranges, but how do these places compare in prestige (within the financial community, and with B-school adcoms) against the BBs? Never see these places get mentioned on this forum; is it because not many people are interested in these firms or because they take only more senior professionals?
B-school adcoms at all the top schools will be very familiar with these firms. My guess is they're regarded just as highly as BB banks, but slightly lower than the top tier PE or consulting shops.
Within finance, it's probably a buy-side / sell-side rivalry, right? All the guys at the top buy-side shops probably turn up their noses at the bankers, and visa versa... but then again I have no clue (just a consultant).
It depends on the security / style equity vs fi then subdivision eg: equity -> value, growth, int'l etc...
This has been convered briefly before.
how do you pick the best? avg returns? comp?
just know the buyside pays less than sellside, especially mutual funds
Beg to differ with JP/GS - in general I think the asset management divisions inside the banks are not as well regarded by the institutional investment community. The larger top firms are Blackrock, PIMCO, GMO, Wellington
JPM - equity & fixed income GSAM Blackrock PIMCO - dominates the fixed income universe
Dreyfus Columbia
JPM, GS, WF, and BAC (they own part of Blackrock) are really the only BB ibanks that have top notch AM arms. The other banks like DB, CS, MS don't have clout.
WF is a bit player and does not have a AM division that is viewed as top notch. Blackrock is NOT BAC's asset management group. They own about 1/3 of BLK and by no means does either party view themselves as part of the other. On the other side of the equation, DB has a very large fixed income AM group and is a significant player with certain institutional investors. They have plenty of clout in the market.
BlackRock churns out a lot of index funds--they have a huge business but a lot of it is not actively managed at all. JPMAM and GSAM are probably the strongest of the BBs, and PIMCO is damn good at what they do.
PIMCO is probably the toughest AM firm to get a job at.
PIMCO is definitely most legit
BlackRock is absolutely NOT baml's AM group.. they actually COMPETE with each other in some spaces.
If we're talking about AM in terms of funds business..
BlackRock PIMCO Wellington Vanguard Fidelity
JPM and GSAM lack severely in their funds business and are known more from private banking..
Here is the answer to the original question:
Equities: Tier I: Capital Group, Dodge & Cox Tier 2: Fidelity, Wellington, T. Rowe There's lots of other smaller respectable firms, but the OP asked for the 'big 3/big 4'.
Fixed Income: Tier I: PIMCO
As you can see, I've excluded the the firms that provide passively managed fund products (index, ETF's, etc.). Yes, they are big, profitable business, but their employees do not necessarily hold prestigue within the world of active investors.
Prestigue is determined by where the top talent wants to be. The top talent follows the dollars. And the dollars are determined by AUM / number of investment professionals, simplistically speaking.
d&c for FI too
I agree with the equities tier. Analyst at Capital is on par with anywhere due to the money managed by analysts. It’s a unique structure but analysts manage as much as some PMs at other shops. Analysts and even PMs from other shops will jump to Capital if an opportunity opens up. Dodge and cox is also top tier. The issue with places like this is that rarely do positions open up and there is definitely a ceiling if you are at the associate level. It’s usually a post (top 5) MBA plus bulge bracket or regarded buyside before and after MBA type entry. Some MBAs get in with a summer internship but it’s rare and usually only one per year.
The different with Fidelity and T Rowe is that it is fund dependent. Some are extremely respected across the industry (New Horizons at T Rowe) but experiences may vary.
And add Wellington to the list. There are some really talented investors there.
I mostly agree but Wellington is in that tier 1, clear notch above T Rowe
Work at T. Rowe. Based on recent performance, don't necessarily disagree, but the only thing I'll say is that the Analyst team is more unified than I believe many tend to characterize it. Many state that the research analysts are each focused on one PM or fund, and while this is true to an extent, much of the time it is not
AM Is far too broad a career path. It can mean simply allocating portfolios to asset classes, doing fundamental analysis on stocks, quant trading and anything in between. Do you mean HFs? PWM? Stock picking? Manager research? You can’t compare.
There is one massive difference between banking and AM: small is generally better in AM. Shops like T. Rowe Price and Fidelity are so big that there is very little active management going on there – they basically own everything. They may SAY they are active managers but no one can truly manage a trillion dollars actively – those guys are essentially enhanced indexers.
I’m not big on the AM side of banks. I may be biased because they hire smaller boutiques and HFs to manage $$$ for them.
The best place to be is a HF or a boutique asset manager that can basically do whatever it wants with its AUM. I would rather work for Einhorn at Greenlight or Greenblatt at Gotham any day of the week than some big factory that has commercial during college football games.
"BlackRock is absolutely NOT baml's AM group.."
BlackRock was owned by MY at one time. They actually have a pretty convoluted ownership history
What are your thoughts about BNY Mellon? Finding it hard to assess it's reputation, as I'm beeing new to this industry. Thanks.
If you're referring to the Dreyfus funds, then you are on the right track. If you are referring to the majority of BO fund accounting positions at BNY Mellon, then look elsewhere.
What do you think about Alcentra? Also part of BNY Group. Thanks for your quick answer...
Allianz Global Investors, Fidelity, Wellington
All the others previously mentioned are going passive and BB banks are notoriously not as good as these three for AM, not even close.
Rumors this week have it that AGI might be interested in acquiring DWS (DB Asset Management) that was spun out last year. I think Reuters reported. That would be an interesting development because Allianz were then owning another >1tn asset manager next to PIMCO.
How do you think this could impact junior people currently working at AGI? The organization could become more beuroceatic and less lean but at the same time the larger size could translate into higher prestige maybe. Do you think it will be overall a plus or a minus for junior people who are currently working at AGI?
Biased towards more boutique type names for equities but generally:
Equities - Harris associates, duff and Phelps, Royce and associates, hotchkis and Wiley, artisan, Ruane cuniff and goldfarb. Also, the big AMs have some top talent but not sure how much this has shifted over the years: Fidelity, Wellington, etc.
Fixed income: pimco, TCW, doubleline, neuberger berman, and others. Obviously if you want to do distressed/cuspier debt investing then you’d want to look at either the top distressed firms and also some CLO managers. All those names are on the forum in other places
Not duff and Phelps haha -dodge and cox **
PRIVATE LO mega-asset managers with the most prestige: Fidelity, PIMCO, Wellington, and Capital Group
.
Where does MFS rank in equities/fixed income, are they a tier below Fido/Wellington/T Rowe?
Strong firm where you can have a long and rewarding career but a notch below
Surprised no one has mentioned PGIM - $1.5 Trillion manager. Recently joined the AM industry so interested in learning more about the above firms and what they are known/good at.
PGIM is discussed in the thread "what's the Deloitte of asset management"
LMAOO chill they "train the street"!
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