Just out of curiosity, since bonus are going to be down this year (most likely for a lot of bankers), what is the lowest amount of compensation you would take to do your job?
I know many get into banking for the money, but I am curious is the career in banking still worth if the cash doesn't follow. I am personally happy with what I do on a day to day basis, but want to hear other takes.
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I think you need to separate out; a) am I willing to work for just base salary this year (with the expectation that things will likely return to normal next year) or b) fundamentally has the industry changed such that compensation is now permanently lower and what is the lowest I'd accept to keep doing this job.
a) is easy to answer for me; I'm more than fine having a secure job where I can work from home and get paid a very comfortable A3 base during a global pandemic where ~20-30% of the country is unemployed. If that means less bonus, so be it for a year as in the long-run being in the seat is more valuable.
b) is a more difficult question to answer. This was a good thread that I think addresses the main component of trading time for money: https://www.wallstreetoasis.com/forums/what-comp-would-you-require-to-a…
I provided some thoughts there (as did others). I think that is a good framework for making your own personal assessment
For me, banking isn't about how much money I make during my analyst stint, it's about the earning potential unlocked as a senior banker or via buyside exit opps. I'd be fine working for my 85k base for two years because my goal is to be making millions when I'm 40. Obviously I want a bonus, but people need to think more long term when it comes to comp.
Says the intern.
that makes no sense. you may not ever be a senior banker or PE partner. you gotta get paid for those long hours now.
But the people who make it to the top are few and far between. And becoming extremely wealthy in finance (multi-billions) is even rarer.
$735k
very specific
"I'd do the game for free. You get paid for the bullshit" - Dennis Rodman
Amazing username
I was thinking the same
This is an awesome comment
i'm very sad that the last dance is over
fuck that documentary kicked ass
"The blood and tears of my country's people." - Dennis Rodman's best friend, the one and only Kim Jong-Un
If things are so bad I get a $0 bonus I’d be happy to have a job. Following on that, I never did this job solely so I could make a lot of money at age 23. I did it so that I can have a career with a more favorable compensation profile than I likely otherwise could. So even if my bonus is $15K for this year, hopefully that negative delta will be immaterial in the long run.
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You're more self-aware about this than most interns. SB for that.
Saying it is one thing, but doing it is another. Stay strong.
AN1: 35k
more than what I’ll get
Ask Justine Tobin
If you're at BofA, you better be expecting a big bonus considering they have cash to burn for this: https://www.cnn.com/2020/06/02/business/bank-of-america-billion-dollar-…
165k
This completely depends on your profile and the experience at athe specific bank. What are your other options?
In a vacuum (ie no other options), if you are getting actual live deal flow and building skills, I would say you should accept whatever it is you need to eat, have clean shelter and cloth yourself. Why? Because the exit options alone coming from a good IB program are worth millions of dollars in career earnings and option value. No, I'm not exaggerating. If you are in a top group at a great bank or even a MM getting great deal reps over 2 years, you have a ton of career flexiblity and earning potential wrapped into a very horrible/difficult bootcamp...
So, in NYC it would be around $50k with no bonus?...in lower COL even less. This is having gone through it and thinking the $ really mattered and looking at it 16 years later and seeing that the ~90% of the value analysts derive from the job is not the bonus or salary...
Well worded. I think that sometimes the exit ops and long term value is "overestimated" because not every analyst stays in top tier jobs. Do you have any comment on this?
I'd say it depends on how you define top tier... Megafund pe, sure, very few stay in that for the long haul, but I'd argue there are a lot of other "top tier" jobs /tracks when you factor in lifestyle and freedom (a lot of the guests on the WSO podcast are living this and explained to how you they did it)
For example, working in Corp dev for a fast growing start-up or on the internal Corp strategy team at a large f500 firm working directly with the executive team, maybe joining an earlier stage business as CFO or opening a chain of small brick and mortar businesses... The IB skill set allows you to jump to almost anything you want related to business... From starting your own to going and working at a large f500 if that suits you and your lifestyle better... It also makes everything else feel easy which is an advantage by itself.
From what I’ve seen “not every analyst stays in top tier jobs” is more like “most analysts don’t stay in top tier jobs”
Very much agree. At a junior level (analyst/associate) as long as you're still getting reps in it's still worth it with the prospect of a bonus. The comp goes beyond monetary at that level, building experience is very valuable.
Tough to say unfortunately. Worst case scenario, I would be okay with ~$100k all-in if for one year, but not for an extended period of time given the hours and stress levels that the role demands. If you're asking about this year's bonuses specifically, keep reading.
On one hand, I would love to get my hopes up and expect a $60-70k bonus (my bank is on a 2 bonus cycle, no stub). My group had a stellar year, even when taking COVID into account. Every 2nd year analyst closed 2-4 deals in the past year and fees for the group are near all time highs, even with COVID. We are also just as busy, if not more busy, than pre-COVID, so the per hour comp makes sense if we get large bonuses.
On the other hand, I work at a BB. Similar to most BBs and large corporate institutions in general, a lot of underperforming groups end up benefiting from the high revenue generating groups, and the high revenue groups get brought down by the underperformers. HR also has a ton of say in determining overall bonus pools and those decisions seem largely arbitrary.
The skill growth curve plateaus at ~8 months (at least it feels like it did for me), with the exception of some unique SPA items and other things you’ll see here and there on deals after that point. This is assuming you’re working for a bank that’s keeping you on at least one live deal at all times. Prior to feeling that plateau, I would have done it for just enough to pay for my living expenses and student loan payments. It was exciting learning something new every day. Mornings felt fresher then.
Now, though? The job is still good but nowhere near as “fun” as it was starting out. I enjoy my coworkers and the bank / group that I work for but the assignments all feel like a playlist on repeat. I still enjoy seeing new business models / sub sectors and listening in on how buyers think about companies we’re marketing but those times aren’t frequent enough to make up for the work to get there.
I’m really hoping PE can give my day to day work life that glint it had before but also slightly doubting that it will. TBD.
Nice phrase. This helped me realize that the reason why I'm bored in my job is due to a skill growth curve plateau... that and I'd rather go into the office than wfh.
HR for sure. first time I would hear an analyst happy day to day with disregard to pay.
working in F100 Corp finance I would say that it really depends. I really think the lowest I am willing to take changes with the learning opportunity. if I am growing professionally and working towards my goals I am willing to take less.
If HR asked me this question, I would phrase it as a function of effort and time. Assuming an $80K base with 80h weeks on average and 2 weeks off a year, your hourly income is $20. I would probably ask for about that, as I assume its the industry standard. This means that if you're a chilled firm where my average weeks are 60h, I'll happily take $60K. If you're a sweatshop where 100h weeks are the norm, then you better be prepared to cough up $100K base.
So you are willing to work more hours for the same pay?
No, literally the opposite. Willing to work more hours if the pay increases.
6,000,000,000 Schrute Bucks
Literally zero dollars, if it got me into IB. I’m a SIMP for IB.
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We found the non-targets
ALERT ALERT ALERT
SIMP DETECTED
ALERT ALERT ALERT
Got furloughed from my MM Boutique as a first year - would go on reduced pay just to get my job back lol.
Dang, If you don't mind me asking what position?
NYC?
West Coast, 1st Year analyst, was told it was a matter of last in first out and excess capacity in the system. Some folks at higher levels got laid off.
Tree Fiddy
Same as your’s. lol
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