8/18/11

Alright, so here are the options that I'm left with (both from the dealership/store). (Please no judgement from you, IlliniProgrammer =P lol)

2011 Mercedes Benz C300 with the AMG sport package, nav and all the bells and whistles.
http://www.google.ca/imgres?q=2011+mercedes+c300&u...

2011 BMW 328xi
http://www.google.ca/imgres?imgurl=http://www.2012...

Here's what I'm struggling with. The benz looks soo much nicer (both interior and exterior), but the bmw feels better when I'm driving. Please discuss and let me know what you guys think.

Thanks!

Comments (125)

8/18/11

I guess it comes down to what is more important to you. For me I would always pick the car that feels better when driving. Looks are just less important to me. Personally I think bmws drive better so I would go with the 328. How about leg room, and trunk space? They're both nice cars so you really can't go wrong.

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8/18/11

That's the thing, I just can't decide which is more important to me. The benz feels pretty good too, just not as tight as the bmw. On the other hand, the bmw is still pretty nice, just not as sexy as the benz (imo). That's why its so tough.

As douchey as this may sound, what about the most shallow of criteria? Which car projects the more "baller" (hate using this word) image? lol

-MBP

8/18/11
manbearpig:

That's the thing, I just can't decide which is more important to me. The benz feels pretty good too, just not as tight as the bmw. On the other hand, the bmw is still pretty nice, just not as sexy as the benz (imo). That's why its so tough.

As douchey as this may sound, what about the most shallow of criteria? Which car projects the more "baller" (hate using this word) image? lol

Potential baller-status depends entirely on how you're going to use the car. Are you a cruiser? Like to take leisurely drives and attract attention? Get the Benz.

Do you enjoy the act of driving? Will you drive fast? Get the BMW.

An aside: How did you narrow it down to these two choices? There are some other great options in that price range.

8/18/11
Jimage:
manbearpig:

That's the thing, I just can't decide which is more important to me. The benz feels pretty good too, just not as tight as the bmw. On the other hand, the bmw is still pretty nice, just not as sexy as the benz (imo). That's why its so tough.

As douchey as this may sound, what about the most shallow of criteria? Which car projects the more "baller" (hate using this word) image? lol

Potential baller-status depends entirely on how you're going to use the car. Are you a cruiser? Like to take leisurely drives and attract attention? Get the Benz.

Do you enjoy the act of driving? Will you drive fast? Get the BMW.

An aside: How did you narrow it down to these two choices? There are some other great options in that price range.

I started off with four cars. Audi A4, Lexus IS300, and then the cars I mentioned. I test drove all of them, and just didn't like the lexus that much. The audi was close, but it didn't make the cut because i prefer the look of the benz and the drive of the bmw. They are all in the 45-50K range after taxes and everything so the price isn't much of an issue. Do you have any other suggestions? I'm open to trying out other cars.

-MBP

8/18/11
manbearpig:

I started off with four cars. Audi A4, Lexus IS300, and then the cars I mentioned. I test drove all of them, and just didn't like the lexus that much. The audi was close, but it didn't make the cut because i prefer the look of the benz and the drive of the bmw. They are all in the 45-50K range after taxes and everything so the price isn't much of an issue. Do you have any other suggestions? I'm open to trying out other cars.

I strongly encourage you to look at Audi S4s. They are slightly more than your quoted price range, but you could look for a lightly used one (hard to find because people love them).

Also, if you're into cruising with the car, I would look at a fully-loaded Hyundai Genesis sedan. I'm sure I'm going to take some crap on this board for saying that, but it's actually a great car. Very nice looking, excellent options, etc.

8/18/11
Jimage:
manbearpig:

I started off with four cars. Audi A4, Lexus IS300, and then the cars I mentioned. I test drove all of them, and just didn't like the lexus that much. The audi was close, but it didn't make the cut because i prefer the look of the benz and the drive of the bmw. They are all in the 45-50K range after taxes and everything so the price isn't much of an issue. Do you have any other suggestions? I'm open to trying out other cars.

I strongly encourage you to look at Audi S4s. They are slightly more than your quoted price range, but you could look for a lightly used one (hard to find because people love them).

Also, if you're into cruising with the car, I would look at a fully-loaded Hyundai Genesis sedan. I'm sure I'm going to take some crap on this board for saying that, but it's actually a great car. Very nice looking, excellent options, etc.

lol, dude I'm not getting a hyundai. I love the S4, but not as much as the m3 or c63. If I want to go in that price range, I'd rather go with one of the other options.

-MBP

8/18/11
manbearpig:
Jimage:
manbearpig:

I started off with four cars. Audi A4, Lexus IS300, and then the cars I mentioned. I test drove all of them, and just didn't like the lexus that much. The audi was close, but it didn't make the cut because i prefer the look of the benz and the drive of the bmw. They are all in the 45-50K range after taxes and everything so the price isn't much of an issue. Do you have any other suggestions? I'm open to trying out other cars.

I strongly encourage you to look at Audi S4s. They are slightly more than your quoted price range, but you could look for a lightly used one (hard to find because people love them).

Also, if you're into cruising with the car, I would look at a fully-loaded Hyundai Genesis sedan. I'm sure I'm going to take some crap on this board for saying that, but it's actually a great car. Very nice looking, excellent options, etc.

lol, dude I'm not getting a hyundai. I love the S4, but not as much as the m3 or c63. If I want to go in that price range, I'd rather go with one of the other options.

Just humor me and watch this: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XY-J7topqJQ

8/18/11
Jimage:
manbearpig:
Jimage:
manbearpig:

I started off with four cars. Audi A4, Lexus IS300, and then the cars I mentioned. I test drove all of them, and just didn't like the lexus that much. The audi was close, but it didn't make the cut because i prefer the look of the benz and the drive of the bmw. They are all in the 45-50K range after taxes and everything so the price isn't much of an issue. Do you have any other suggestions? I'm open to trying out other cars.

I strongly encourage you to look at Audi S4s. They are slightly more than your quoted price range, but you could look for a lightly used one (hard to find because people love them).

Also, if you're into cruising with the car, I would look at a fully-loaded Hyundai Genesis sedan. I'm sure I'm going to take some crap on this board for saying that, but it's actually a great car. Very nice looking, excellent options, etc.

lol, dude I'm not getting a hyundai. I love the S4, but not as much as the m3 or c63. If I want to go in that price range, I'd rather go with one of the other options.

Just humor me and watch this: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XY-J7topqJQ

Ok, I admit, it's a nice looking car. But 5 litre engine? What am I gonna do with that? lol. I don't even want to go over 3 litres.

-MBP

8/18/11
Jimage:
manbearpig:

That's the thing, I just can't decide which is more important to me. The benz feels pretty good too, just not as tight as the bmw. On the other hand, the bmw is still pretty nice, just not as sexy as the benz (imo). That's why its so tough.

As douchey as this may sound, what about the most shallow of criteria? Which car projects the more "baller" (hate using this word) image? lol

Potential baller-status depends entirely on how you're going to use the car. Are you a cruiser? Like to take leisurely drives and attract attention? Get the Benz.

Do you enjoy the act of driving? Will you drive fast? Get the BMW.

An aside: How did you narrow it down to these two choices? There are some other great options in that price range.

Never answered your question - I haven't driven a lot, ever. Never really needed to. I've been living in downtown toronto since I was old enough to drive. I like the idea of cruising a bit more though. I probably won't drive fast because I'm not interested in getting speeding tickets and paying giant insurance premiums.

-MBP

8/24/11
manbearpig:

That's the thing, I just can't decide which is more important to me. The benz feels pretty good too, just not as tight as the bmw. On the other hand, the bmw is still pretty nice, just not as sexy as the benz (imo). That's why its so tough.

As douchey as this may sound, what about the most shallow of criteria? Which car projects the more "baller" (hate using this word) image? lol

Neither. save your money till U can either get a M5 or a CL63 AMG cash. Provided you are liquid for 1mm. That's "Baller" otherwise you are just like your uncle in Utah working at Edward Jones and taking orders for a living

"The higher up the mountain, the more treacherous the path"
-Frank Underwood

8/24/11
barboon:
manbearpig:

That's the thing, I just can't decide which is more important to me. The benz feels pretty good too, just not as tight as the bmw. On the other hand, the bmw is still pretty nice, just not as sexy as the benz (imo). That's why its so tough.

As douchey as this may sound, what about the most shallow of criteria? Which car projects the more "baller" (hate using this word) image? lol

Neither. save your money till U can either get a M5 or a CL63 AMG cash. Provided you are liquid for 1mm. That's "Baller" otherwise you are just like your uncle in Utah working at Edward Jones and taking orders for a living

Ignore this bullshit. No one thinks you work at Edward Jones with an S4. Though I should say that my RS4 would crush you but the previous point remains.

If I had asked people what they wanted, they would have said faster horses - Henry Ford

8/25/11
barboon:

Neither. save your money till U can either get a M5 or a CL63 AMG cash. Provided you are liquid for 1mm. That's "Baller" otherwise you are just like your uncle in Utah working at Edward Jones and taking orders for a living

My friend bought a cl63 amg a couple years ago. He fucking loved it, then traded it in for the most ridiculous Shelby you've ever seen. Now he's gone and traded that in for the new e500 amg. Jealous doesn't describe my emotional state.

"You stop being an asshole when it sucks to be you." -IlliniProgrammer
"Your grammar made me wish I'd been aborted." -happypantsmcgee

8/18/11

328 for sure, never been a big fan of the c-series mercedes

"You stop being an asshole when it sucks to be you." -IlliniProgrammer
"Your grammar made me wish I'd been aborted." -happypantsmcgee

8/18/11
D M:

328 for sure, never been a big fan of the c-series mercedes

Thanks for the input. Anything in particular you liked about the 328?

-MBP

8/18/11

IMO, go 335 or don't bother with 3 series. 328 feels really weak when I've driven them. Difference between 300 and 350 is much smaller, particularly with AMG package, and I would go with that between your two choices.

If you consider the 335 though, I would choose that hands down. Or if you're willing to spend a little more... S4.

8/18/11

I'd go with the Benz, but if you're barely scraping by in NY, do not purchase it. Save your money to start your own thing or get ready to take on some serious financial obligations like a family, house and kids.

Wife drives an ML and I have an S. We do not subsist on an associate/VP salary.

One thing to consider: Many, many people suspect that those who drive the C-class cannot easily afford a Benz or are just starting out professionally and trying to make an outsized name for themselves. I would recommend an E-class so that you don't get lumped into that category, even though you're looking at an AMG.

I rich, smarts, and totally in debt.

8/18/11
MrDouche:

I'd go with the Benz, but if you're barely scraping by in NY, do not purchase it. Save your money to start your own thing or get ready to take on some serious financial obligations like a family, house and kids.

Wife drives an ML and I have an S. We do not subsist on an associate/VP salary.

One thing to consider: Many, many people suspect that those who drive the C-class cannot easily afford a Benz or are just starting out professionally and trying to make an outsized name for themselves. I would recommend an E-class so that you don't get lumped into that category, even though you're looking at an AMG.

I live in Toronto, which is considerably cheaper than NY as it is. Though I don't make close to investment banking money, I'm doing alright for myself. Have a monthly after tax cash flow of about 7K, and my mortgage is only 1500. Food is another 500, and on top of that I have about 60K in savings, so I'm considering just buying this car with straight cash (I'll be able to negotiate the price down at least 6-7% this way). I could go for the E, but I'll probably need to finance about 15-20K of it, which isn't the end of the world, but I don't want a big car because they're gas guzzlers. The E is gorgeous though - absolutely love it.

You bring up some interesting points about the image a C class will project. I'm only 24, so I don't care if people think I can't afford a "better" benz (most of my friends from HS can't even afford their own rent payments). I don't, however, want to give off the impression that I just want a benz and I'll buy the cheapest one I can find. I would imagine people with this attitude would buy a used benz, which I'm not willing to do...

-MBP

8/18/11
manbearpig:
MrDouche:

I'd go with the Benz, but if you're barely scraping by in NY, do not purchase it. Save your money to start your own thing or get ready to take on some serious financial obligations like a family, house and kids.

Wife drives an ML and I have an S. We do not subsist on an associate/VP salary.

One thing to consider: Many, many people suspect that those who drive the C-class cannot easily afford a Benz or are just starting out professionally and trying to make an outsized name for themselves. I would recommend an E-class so that you don't get lumped into that category, even though you're looking at an AMG.

I live in Toronto, which is considerably cheaper than NY as it is. Though I don't make close to investment banking money, I'm doing alright for myself. Have a monthly after tax cash flow of about 7K, and my mortgage is only 1500. Food is another 500, and on top of that I have about 60K in savings, so I'm considering just buying this car with straight cash (I'll be able to negotiate the price down at least 6-7% this way). I could go for the E, but I'll probably need to finance about 15-20K of it, which isn't the end of the world, but I don't want a big car because they're gas guzzlers. The E is gorgeous though - absolutely love it.

You bring up some interesting points about the image a C class will project. I'm only 24, so I don't care if people think I can't afford a "better" benz (most of my friends from HS can't even afford their own rent payments). I don't, however, want to give off the impression that I just want a benz and I'll buy the cheapest one I can find. I would imagine people with this attitude would buy a used benz, which I'm not willing to do...

Not sure how it is in Canada, but here in the U.S. a lot of times you'll get a better deal if you finance it versus paying cash. Reason is they get incentives from finance companies/banks. When negotiating don't let them know how you intend to pay for it.

8/18/11

I actually like the look of the BMW more than the c300, and I also like the way it drives better, too. Plus, beemers are cheaper as far as upkeep (from what I've heard), which is a plus

"You stop being an asshole when it sucks to be you." -IlliniProgrammer
"Your grammar made me wish I'd been aborted." -happypantsmcgee

8/18/11
D M:

I actually like the look of the BMW more than the c300, and I also like the way it drives better, too. Plus, beemers are cheaper as far as upkeep (from what I've heard), which is a plus

BMW has no charge scheduled maintenance for the first 3 or 4 years of ownership but they're not cheap cars to maintain (assuming you take it too a dealer, independent mechanics are a different story).

8/18/11

Have you checked out the Infiniti G37 sedan? I have a G37xS

I was originally looking at the BMW 335i/M3 and Mercedes Benz C350/C63 but after test driving them I decided to go with the Infiniti. It's a little bigger on the inside than the BMW and MB offerings and I realized that while they're really nice, I didn't need anything as "extreme" as the M3 or C63. I live in Toronto too and take the subway to work everyday so I really only use my car in the evenings or weekends.

8/18/11
Weaponized Cum:

Have you checked out the Infiniti G37 sedan? I have a G37xS

I was originally looking at the BMW 335i/M3 and Mercedes Benz C350/C63 but after test driving them I decided to go with the Infiniti. It's a little bigger on the inside than the BMW and MB offerings and I realized that while they're really nice, I didn't need anything as "extreme" as the M3 or C63. I live in Toronto too and take the subway to work everyday so I really only use my car in the evenings or weekends.

It's a great car, but my brother just bought it 2 months ago. lol, I don't want to get the exact same car as him.

-MBP

8/18/11

Agree with the S4 recommendations. Get a manual, and have a blast. They're fun as hell.

8/18/11

Use Unhaggle to purchase your car. Best. Invention. Ever.

8/18/11

I wouldn't use your money right now. Interest rates are cheap. I think you're cutting it way too close to purchase a $50,000 car in any case. Save it so that you aren't tied down. I say this as someone who bootstrapped a transition to entrepreneurship from finance. But if you do a Benz, avoid the C-class. Even a used E or S will give you more cachet than a new C. Same for 3 series and S4.

A new C will actually call into question your earnings more than anything from my friends or myself.

There is a lot of money to be made in this economy if you're clever and have guts. You won't make it if you spend it on a car or are an associate for that matter.

I rich, smarts, and totally in debt.

8/18/11

Are you a big car guy, like you're really into them? Because honestly I would just lease one if I were you. I hear Mercedes has some pretty insane leasing deals right now.

"You stop being an asshole when it sucks to be you." -IlliniProgrammer
"Your grammar made me wish I'd been aborted." -happypantsmcgee

8/18/11

Just go big and get a lambo.

8/18/11
njmonkey46:

Just go big and get a lambo.

lol, that'll be my second car =P

-MBP

8/18/11

My wife has a C350. Its a good car, but if I had to do it over again we'd get her the beamer.

8/18/11

Get the C300. I know it doesn't drive as well, but I despise most BMW drivers.

8/18/11

the new c-class is fuckin awesome. but, as a lot of people have said, bmw is better for performance driving

8/18/11

We actually were gonna get the bmw, but the salesman seemed uninterested in us because we were young. He emailed my wife a few days later and she told him since he was rude we went and bought a brand new mercedes.

8/18/11

So, why are you even bothering to get a car? You may have a little extra cash, but you don't REALLY have it. The TTC isn't that bad and I doubt you'd be driving the car THAT much. Seems like a lot of money to just piss away because you can.

I mean, if its the baller status you want to project, why not spend money on trips to different locations. Weekend trips to Monaco or somewhere else luxurious. I'm pretty sure the people you associate with and the new people you meet would think much more "highly" or "balla" of you if you could list off all these bomb ass places you've been instead of simply saying that you drive a benz/bmw.

-philly g

8/18/11
philgorman:

So, why are you even bothering to get a car? You may have a little extra cash, but you don't REALLY have it. The TTC isn't that bad and I doubt you'd be driving the car THAT much. Seems like a lot of money to just piss away because you can.

I mean, if its the baller status you want to project, why not spend money on trips to different locations. Weekend trips to Monaco or somewhere else luxurious. I'm pretty sure the people you associate with and the new people you meet would think much more "highly" or "balla" of you if you could list off all these bomb ass places you've been instead of simply saying that you drive a benz/bmw.

Going to have to agree on this one. Im two years younger than you, so I don't think I'm in a position to be handing out advice. However, it seems like you are buying an expensive, entry-level luxury car for no apparent reason other than to impress people or drive fast.

The fact of the matter is, 50 grand won't buy a "baller" car, but instead will get you a low-end luxury vehicle which will actually generate negative judgments from others (as seen in this thread) about your social status. No one really cares about the car you drive, so why throw away 50k at 24 when you can use that money in much better ways.

I've got to agree with philly g. If you want to blow your money, take a trip to a sick location. Or better yet, invest it in yourself. Sure, you can invest in the market or something. But if you are seeking the drill of driving for two hours on the weekend, why don't you just pay $200 a week for flying lessons. Flying planes is cooler than driving, people will think its impressive (since its original), and you won't be wasting fifty grand on a depreciating asset.

If you had to pick between the two cars, go with the c class, because it will speak the truth about your status.

looking for that pick-me-up to power through an all-nighter?
8/18/11
philgorman:

So, why are you even bothering to get a car? You may have a little extra cash, but you don't REALLY have it. The TTC isn't that bad and I doubt you'd be driving the car THAT much. Seems like a lot of money to just piss away because you can.

I mean, if its the baller status you want to project, why not spend money on trips to different locations. Weekend trips to Monaco or somewhere else luxurious. I'm pretty sure the people you associate with and the new people you meet would think much more "highly" or "balla" of you if you could list off all these bomb ass places you've been instead of simply saying that you drive a benz/bmw.

The TTC's pretty awful actually (subway system blows, streetcars are slow...) but I do agree with you. If you're in downtown Toronto MBP, do you really want to drive around? Seems like a lot of dough for little reason. Unless you really plan on doing a lot of weekend driving outside of the city...

I don't think you were being too serious with your 'baller status' concern. But nice watches, good wine, fine cigars, clothes... these things can serve that purpose. A $50K car really isn't all that baller. It's funny cause I've known MDs, partners, etc. with pretty average cars, but you can definitely tell they have cash from their personal upkeep.

8/18/11

I'd drive a lot over the weekend. The car isn't there to get me to work and back, I live 3 blocks from work and it takes me 5 minutes to walk each way. I have friends and family scattered all over the GTA and taking the GO to see them is a massive pain in the ass. What am I saving for if not to buy nice things? lol.

-MBP

8/18/11

Get the BMW. Parents have an S and a 5 series, I learned to drive on an old Benz(E class) and just got a new 3 series.

In general I'd choose a Mercedes over a BMW but at the C vs 3 series level the BMW is better, IMO. Also, your going to buy this car with your savings? I think leasing might be a better idea, no?

8/18/11
debitswiss:

Get the BMW. Parents have an S and a 5 series, I learned to drive on an old Benz(E class) and just got a new 3 series.

In general I'd choose a Mercedes over a BMW but at the C vs 3 series level the BMW is better, IMO. Also, your going to buy this car with your savings? I think leasing might be a better idea, no?

Benz usually has 6.9% financing which is retarded, but right now they have their 125th anniversary promotion of 1.25% financing. This is making it very tempting to go with the benz. That's a really cheap rate tbh.

-MBP

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8/18/11

How about you invest the money in some preferred or cash yields??

8/18/11

The GO system is a pain in the ass. I guess I'm looking at it from a different perspective. I'm a minimalist and have a penchant for gambling. I would say save for a house, but you mentioned a mortgage so you may have/sorta have that covered. If you aren't much of a traveler then go for it.

To answer your question, the BMW looks better. For me, BMWs always seem better although I sayw a chick turn onto Bloor yesterday driving a dark grey Mercedes. Don't know what type, but it just growled when it pulled away. The car sounded mean. A rush of blood to the head, so to speak.

-philly g

8/18/11
philgorman:

The GO system is a pain in the ass. I guess I'm looking at it from a different perspective. I'm a minimalist and have a penchant for gambling. I would say save for a house, but you mentioned a mortgage so you may have/sorta have that covered. If you aren't much of a traveler then go for it.

The GO has delays from time to time, but at least the seats are clean and you won't likely run into a crazy guy smelling of urine like you would with TTC.

8/18/11

I would go with the Benz but if you feel more comfortable driving the BMW, buy it.

8/18/11

I just bought a new condo that I moved into 2 months ago. I have a parking spot that's just sitting empty. lol. I really really want a car.

-MBP

8/18/11

C vs 3 series. The 3 wins everytime. I love mybeemer however if i were in your situation and want a fast weekend car that portrays young, fun, and in the beginnings of successful career vs "baller" i would go with the porsche cayman s.

I Got a dollar and a dream...

8/18/11

3 series for sure, if between those two. What about an audi a4? you really can beat the handling of their quattro 4 wheel drive. The 328i is a bit underpowered and their changing the body next year, and the C is such a diluted mercedes, I don't believe its worth it not to mention that its pretty slow. I believe with Audi you can really get the most for your money.

8/19/11

I would get a BMW 135i, reflash the ecu, lower it, get a new intercooler and have a great car. I'd just like to say Audis Quattro is not magic, so much for poor steering feel and understeer.... Speaking of which the xi is a little sanitized compared to a regular 3 series. Do you need AWD? The C300 with an AMG package is still not a true AMG special. Why spend the money for that when you can get much more car? Then again a true "baller" would get a turbo miata.

8/19/11

Wait you said: "I have about 60K in savings, so I'm considering just buying this car with straight cash" You only have 60k in savings and the car costs ~50k. So you're willing to deplete your savings almost entirely for a high powered car which you plan on using to cruise around at low speeds?

8/19/11
shera:

Wait you said: "I have about 60K in savings, so I'm considering just buying this car with straight cash" You only have 60k in savings and the car costs ~50k. So you're willing to deplete your savings almost entirely for a high powered car which you plan on using to cruise around at low speeds?

This 60K is not including the 150K of equity I have in my condo, or the 80K in my trading account. I'm also saving at least 3K a month.

-MBP

8/21/11
manbearpig:
shera:

Wait you said: "I have about 60K in savings, so I'm considering just buying this car with straight cash" You only have 60k in savings and the car costs ~50k. So you're willing to deplete your savings almost entirely for a high powered car which you plan on using to cruise around at low speeds?

This 60K is not including the 150K of equity I have in my condo, or the 80K in my trading account. I'm also saving at least 3K a month.

And this money was gifted to you by your parents I presume? I mean if you were so smart with investing and worked to make this money at 24 than you would know not to buy a depreciating asset with 90% of your savings.

Even if you have been working for barely 2 years out of college I dont think you could have amassed 140K plus what you put down on your condo etc earning only 7k net a month.

Thats 84K net a year and that is not including the 20k or so you will spend on rent plus food/entertainment/ vacations and clothes.

So whats the story?

The one who does not fall, does not stand up

8/22/11
manbearpig:
shera:

Wait you said: "I have about 60K in savings, so I'm considering just buying this car with straight cash" You only have 60k in savings and the car costs ~50k. So you're willing to deplete your savings almost entirely for a high powered car which you plan on using to cruise around at low speeds?

This 60K is not including the 150K of equity I have in my condo, or the 80K in my trading account. I'm also saving at least 3K a month.

lol can i work at your company, live up on bay and college (lol just finished school too!)

"...the art of good business, is being a good middle man, putting people togeather. It's all about honor and respect."

8/19/11

From a car enthusiats point of view, you're either a bimmer kinda of guy or you're a benz guy. There's no middle here, unless you like audi, which is a compromise between both cars. BMW's tend to be associated with the younger crowd since the "ultimate driving machine" feels better to drive and has the panache that the younger crowd looks for. Mercedes tend to be associated with comfort, prestige, and luxury (more so than a BMW 3). As a side note. you're not going to find a $200k BMW, but you'll find a slew of those especially in the AMG series (i.e. S65, CLS55, SL55, etc). Now an AMG sounds a hella lot better than an M3 or 3 series. The roar is defeaning and beautiful, but the car's forte is a straight line. A BMW will twist and turn and run through hula hoop's better than most MB's. BMW's iDrive system is not a good as COMAND in my opinion.

Now then for your question... as to which car you should buy. Well, it seems you're superficial and all about "image", which warrants me to say buy a MB. You said, "MB looks nice." You asked, "which one as more baller status." You're 24 and refuse to buy used. All of this points to one car --> MB.

Enjoy your new Benz.

Time to roll up the sleeves and make things happen.

8/19/11

I'd agree with the above, but I feel the need to point out that if you do buy a beemer, you're driving a car that 95% of the population can't afford. If you buy a Benz, that probably puts you in the category of cars 97% of the population can't afford. If you're talking image, anyone who know cars sees the c-series Mercedes as being the "cheap" option., even if it's AMG. The 3 series BMW isn't looked at the same way, at least I don't see it that way.

"You stop being an asshole when it sucks to be you." -IlliniProgrammer
"Your grammar made me wish I'd been aborted." -happypantsmcgee

8/19/11

Hey Op, i'm not really understanding a few things in your posts.

Each time someone tells you its not a good idea, you magically add and exxaggerate more wealth into the equation as if its not a big deal. If this is really the case, GET A BETTER CAR. If you have 60k in cash, why not just get a S5 or M3?

Also, you claim to be a 24 year old 3rd year consultant and you don't even work at mckinsey (http://www.wallstreetoasis.com/forums/lunch-with-m...) yet you've already claimed:

60k savings
150K of equity in your condo,
and 80K in the trading account
aftertax cash flow of 7k, so 10k a month pretax being generous or 120k max of salary a year
So you have 290k of cash you've aggregated already which given a consertative tax rate would mean you cleared 414k of pretax salary already. Not to mention you've got expenses during all this time so you probably had to make 800k or close to a million to save all that.

Your own math doesn't make sense if you're looking at 40-50k cars and you have 60k in savings but you say you have to take out 20k in financing.

I would say just get a M3 or M5 if you really have the 60k cash and 80k in trading accounts.

8/19/11
Illinoisprogrammerisajoke:

Hey Op, i'm not really understanding a few things in your posts.

Each time someone tells you its not a good idea, you magically add and exxaggerate more wealth into the equation as if its not a big deal. If this is really the case, GET A BETTER CAR. If you have 60k in cash, why not just get a S5 or M3?

Also, you claim to be a 24 year old 3rd year consultant and you don't even work at mckinsey (http://www.wallstreetoasis.com/forums/lunch-with-m...) yet you've already claimed:

60k savings
150K of equity in your condo,
and 80K in the trading account
aftertax cash flow of 7k, so 10k a month pretax being generous or 120k max of salary a year
So you have 290k of cash you've aggregated already which given a consertative tax rate would mean you cleared 414k of pretax salary already. Not to mention you've got expenses during all this time so you probably had to make 800k or close to a million to save all that.

Your own math doesn't make sense if you're looking at 40-50k cars and you have 60k in savings but you say you have to take out 20k in financing.

I would say just get a M3 or M5 if you really have the 60k cash and 80k in trading accounts.

I bought the condo from my dad. The equity was a gift. I assumed the mortgage.

I didn't deposit 80K into my trading account, I started off with a quarter of that and it's grown considerably. While you're stalking my post history, try looking up my post about finding a backer for my trading strategy.

No I don't work at McKinsey, I work at Deloitte. And yes, I do make 120K a year. I'm a "3rd year + associate" in the sense that that's my level at Deloitte. I haven't worked for 3+ years. I lateralled in at that level when I moved here from my old firm.

I initially only mentioned the 60K because the other "wealth" isn't relevant to the original question, since I'm not willing to pull out equity from my condo, or withdraw from my trading account. The only reason I mentioned it later was because people seemed to have the idea that all I have is 60K, and I'm blowing all of it on a car, rather than saving for a down payment or saving for a family - which is not the case.

I think spending 50K on a car is a pretty big expense, and yes, if I liquidated all of my "wealth", I could buy a ferrari, but I'm not planning on doing that. I think 50K is a reasonable budget for me. The 20K financing I was talking about was if I bought an E class mercedes, since it's 70Kish. I don't want my savings account to be completely empty. 10K is a reasonable buffer since it grows by over 3K a month.

-MBP

8/21/11
manbearpig:
Illinoisprogrammerisajoke:

Hey Op, i'm not really understanding a few things in your posts.

Each time someone tells you its not a good idea, you magically add and exxaggerate more wealth into the equation as if its not a big deal. If this is really the case, GET A BETTER CAR. If you have 60k in cash, why not just get a S5 or M3?

Also, you claim to be a 24 year old 3rd year consultant and you don't even work at mckinsey (http://www.wallstreetoasis.com/forums/lunch-with-m...) yet you've already claimed:

60k savings
150K of equity in your condo,
and 80K in the trading account
aftertax cash flow of 7k, so 10k a month pretax being generous or 120k max of salary a year
So you have 290k of cash you've aggregated already which given a consertative tax rate would mean you cleared 414k of pretax salary already. Not to mention you've got expenses during all this time so you probably had to make 800k or close to a million to save all that.

Your own math doesn't make sense if you're looking at 40-50k cars and you have 60k in savings but you say you have to take out 20k in financing.

I would say just get a M3 or M5 if you really have the 60k cash and 80k in trading accounts.

I bought the condo from my dad. The equity was a gift. I assumed the mortgage.

I didn't deposit 80K into my trading account, I started off with a quarter of that and it's grown considerably. While you're stalking my post history, try looking up my post about finding a backer for my trading strategy.

No I don't work at McKinsey, I work at Deloitte. And yes, I do make 120K a year. I'm a "3rd year + associate" in the sense that that's my level at Deloitte. I haven't worked for 3+ years. I lateralled in at that level when I moved here from my old firm.

I initially only mentioned the 60K because the other "wealth" isn't relevant to the original question, since I'm not willing to pull out equity from my condo, or withdraw from my trading account. The only reason I mentioned it later was because people seemed to have the idea that all I have is 60K, and I'm blowing all of it on a car, rather than saving for a down payment or saving for a family - which is not the case.

I think spending 50K on a car is a pretty big expense, and yes, if I liquidated all of my "wealth", I could buy a ferrari, but I'm not planning on doing that. I think 50K is a reasonable budget for me. The 20K financing I was talking about was if I bought an E class mercedes, since it's 70Kish. I don't want my savings account to be completely empty. 10K is a reasonable buffer since it grows by over 3K a month.

you should let me phone informational interview you <3 I will give u sb and tell you some of my trading strategies

8/22/11

I didn't start at Deloitte. I started at a boutique after my MFE. I was making 70K base with a 20-30% bonus range. Deloitte recruiters found me on linkedin and asked me to come in to meet a partner. The partner really liked me and the next thing HR started asking me what I would want to come join. I went balls out and said that I wouldn't even consider a move without a base pay of 100K. I was absolutely shocked when they agreed, lol.

-MBP

8/19/11

I'll start by admitting that I LOVE the 335, so I'm biased...I almost bought one two months ago. A few things I learned.

BMW is coming out with a new 3 series next year. I'm not sure if you'd be happy with the "older" model in 9 months.

Also, seriously look into a gently used car. Seriously, it is really the way to go with nice foreign cars. I bought a Volvo with 17k miles and then sold it 3 years later with 95k miles and only got $7k less than I paid.

On a perception note, we have a LOT of 3-series at work and a few C200 and C300s. I think the bmws are really nice rides, but I think the people who get the lower level C's are trying to be pretentious, but can't get the nicer MBs. An AMG C300 is pretty sweet and definitely better than the C200, but my personal preference is definitely the BMW.

8/19/11

Also, you won't save $ by paying cash. Dealers get a referral bonus from a lot of their financing sources, so they actually prefer you to finance.

8/19/11
accountingbyday:

Also, you won't save $ by paying cash. Dealers get a referral bonus from a lot of their financing sources, so they actually prefer you to finance.

Interesting. Thanks for the tip!

-MBP

8/19/11
accountingbyday:

Also, you won't save $ by paying cash. Dealers get a referral bonus from a lot of their financing sources, so they actually prefer you to finance.

He WILL save $ by paying cash...dude you're on this forum so I suppose you're into finance but you don't know what interest is ????

8/19/11
RZON:
accountingbyday:

Also, you won't save $ by paying cash. Dealers get a referral bonus from a lot of their financing sources, so they actually prefer you to finance.

He WILL save $ by paying cash...dude you're on this forum so I suppose you're into finance but you don't know what interest is ????

He's saying that the kick-backs from the financing deals might offset the interest (which is only 1.25% right now anyway).

-MBP

8/19/11
RZON:
accountingbyday:

Also, you won't save $ by paying cash. Dealers get a referral bonus from a lot of their financing sources, so they actually prefer you to finance.

He WILL save $ by paying cash...dude you're on this forum so I suppose you're into finance but you don't know what interest is ????

OK, OK.....I was obviously referring to purchase price.

btw- I would bet inflation will be above 1.25%, which is the rate he could get on a bmw so taking inflation into consideration I would say he WOULD save $ financing.

On this forum I would expect you to understand inflation.

8/19/11
accountingbyday:
RZON:
accountingbyday:

Also, you won't save $ by paying cash. Dealers get a referral bonus from a lot of their financing sources, so they actually prefer you to finance.

He WILL save $ by paying cash...dude you're on this forum so I suppose you're into finance but you don't know what interest is ????

OK, OK.....I was obviously referring to purchase price.

btw- I would bet inflation will be above 1.25%, which is the rate he could get on a bmw so taking inflation into consideration I would say he WOULD save $ financing.

On this forum I would expect you to understand inflation.

look at my postscount im new here, did not come across the term inflation in my studybooks yet

but i bet you agree with me that he should either buy a big pickup or a ballin hummer right

8/21/11
accountingbyday:

Also, you won't save $ by paying cash. Dealers get a referral bonus from a lot of their financing sources, so they actually prefer you to finance.

not true they just want to move inventory ATM

8/19/11

Be a fucking man and buy a big American pickup or a huge Hummer H2.

8/19/11

Wow, deloitte pays 120k to 3rd years? That's nice.

Ok then I suggest just doing the E mercedes one. It makes no sense to get an entry level overpriced car when the real power and luxury comes in at the 70k range. Get a M3 or something instead.

8/19/11

Buy a used Porsche 911.

Way cooler, just as useful and as good on gas as the others.

"The power of accurate observation is commonly called cynicism by those who have not got it." - George Bernard Shaw

8/19/11

^I want a sedan. It's just much more practical. Plus I don't want a used car.

-MBP

8/19/11

Personally if I had 50k to spend on a car, I'd spend 30k on an Acura, Infiniti, or Lexus and spend the other 20k on vacationing...and/or bitches if I was single.

8/19/11

Shit, if I had 50k to spend on a car I'd put a down payment on an apartment or house somewhere nice/warm. I'd fly there every so often for vacation and rent it out the rest of the time.

"You stop being an asshole when it sucks to be you." -IlliniProgrammer
"Your grammar made me wish I'd been aborted." -happypantsmcgee

8/19/11

50k on a car?? used range rover supercharged full-size big daddy. the ladies love guys with suvs

8/19/11

Get a 335. Don't go with the 328 if you like speed and handling. After a year, you'll be lusting for a faster car and end up getting a M3. I know from first hand experience.

8/20/11

Exactly what Chron said. Whenever I see someone on the road with a 328, 80 times out of 100 its an old ass woman who bought it because it's a BMW. If you're talking straight cash, get a certified preowned 335. What's the issue with used?

8/20/11

Smart money is on used cars. Buy a higher end used model at the bottom of the depreciation curve, or an entry level new car that will lose almost half of its value within the first 5 years. There's a ton of great deals right now with the economy the way it is, and you can find a very, very, very well-sorted used car that will get you a higher end model.

And if you're insistent on a brand new one, you're not going to look "baller" at all with entry level models. Don't get me wrong, they're fine cars so I'm sure you'll enjoy the driving experience, but they'll hardly turn heads. Car guys know that a brand new 328 can't hold a candle to a used M3, and the shallow gals you want to impress will find the design pedestrian enough that a brand new C300 won't turn heads like a used Aston Martin DB9 or even a used Ferrari 360 will.

Also, as you may know, the newer models aren't always better quality or design - the trend these days is for automakers to give the illusion of progress with more nanny-fied electronic gadgetry.

8/20/11
MBAApply:

Also, as you may know, the newer models aren't always better quality or design - the trend these days is for automakers to give the illusion of progress with more nanny-fied electronic gadgetry.

This is so true the new electronics in a car now-a-days are so stupid its unbelievable... I don't need help parallel parking or checking my blind spot because I don't trust you stupid computer and I'm still going to look anyway. Although, reverse camera with the side mirrors tilting down is pretty helpful every so often.

The answer to your question is 1) network 2) get involved 3) beef up your resume 4) repeat -happypantsmcgee

WSO is not your personal search function.

8/21/11
blackfinancier:
MBAApply:

Also, as you may know, the newer models aren't always better quality or design - the trend these days is for automakers to give the illusion of progress with more nanny-fied electronic gadgetry.

This is so true the new electronics in a car now-a-days are so stupid its unbelievable... I don't need help parallel parking or checking my blind spot because I don't trust you stupid computer and I'm still going to look anyway. Although, reverse camera with the side mirrors tilting down is pretty helpful every so often.

i do first driving test i went right on the curve XD

8/21/11

since it's your first car you should aim for 30k-20k

IMO

the further you go up in cost the more insurance you will have to pay

8/21/11

oh and pay with cash

you can get 40% off sticker price if you pay cash, be like ...ok how much off if i write you out a check, can you ask a manager maybe?

you'll get 30% off minimum.

8/21/11

First of all, the dude wants a car so stop saying he should invest it, blow it on models and bottles / hookers and blow, or just save.

In all honesty I dislike both cars. I have never liked the look of smaller BMWs, and the 3-series to mee seems like a very effeminate machine. That said, I d own a 1986 325e...but more so because I got it for $800. I have had a Mercedes C class before and I was not a fan. The driving experience in the BMWs I've driven (my dad has a 7 seres and my mother a 3...nuff said) is far superior to that of a Mercedes. The new Cadillac sedans look awesome IMHO, but the handling is even worse than the Mercedes. It's like the difference between a jet ski (BMW) and a yacht (Mercedes) and the Exxon Valdez (Cadillac).

I personally like the Jaguar XF Premium Portfolio and the Cadillac CTS. The latter has more HP, but idk why it just feels more bloated. Probably the American construction....no joke. The Jag looks awesome and supposedly they don't suck repair-wise like Jags used to. But I don't know anyone with that car, so I'm not 100% sure.

Reality hits you hard, bro...

8/21/11

^ Haven't driven one yet, but I would hope the CTS-V Coupe handles much better. Those things are beautiful.

8/21/11

GTI. Space, performance, practicality and fuel efficient.

Having also driven the 135i and 335is, I would still stand by the GTI.

Really the only thing I would buy until you get to the S4 etc and beyond.

8/21/11

Lol, don't judge me, but I bought an S4. Picking it up next week!!!!!!!!!!

-MBP

8/22/11
manbearpig:

Lol, don't judge me, but I bought an S4. Picking it up next week!!!!!!!!!!

did you get it in red?

8/22/11
JYFresh:
manbearpig:

Lol, don't judge me, but I bought an S4. Picking it up next week!!!!!!!!!!

did you get it in red?

Moonlight Blue Metalic, and I got the 19" rims with it along with the premium package. It came in just over 60K after taxes and so I put 40K down and financed the rest over 3 years.

-MBP

8/21/11

S4s are fun as hell. No judgement. Please tell me you got a manual, though.

8/22/11
ThaVanBurenBoyz:

S4s are fun as hell. No judgement. Please tell me you got a manual, though.

yes, manual of course

-MBP

8/22/11

Dude I just bought an E60 M5 used with 35,000 miles for right around $40,000. It was so worth it. Go buy an M if you have the money. Don't buy new.

EDIT: Just saw you bought an S4. Have fun!

MKballer

8/22/11

S4 is sick, you're going to love that shit.

"You stop being an asshole when it sucks to be you." -IlliniProgrammer
"Your grammar made me wish I'd been aborted." -happypantsmcgee

8/22/11

Grats on the S4! I love MBM. What interior? Please tell me brown.

8/22/11
chron3k:

Grats on the S4! I love MBM. What interior? Please tell me brown.

lol, yeah, the mustang brown silk nappa. Looks sweet. Can't wait to drive it off the lot.

-MBP

8/22/11

I forgot to mention I'm really glad you didn't get the red. The red has always looked bad on Audis imo

"You stop being an asshole when it sucks to be you." -IlliniProgrammer
"Your grammar made me wish I'd been aborted." -happypantsmcgee

8/22/11
D M:

I forgot to mention I'm really glad you didn't get the red. The red has always looked bad on Audis imo

I'd have to beg to differ. IMO, Audi has got a really great, vibrant red. Looks stunning on a S4 or S5.

On the other hand, I hate the look of the 3er red (Melbourne Red). Looks kind of dull--and I prefer my BMWs in blue.

8/22/11

i like the look of the S4 more than the others. congrats

8/22/11

Made a good choice with the Audi IMO. What made you pick that? Nobody on this forum mentioned it. BTW, new season of Top Gear is on BBC America tonight. Know you guys will be tuning in. Can't wait.

8/22/11

Someone did mention it actually. I just test drove it on Saturday and couldn't resist.

-MBP

8/22/11

I still don't get how if Deloitte starts at 55k-60k, how you got to 120k after two years. Plus you saved 60k which is probably like 90k+ pretax of savings.

8/22/11

I just still don't understand why that guy is so intent on proving you wrong about how much you make

"You stop being an asshole when it sucks to be you." -IlliniProgrammer
"Your grammar made me wish I'd been aborted." -happypantsmcgee

8/22/11
D M:

I just still don't understand why that guy is so intent on proving you wrong about how much you make

lol, I know...its pretty strange tbh...next thing people will be asking me to post a picture of my pay stub...

-MBP

8/22/11

Hey manbearpig, good luck in Canada when the housing market plummets in the coming years :). And trust me its coming for you guys.

The one who does not fall, does not stand up

8/23/11
ProdigyOfZen:

Hey manbearpig, good luck in Canada when the housing market plummets in the coming years :). And trust me its coming for you guys.

Maybe that's why he bought a car.

8/22/11

Great choice with the Audi. I love mine. Great car.

If I had asked people what they wanted, they would have said faster horses - Henry Ford

8/23/11

congrats on ur car but why not a m3 or s5?

8/23/11
Illinoisprogrammerisajoke:

congrats on ur car but why not a m3 or s5?

I wanted a sedan. I find coupes too inconvenient. I didn't go for the m3 because i thought i would regret it when the next body is released in a few months.

-MBP

8/23/11
manbearpig:
Illinoisprogrammerisajoke:

congrats on ur car but why not a m3 or s5?

I wanted a sedan. I find coupes too inconvenient. I didn't go for the m3 because i thought i would regret it when the next body is released in a few months.

The point is kind of moot at this juncture, but the new-body (F series) M3 won't be out until the 2014MY at the earliest. The regular 3ers will be debuted for the 2013 MY (available next year). On the other hand, the M3 sedan got discontinued in 2011.

8/23/11

In all honestly both the C-class and 3-series are chick cars, in my opinion. Get the 5 series or the E-class. I just don't understand grown men driving around 3 series' and thinking they're some hot shit...doesn't make sense. I might think this way because I'm from Houston and we like BIG cars down here.

Seriously though, if had the dough you have, I would buy a used E-class with under 15K on it, they go for about 35K to 40K....its a beautiful car.

Btw, don't buy the car because you want to "impress" people, that seems pretty sad, buy the car because you appreciate german engineering!

In any case, mad props for having that kind of cash flow and dough saved up, at 24 you seem to be on the road to riches. Good luck bro.

"Don't quit. Suffer now and live the rest of your life as a Champion" - Muhammad Ali

8/23/11

^lol, thanks for the advice, although it's coming a little late. I already bought an Audi S4 over the weekend. Picking it up this weekend.

-MBP

8/23/11

I think you should save your money, wait for the serious market correction that is coming, then plow your cash into carefully selected investments with a good margins of safety (that doesn't only mean U.S. equities). After that, you will have a different problem- Ferrari or Lamborghini? Aston Martin or Rolls-Royce? No one ever got rich by frivolously consuming now and investing later. And don't say you have enough money so you can spend frivolously because if you had the kind of money I'm talking about, you wouldn't have this problem- you would just buy both.

Bene qui latuit, bene vixit- Ovid

8/23/11
rls:

I think you should save your money, wait for the serious market correction that is coming, then plow your cash into carefully selected investments with a good margins of safety (that doesn't only mean U.S. equities). After that, you will have a different problem- Ferrari or Lamborghini? Aston Martin or Rolls-Royce? No one ever got rich by frivolously consuming now and investing later. And don't say you have enough money so you can spend frivolously because if you had the kind of money I'm talking about, you wouldn't have this problem- you would just buy both.

I have about 80K in my trading account so I definitely plan on seizing the opportunities the current (and not-so-distant) market conditions present. As for your advice about not buying anything, I'm afraid it's too late. I bought a car and I love it. Who knows when the guilt will kick in, but right now I couldn't be happier.

-MBP

8/23/11

You guys catch Top Gear last night? The BMW M1 and Jag were a thing of beauty. BTW, if one wanted to rent a BMW 5 series, Mercedes E class or higher, etc. where would you go? All the regular car rental places have things like Corollas, Ford Focus, etc. and I'm not looking to go high end exotics like Gotham. Is there a way to rent these in-between cars?

8/23/11
shera:

You guys catch Top Gear last night? The BMW M1 and Jag were a thing of beauty. BTW, if one wanted to rent a BMW 5 series, Mercedes E class or higher, etc. where would you go? All the regular car rental places have things like Corollas, Ford Focus, etc. and I'm not looking to go high end exotics like Gotham. Is there a way to rent these in-between cars?

I know Hertz rents MB, not sure about other places

The answer to your question is 1) network 2) get involved 3) beef up your resume 4) repeat -happypantsmcgee

WSO is not your personal search function.

8/23/11
blackfinancier:
shera:

You guys catch Top Gear last night? The BMW M1 and Jag were a thing of beauty. BTW, if one wanted to rent a BMW 5 series, Mercedes E class or higher, etc. where would you go? All the regular car rental places have things like Corollas, Ford Focus, etc. and I'm not looking to go high end exotics like Gotham. Is there a way to rent these in-between cars?

I know Hertz rents MB, not sure about other places

Hertz--at least the one I go to--indeed rents MB (baby Benzes, i.e., C-class). Also some Caddys and Inifinits. Haven't seen much else like a 5, E, etc.

8/23/11

^not that I know of...question is, why would you want to?

-MBP

8/24/11

Good choice bro, been looking at Audi's as well lately.

People like Coldplay and voted for the Nazis, you can't trust people Jeremy

8/24/11

You're choosing between luxury and performance, so:

For that money, you can get a much more luxurious car, or a car with much better performance if you buy used. If you want luxury, get a used S-class. If you want performance, get a used M3. The smell of a new car is not worth the money you pay for it, not by a long shot. Sure servicing costs will be a bit higher, but I doubt the NPV will be worth the 10-15 grand you waste on depreciation. Smart money goes for used cars unless they're incredibly wealthy already, which you're not.

Also, I way prefer the BMW, and have owned two different ones for the past 5 years.

8/24/11

I think the debate of used vs unused is ridiculous. Some people simply don't want used anything. Here on WSO, you have these supposedly "wealthy" wall streeters advocating buying used cars, used watches, even most disgusting of all...used shoes (allen edmonds, ferragamo, etc.) Some people work the jobs they do so they DON'T have to buy second hand.

8/24/11

^I agree, most people fail to realize that used vs new isn't an intellectual decision, it's an emotional one. I just hate the idea of buying someone else's leftovers.

-MBP

8/24/11

Yeah, in fact, sometimes its even better to buy new. you are the only owner and can take care of it for a good trade in later on. also you get the full warranty and you know exactly whats happened to your car.

Most importantly, you'd have to go back a couple years to actually start saving and no one wants a crappy 2009 or 2008 car when you can get a brand spanking new sexified model.

8/24/11

Coming from a hard-core car guy who owns and loves his fully loaded BMW 3 Series... between those two, snag the Merc. and be done with it.

  • Currently under review for Senior Monkey position. Will networking with alum help any?
8/24/11

-MBP

8/24/11

-MBP

8/24/11
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-MBP

8/29/11
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