Stay in LO AM or Move to SM HF?
Title indicates - I've been in LO AM for 2+ years (one of the larger platforms ~$1 trillion) and it's been really solid. I really enjoy my team, getting fantastic opportunities, I like interacting with management teams, hours are solid. However, people know the downsides are 1) one of X many analysts, 2) incredibly difficult to move up over time (impossible to be a PM basically), and 3) LO AM values stability so progression of pay is slower.
I've been also offered an opportunity with a tier 1 SM with solid AUM/IP. The fund has existed since forever. The previous analyst retired and was with the firm for 10+ years so this is a rare opportunity. The role would be a solid step up in pay (not enormous but this will be the first year and it should scale up). My worries are that I'm thinking of having a family so there is capital and founder risk here. This would be more of a L/S opportunity as well. The people seems nice as well.
- What would you guys think? Would you guys make the move or stay and grind it at LO AM until MD/Partner in research?
- What are questions I should be asking myself?
- What are major downsides to each that I should be thinking about
- Any of you monkeys make similar moves or vice versa?
In a similar boat to you and did my own thread on it. 4+ years at a LO with a big team of analysts. Great place to start my career but also want more for myself and same downsides as you. I’d take the opportunity you have. I’m looking for something similar
Thanks for the tip man - what was the catalyst that made you feel like you wanted to move?
My current seat is decent enough. I work for a fund with a few billion in AUM and a PM that regards me quite highly I guess. But the catalyst for me is being tired of the sleepy culture at my firm and realising that I work for a PM who isn’t really willing to mentor and doesn’t spend much time discussing markets. The team is quite large and the job is a little transactional where as an analyst you’re just churning through research. You don’t get much input into the decision making. Ultimately I’d prefer to work for a PM that is a passionate mentor, a smaller team that works hard and more input into the fund. Not sure it’s like this at all LOs but I think I want a more active strategy. Pay is also stable but not great, so that could also change. I just want to work for a good PM that teaches, be useful as an analyst and get paid well for doing it. But in the mean time, I recognise I’m in a decent seat and will only listen to great opportunities.
Can you expand on why you want to make this move? So many people in this forum make mega cap LO sound like paradise.
I think listed above - just the slow progression and lower pay over time. It is paradise in the sense that it's super stable and the people are fantastic and the work generally is quite interesting. Maybe I'm delusional as well and it's a case of grass is greener.
AM at the top funds is great if you can make it to the top, it just takes a significant amount of time to get there and you will be out-earned significantly by colleagues in HF (especially MM analysts who survive) and PE. And your upside is capped even once you make partner (at low 8 figures, working 50 hours a week with low stress).
Some would rather make more money on the way up and have a faster way up, others think they'll be the next Phil Lee making 9 figures in a year.
Some thoughts:
You’re in a great seat so the bar for you leaving should be high
Honestly It is really hard to be generic about this decision - I would say it’s very SM dependent and the specific circumstances at the opportunity
what I can offer is this: think deeply about whether you want to be a career analyst or a PM. It will change over time so try to put yourself in your shoes in 10 yrs, not what feels comfortable today. If you really want to be a career analyst, I would argue just stay put - a LO job is a better risk adjusted job long term for a career analyst. If you aspire to be a PM, the HF may make more sense, but again, highly dependent on fund
This is excellent advice - thank you. I think long-term I do want to be doing quasi or full PM responsibilities. One of my reasons for being hesitant to leave is that the LO AM has been excellent to me in terms of the people, and I feel like I'm backstabbing them by leaving - is that a back reason?
The SM is >$5 Bn and reasonable size of 10-15 investment staff. I feel like less stable than mega LO but they've survived cycles.
Some additional thoughts: I’d think about what your ideal outcome is. If you go to this shop and everything goes as you hope, what does that outcome look like? Can you run a sleeve there? Sector head? Leave to start your own fund? Go MM?
Also ask yourself - does this firm deserve to exist in 10 years. Forget about the past and how they’ve survived the past economic cycles. Chances are the CIO is in the last phase of his career if they’ve been around that long. So what’s the future hold for the firm? Don’t get seduced by the household names of the last two decades. While maybe still have some brand value today, many of those “prestigious” shops have their best days behind them. If you go SM, you need to find the one that will survive and thrive in the future of l/s equity. If the answer is this fund doesn’t have anything special beyond a reputable CIO, I’d probably be less excited. But all that said - it depends on your goals and if this is the next permanent stop of your career or just a few year stepping stone into something else
If it's truly a tier 1 SM, don't worry about capital or founder risk
What do you consider to be a truly tier 1 SM
Couldn’t disagree more
Uh, no capital risk?
Just out of curiosity, what is comp like at your LO and how does it scale into senior analyst?
Why not look at MM hedge fund ?
V different investing style probably, more of the LO skillset translates into $$ at an SM than MM
That's the exact opposite of what I want to do for multiple reasons
Do you think it's actually impossible to be a PM or just that it takes forever?
Nearly impossible these days
I'm in a very similar situation at a large LO. I like the work a lot but career progression seems slow. If I were in your position, I'd take the SM offer if you are comfortable with something that has a higher risk/reward.
What did your recruiting process look like to land the SM offer from a LO seat? It seems like the SM roles are very hard to find. Getting lots of opportunities from pods and some LOs.
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