Is it worth lateraling as a VP?
Struggling to decide if it's worth lateraling to a BB (tier 2, but the specific team is relatively stronger) from my MM as a VP and looking for some perspective.
Background: currently at a decent MM in M&A within a sector team. Culture is generally good, team is quite lean but WLB is as good as it gets IMO for IB (rarely work on holidays and have never cancelled a holiday, most weekends I don't have to work other than sending emails and can delegate the grunt work mostly).
Deal flow has been choppy and there are a small number of better banks in the sector but I've still managed to work on 9 closed deals in 6 years which is ok, not the best and not the worst.
Problem is our pipeline looks absolute crap and we'll be scrambling for the next 1-2 years / need to get super lucky to win things (don't ask me how that happened...)
A tier 2 BB reached out and after some conversations have offered a role. Team is much larger, closing much larger deals (and pitching a lot more with a seemingly healthy pipeline) and has way more headcount at analyst / associate level.
If it was a few years ago when I was more junior, I'd have taken the role but now it's less clear if the ~10% salary uplift, prestige of larger bank / deals is worth giving up the goodwill and relationships I've built at my current bank and worth the risk of things not working out (building reputation from scratch etc., working on more complex deals that take over your life etc.)
Plan is to exit banking in the next couple of years before or after director level anyway. I enjoy M&A overall but my tolerance for the BS clients throw at you is waning and deep down I know I don't want to be an MD/sales guy)
Appreciate any thoughts!
If I’m you, I’m taking the bulge bracket offer and running.
Picture the future. On the subway with the Deutsche Bank banker bag, girls flocking to you, the homeless population bowing down on their knees. It doesn’t get much better than that.
Then think of the weekends. Pulling up to a Greenwich / East Hampton house party on July 4th, dropping the “bulge bracket” in front of your lazy cousin who is still working at Wendy’s. How can you beat that?
Take the lateral offer. Take the keys to the universe.
It’s hard to say
How much brand credibility do you have today? Did you do a top undergrad or mba? What are you prospects outside the firm? How old are you?
What do you want to do?
I’d lean away from the BB. I think if you want to be a career banker it’s a no brained to join , but if you’ve already got one foot out the door then why complicate things …
I'm still figuring that out but recently have spoken to an AI start-up for a growth and product lead role, Corp dev at a high growth PE portco, even considered launching my own eCommerce business on the side (have done this many years ago with some success when I had 0 clue what I was doing).
Deep down I know I cba with the MD life / role although funny enough I'd say my strongest skills are comms/ people management (I usually enjoy talking to and collaborating with clients) - I just want to be more of a decision maker/ do more thinking from a business POV rather than a slave to deal/ said clients and the relentless song and dance.
I've enjoyed the analytical side of things as a banker, project management side of things and working with people / clients but really getting tired of the repetitiveness and e.g the process of pulling together the CIM drives me nuts sometimes.
Currently in late 20s with LT partner who wants to settle down fairly soon (house, kids etc) so that's in the back of my mind too.
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Clear case of just coast until you get RIF’d or want to quit…who knows what the BB group is really like. Stay
Depends. What do you actually want to exit to post-banking? Having the BB name brand on your resume might open up more doors, but really depends on what you want to do post-banking.
Posted a little more on that above - but in short something more corp dev / business related (not interested in PE).
In theory I think getting the bigger name on my CV might make life easier for me when recruiting elsewhere but honestly I've seen plenty of people exit to a whole range of things from my bank at VP / Director level, so I'm pretty relaxed on that front.
Many years ago I was a VP in banking. With what you laid out I'd take the BB offer, particularly if you feel like you'll be leaving IB in the next few years. The bigger name will help you land your next role, but more importantly you will be getting exposure to bigger companies and transactions. That will allow you to build a stronger network to land whatever it is you want to do post-IB. Going to industry will be easier with a bigger name on your resume. I'd also keep in touch with former clients on a regular basis as that is always an easier move. I left IB to start a company, but I was also considering going to 2 clients as CFO or head of M&A at the time I met my co-founder. With a client who likes you the interview process is negligible because they already know your work/ability. Timing, personal needs vs company needs is always a factor, but the more hooks you have in the water, the better.
A lot to think about and I think all your points very valid - as mentioned above in other replies I know I'm not going to be a career banker and want to go corporate/ business down the line - so looking at this mainly from the lens of how would this move help me down the line when switching to something else in 2-3 years and additional skills gained by switching from MM to BB (more complex deals, more corporate clients rather than PE sell-side).
From the moves I've seen people make at my bank, they've all landed decent / interesting roles post banking albeit never at the large cap clients (with occasional exceptions) but still decent companies / roles - so debating the incremental gain of a bigger bank and whether I care about joining a $10bn+ company or $1bn company (or something even smaller).
Best part of Lateraling as a VP = 30 days of garden leave in most cases + a total comp top bucket guarantee package for your first bonus at the new firm (in most cases)
The first 6 months will be a grind as you have to develop your reputation from the ground up. But it’ll be like that for any new job you pursue
You said it’s a tier 2 BB though, so it probably won’t be as bad as a “tier 1” in terms of work-life balance impact. I worked at a tier 2 (BofA/Citi) and it was a breeze compared to the “tier 1” I am at now.
You’ll get exposure to a different skill set though while working at a BB because you will probably deal with a lot of public companies and I’m guessing you don’t interact with them much at your MM firm. We meet with people all throughout our public company clients, not just the CEO/CFO but the treasurer, head of IR, head of corp dev, general counsel, etc. and help them with all sorts of analyses not just M&A. So if you want to go to the corporate side, it might make you a more well-rounded candidate.
I say you have nothing to lose and only have stuff to gain by going to the bb. You can probably always go downstream later on back to a MM if you want.
No reason to put a leash on yourself.
Leaving should not ruin the relationships you've built. Its investment banking and a great opportunity coming from MM.
Nor should ruining the "goodwill" with a group that is dead end at this point, in a career you don't want to stay in... Goodwill is the price of a bonus
I think it depends on the outlook of your bank and your team. I was in your shoes as a senior associate and regretted my move. This was the reverse actually from a tier 2 BB to a MM.
My group was falling apart, folks leaving and I jumped ship. Firm eventually rehired and the people that stayed are doing well and don’t regret they year they chilled now that they’re busy again. They kept the relationships and are recognized for sticking it out. While I hated my move to the MM shop and ended up moving again.
It really depends on what your goals are. If you’re happy with your firm I’d consider sticking it out, especially if they’re going to invest to fix it. If not then moving makes sense. You do have a short window now to decide because it gets harder and harder the longer you wait. Hope this is helpful
Was there a huge difference in work / team structure / culture for things to not work out at the MM?
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Ya it was a total sellside sweat shop
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