No return so what are the options left
I’m still in shock. I learned yesterday that I would not be receiving a return and was at a top BB (GS/JPM/MS). Honestly, still don’t understand why because I received super positive feedback throughout the internship.
I don’t know what to do now. I worked hard to get this internship, and now I don’t have it anymore. My mind will not accept stepping down to a boutique or even MM IB. I just can’t accept it.
I’m thinking about pivoting to consulting (MBB), but BCG and Bain have already closed. As a last minute Hail Mary I’m applying to McKinsey which closes apps on August 11. I know I’m going to get grilled for chasing prestige, but that is what I want. I don’t know how I went from thinking I had a top BB return in the bag to this within a week.
Point is any other prestigious options that are on the level of GS/JPM/MS that I can go for at this point in time? With the level of returns across banks, I feel that FT IB recruiting is going to be chopped, especially since it’s already always been a small intake class. I enjoy most types of work, as long as I feel I’m learning a lot from what I’m working on. Help.
Call me a moron but someone going from a top BB to something like even Wells Fargo makes it clear I didn’t get a return to anyone who sees my profile/resume. At the same time, I also cannot rationally hinge my future on one hyper competitive firm that I don’t know will even interview me. I’m literally McKinsey or bust; how did I even get to this point!!!!
ur prestige whore mentality is gonna fry you in life anyways, nothing u can rly do as long u have that going
I was never a prestige whore. I come from a low income family ($60K/year total).
I just feel like if I step down people will view me as being inferior, as someone who could not cut it at a top firm, and is not high quality. Certainly if it is not others, I would view myself that way. And say what you want but that's the way most people will look and think, and I don't want that for me.
Being this picky without a single offer in hand is how you wind up with nothing at all lined up post-grad. You're not owed anything just because you interned at GS
Sad reality buddy. You just quite literally didn’t cut it. Collect your loses and move on. You can frame a story around why you moved to a mm quite easily…. Figure it out and stop whining like a little baby…..
You are inferior. You did not cut it at a top firm. You are not high quality. If you were any of these things, you would have received a return offer.
Step on the scale and look at the number. Look in the mirror and see what talking gets you. It's time to face the music, buddy.
Well, you could not cut it as an intern at a top firm. That is a fact now. That does not mean you cannot be successful later in your career.
Honestly valid, I’m in the same spot but a step or two down in prestige. Planning on recruiting completely unrelated industries so I can spin a story on having a change of interest / so it doesn’t look obvious that I couldn’t cut it at prior firm
That's exactly how I view it. Only thing comparable that is open right now is McKinsey and that closes in 2 days. And I'm talking in terms of volume as well. McKinsey (and MBB in general) comparatively hires a lot FT, whereas a top IB might make FT post but is hiring like 3 people.
no1. don't be naive, this is not the time
secure an offer - then if you really want to chase prestige, work your way through the chain with time. no-one will sit there and think you're inferior - mostly people only care about themselves anyway.
you're in a strong position, leverage it to land before you "expand" - i use that term incredibly loosely
goodluck
Yes people only care about themselves but I feel like people will just think about me as the guy who almost made it but failed anytime they think about me or see me
Do you not have any seniors or career service you can talk to at your school? I really doubt that any of them will tell you that not getting a RO mean you "almost made it but failed". Making it doesn't depend on getting or not getting a RO lmao. Cry for a few days and then start thinking about how you can spin not getting an RO into wanting to move down to MM but don't change the industry you've been chasing for 4 years lol
I suspect an attitude this disconnected from what defines success, accomplishment and compensation in the real world is why you are in the mess you are in (it’s not really a mess but because you’ve made it one in your own mind, it’s a real problem). Get over your attitude and then maybe you have a chance.
I know what you mean and I completely understand. But for good or bad a measurable part of my self worth is tied with my professional accomplishments and achievements. Don’t be an idealist and say that that’s wrong. Deep down I’m sure you think a little that way.
Your first impression of a McKinsey consultant or GS investment banker is different than a dude doing wealth management at UBS or IB at a bank like Oppenheimer. Even if they were the same person in both contexts.
I’m at the point where I don’t GAF. The top wealth manager at UBS is probably making money and more influential than the top banker at GS (I know, I know them both and the UBS guy has the ear of the top .001% more than anyone alive). And the star banker at Oppenheimer has a lot more freedom and money than the rando MD at GS. I know all about brands - I started my career at two of the most prestigious brands of all, and it was helpful early on but over time means very little.
I think for example my analyst class, which was shining with the good and the great from a prestige standpoint, has probably underperformed the analyst class of my roommate who was at Jefferies (25 years ago lol).
I was also an associate at probably the best brand of the time and we had our pick of analysts out of Wharton and Harvard. Most have done decently well but the only two that hit it out the park were the two who were so bad, we fired.
I care deeply about my professional accomplishments but I care a lot more about what I actually accomplish - in terms of delivery for clients, in terms of what I build as a business, team and franchise, in terms of how I train and build people and yes, in terms of my personal compensation. The prestige gets old fast.
I realize that’s easy for me to say 25 years in but it’s also my experience is that even starting out the people that are successful are the ones who focus on their learning, development and adding value early and that has a very tenuous correlation to prestige.
Are all kids such losers these days?
the irl "i want to work at the goldman sachs" XD
I did work at the Goldman Sachs
Jesus bro no wonder you didn’t get the return- you sound insufferable
Dude my team loved me and the MDs are fully willing to serve as a referral for future jobs so idk fully about that
In my mind I will also be what could’ve been with GS
If your MD’s loved you, you would have been asked back. Holy cope. I agree with the comment below mine: big 4 welcomes you
Big 4 accounting welcomes you
No way lmao I would rather launch a “start up” to save face
start an Only Fans
Your current mindset is getting in your own way. Welcome to the real world, you have to play the cards you're dealt and build some resilience. Go to a MM, outwork everyone in your class, and lateral back to a BB/EB in 12 months if that’s what you really want. Put your head down and get to work.
Prestige doesn't pay the bills. A founder of a decent-sized random LMM PE firm makes multiples of most public MF PE partners because of higher ownership and upside. Prestige only gives you optionality, and eventually even that becomes useless.
Ran summer internship program for my group at GS. You have to be legitimately incompetent or have a genuinely terrible attitude to not get a return. You clearly have the latter. Return rates are sky-high because self-selection into GS already filters out the worst candidates and we aim to give everyone returns.
You're worried Wells Fargo looks bad on your resume? Dude, you already took the L. "Top BB intern, no return offer" is way worse than "Top BB analyst to Wells Fargo IB." At least the second option is an actual IB job. Most people who don't get returns from any bank, including GS, can't even land at WF in this environment, you'd be lucky to get that offer and I'd view that as a top 10% percentile outcome at worst. The optics ship has already sailed. Focus on LMM and MM banks after self-reflecting, those are by far your best bets.
2. Eh cuts were more than they were in the recent past so idrk about that and my MD wants to actively serve as a reference in the future. But yeah maybe not enough to give me a return
3. Yes top BB no return is real bad and top BB Wells Fargo is ok (still a step down) but given my current situation top BB to McKinsey is viewed as equal
As someone who is ex-GS and knows multiple people there, I can tell you for a fact that fewer return offers were only given because quality was worse. An MD referencing you doesn't mean anything except he's a decent human; it has zero bearing on whether you deserved a return. You didn't make the cut. Period. Stop pretending you did, and you will do better.
You're still chasing prestige because you're entitled and delusional. That's exactly why you didn't get a return. 80-90 hour weeks expose who you actually are, you can't fake a good personality for months. Your attitude problem clearly showed, and your personality was a massive negative in evaluations. You have no offer. You have no prestige. You're a beggar right now acting like you're still negotiating from strength. You're not. Wells Fargo would be doing you a favor.
This is spot on. I’m at GS/MS/JPM and have never thought I was above MM firms. In fact I imagine juniors at MM firms have done more deals than me at this point and may be able to run a process better than me. Yeah sure I had the option and picked a top BB but going to MM would’ve been a great outcome for me as well if that were all I got. This person is completely out of touch with reality thinking that they even have a path to a Wells Fargo at this point. The truth is any top 30 bank will be highly suspicious of the fact that you didn’t get asked back at GS. People know that GS tends to want to give 90%+ return offers as teams are usually short staffed at any given point in time. This reminds me of a few years back when i knew someone who went to wharton and didn’t get the return at a top EB. I advised that person to hit up all the MM banks the next day and they told me that they would only stick to top BBs and EBs and MAYBE would consider Citi/BofA and would otherwise do MBB recruiting. Guess what? Said person ended up at some random corporation I had never heard of. How is that for not wanting to be “seen as inferior” to your target school buddies?
You simply didn’t make the cut kid. Funny you mentioned how your MDs and team love you and yet didn’t receive a return offer from a less “prestigious” place. My intern was like this and implied he only came to our bank because he started recruiting late. Everyone hated this attitude and almost didn’t give him a return. Me and the other VPs had to vouch for him because he truly did amazing work. Think about what you said / did during your internship, I suspect it rubbed people off the wrong way.
I’m quite self aware and did not say anything that could be interpreted in a bad manner. Didn’t even bring prestige or whatever up and was just chill and good at my job
This has to be bait.
“I’m quite self-aware, all my MDs loved me and I did good work”
If that were true, you would’ve gotten the return. You need to do some self-reflection. Based on this post and other comments, you sound pretty insufferable. I’m guessing that rubbed off.
You’re gonna be fine. Stop prestige chasing and do some self-reflection. No one wants to ever work with the hardo prestige chaser.
The next week is key. Banks are selectively recruiting to fill spots like yours. Go find a full time offer and you can lateral in 1-2 years.
It’s not that deep.
I’m applying to everything under the sun
Lil bro realize you got clipped. But these jobs like Goldman Sachs and mckinsey and even a startup are just slavery. All of these jobs lead to you being someone's bitch in life and always performing. Take this time and think about what you really want out of life. in the time you could do ib you could be a millionaire and only work 10-20 hours a week if you lock in right now and stop worrying about prestige. I was once in your shoes. I went to a hypsm and had top offers but turned it down and now live overseas in my early 20s. Every now and than when i see a post like this that catches my attention i chime in. But please lose the mindset and just think and everything will work out. That's how it was for me and how it will be for you.
Sure but I don’t plan to do it for than 2-3 years. A worthwhile time to see what it’s about and learn quick. But agreed not going to be in this for the long run
Do you understand all the time you would put into one of these jobs you could be likely making 100-500k per month if you locked in. I'm saying the 2 years you could've spent grinding this job you can set up something that produces the salary in a month or week. Lock in lil bro. Everyone on this thread is telling you to grind ib or down grade no. Just accept the L and grind the 2-3 years to build a system that makes you a bag bro.
Sorry to hear about this, but just as a heads up ppl tend to overestimate how much others analyze them.
Not getting a return is a pretty normal thing. Lots of people have to downgrade from their summers. If you were at GS/MS/JPM then FT recruiting is probably by definition going to mean a downgrade.
It seems you care more about working in the most prestigious firm with in an industry, regardless of industry.
You're in luck. Chick Fil A is hiring.
Also wondering if you know what your feedback from the summer was? Is it headcount or no culture fit? Figuring out in some way why you didn’t get the offer is helpful before trying to secure FT.
extra salt on my shit lil *****
lmao
This kind of insecurity is going to crush you lil bro. I wish you luck in your endeavors.
So what I’m hearing is I have a job at Wells Fargo and you have no job? Got it lmao
this has to be ragebait by an MD who likes to play around with people at these forums
you mentioned a $60k household in the same post everyone is calling you a prestige whore for. those are related. the brand was the cushion and you do not have a second one.
you mentioned a $60k household in the same post everyone is calling you a prestige whore for. those are related. the brand was the cushion and you do not have a second one.
I have to believe this is bait. Well done - you have baited us.
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