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Comments (88)
Rest of post got cut off... housing at under $2K/mo helps rationalize the $1.7K spent on going out (restaurants, bars, Ubers, etc)
A1 at BB
$3,000 spending
$1,500 rent
~$1,000 saved monthly
Is this in NYC? The rent seems quite amazing.
Yeah, NYC. Have two roommates
Minimum $111k in 2023. Tied up between multiple assets and services I'm committed to
$100K - $110K per year in rent, food, and expenses. I don't vacation much and I love food delivery services. I don't have any car payment either.
"If you always put limits on everything you do, physical or anything else, it will spread into your work and into your life. There are no limits. There are only plateaus, and you must not stay there, you must go beyond them." - Bruce Lee
Maybe ~$30k/yr in discretionary expenses between eating out, impulse buying goofy stuff, going out to sporting events/concerts, etc. ~$15k/yr in HOA dues and property taxes that include all utilities (no rent, woohoo!). Rest goes to liabilities such as debt repayments, HSA/medical, vehicle maintenance and upkeep, etc.
Looking very forward to not renting soon...
Looking significantly less forward to those damn HOA fees...
It may seem annoying, but like I pointed out it includes all utilities such as electric, gas, water, trash, maintenance and then all the frivolities like concierge, valet and designated underground parking. So for the $700/mo it costs? Totally worth it. Then there's the property taxes which do suck. But thanks to being in an apartment and not some urban sprawl they're not exorbinate thankfully.
Tier 2 city
Rent / utilities: ~$1,700/month
Food / travel / misc.: ~$1,200/month
Total: about 35k a year
The short answer is as little as I can. However, if we're looking at 2022 outflows then I can't quite claim that I live 'frugally' - a lot of incurred expenses this past year, both intentional and not so. Think 2023 will be a little lighter on the wallet - that's my goal anyways.
Wife and I bring about $475K/yr pre-tax, nets us to just under $310K filing jointly and including 401K & RIRA deductions. Fuck taxes, but at least I get a good chunk of that Fed stuff back. Would say about $60K of that goes to living expenses, which I am so damn excited to change. Once we get settled in TX and actually buy a fucking house, I can stop writing $4,500 checks for a place that I'll never own.
The good news is that with the exception of stocking our new place, most of the big stuff is a one-off and thus less likely to be a continual problem. We got a lot of 'big-boy' furniture this past year and moved out of the IKEA realm. My car accident post-insurance (both car and medical) was about a $10,500 haircut I had to take, which hopefully isn't repeatable. The new car ran me about $50K gross, and $30K net for the insurance payout from my prior. For those who travel for business, my number-one recommendation is to combine your personal vacations with 'em if you can - yeah, sucks to not take a PURE vacation but I've found some sweet deals. For example, I was in London a couple of months ago and brought my wife so we could stay for a few days after. I expensed the covered hotel, all meals during the business period, and my roundtrip airfare, leaving me to only pay out-of-pocket for costs incurred after our covered three-day stay. Combining expenses and AMEX points, I was able to turn an $8K vacation into maybe $1750.
Lastly, got married this past year. My FIL was kind enough to cover the ceremony & reception, but everything else was not cheap. Combined w/ the honeymoon, that was another $15K. Granted, that's a once-in-a-lifetime experience, so won't complain about it too much.
The only reason I say all of this is to convince myself that these were one-off expenses, but 2023 will probably hold all kinds of surprises - both good and bad. I aim to save 40-50% of our combined THP, and we're doing a good job overall. Just be aware of your finances, yet not paranoid about it. That'll get you all pretty far.
Did you get a pre-nup with your wife? Why or why not?
I have a lot of pre-marital assets, and it's really preventing me from settling down because I'm frightened of divorce in marriage....
Nope, I don't have one. Logically, I should, and I know that. But it is a hard conversation to have with someone, and I'll be the first to admit I just wasn't up for it. Our income does have some discrepancy - of that $475, about $350 is mine and she takes the rest. But that gap is smaller than a lot of couples that I've seen and we work well together.
From your perspective, I perfectly understand why you'd have reservations. I don't have a lot of assets that would have liability splits should our marriage ever go south, but if you have some stuff that's in the grey area it's definitely something to think about. I really think it just comes down to individualism, as each couple will be different. I can say personally that my wife wouldn't have even given a shit about the financial side of things - she comes from money, and I'd have to make Partner at an MF PE group to even come close to the money on her side. The only reason I didn't get one is that I didn't want to put the idea in her head or mine that our marriage might end. I don't think it will ever, neither does she. But I know that shit happens, and God forbid if something ever happened between us.
But overall, yeah - I get it. You will do what's best for you and if she doesn't like the answer, everything will work itself out. Best of luck to you on your love search, Pizz!
Obviously it depends on your jurisdiction, but whatever assets you have coming into the marriage are generally considered spousal property. Or it is in NY, at least. So if you've got $1mm in your PA, you're getting that out first in a divorce. So there isn't really a risk of "losing" assets, you'll just have to split income and appreciation.
That being said, usual caveat that you should talk to a lawyer about the laws in your home state/country.
A lot of people get prenups today it's not a big deal
You wrote a lot of filler and forgot to mention how much you spend in a year or per month...
"If you always put limits on everything you do, physical or anything else, it will spread into your work and into your life. There are no limits. There are only plateaus, and you must not stay there, you must go beyond them." - Bruce Lee
I did actually do that. I knew I was forgetting something.
If we take our 'anomaly' year of 2022 as an average, I'll break it down:
Breakdown may be a little off, but we'll save around $190K this year post-tax. Once my tax return is finalized I'll get some of that back, and I made about $23,500 in capital gains for 2022. This was a HEAVY spending year but lots of changes.
An1 who started a sem early:
$3k rent
$2k discretionary
$1k save
I should be saving more for sure. I have poor spending habits. No student loans, though did have to cover a ~10k elective surgery recently.
Undergrad analyst at MBB, MCOL city. I spend about $1,500 on rent, parking, and utilities and a total of ~$3,500 per month. I save and invest about $3,800 per month and hope to hit $200k net worth by 26. I'm incredibly grateful to have no student loans (went on full academic scholarship) and no car payment.
NYC IB. $2,700 a month on rent and sub-$500 a month on all else. If I lived with roommates I think I would be downright miserly.
Insanity.
"If you always put limits on everything you do, physical or anything else, it will spread into your work and into your life. There are no limits. There are only plateaus, and you must not stay there, you must go beyond them." - Bruce Lee
prolly lives on ramen and never leaves home
A1 in LA
Rent $1250 (good deal)
Utilities $150
Gas $100
Car $500 (wanted something nice, luckily locked something down financed at 2.8%)
Car Insurance $180 (young male with a nice car, fuck me I guess)
Gym $275 (Equinox, use every day so fine splurging)
Phone $0 (comped by firm)
Food During Week ~$50? (dinners comped by firm + OMAD during weeks)
Discretionary ~$1k (weekend food/going out, misc. expenses)
I think post tax I take home ~$6500 a month, so the balance is savings.
1250 in LA? How?
Array
Bruh where do you live? Sherman oaks?
To salt in the wounds, actually surprisingly in Beverly Hills. Have a housemate who I effectively house sit for who travels a lot for work.
Married 2 kids, late 30s, ~$30k/mo including it all. It adds up. Country club, schools, real estate, charity, furnishings, artwork, vacation, Kids extracurriculars, housekeeper /nanny. Saving several hundred k per year as well. I like my lifestyle and make no apologies to fatFIRE hermits. Enjoy your life and earnings, already seeing friends die of cancer etc. not trying to be the richest in the graveyard. saved enough for long enough, no longer worried so much
What do you do?
MF PC
$2.2k monthly (LCOL) and I put away about $2000 every month since I split everything with my roommate. I spend at least $7.5k on every racing season (Spring to Fall) and that number only goes up each season. Tires, suspension tuning, new bike and parts, and racing fees has me at almost $5k already and the season hasn't started. Luckily my job can help me stay in organized race events, but I plan on staying with it as much as I can as my income grows. I'd rather spend the money on equipment that could help keep my life intact and avoid a $30k hospital bill down the road.
What LCOL area has rents of 4.4k?
what kind of racing do you do and where? and how can one get into it? I love driving fast but have no idea if I could do it as an organized hobby. I usually just rent a car and do 160 on highways lol.
$1500 rent
$1200 student loans
$800 food
$500-1500 other
=>$4-5k/month.
This is actually interesting. I haven't looked at this in awhile. 2022 is the first period I can with some accuracy, we got Ramp going the prior year so there's no distortion any more from business expenses that get reimbursed.
I am a one credit card guy, so these are good numbers for daily lifestyle. I looked at the category breakdowns, it's "Merchandise & Supplies", "Travel", then "Entertainment" for the top three. This does not reflect housing, vehicles, air, art, or anything else that goes by wire.
I do not live frugally. I agree with dutchduke, taking it all with me has never appealed to me. My philosophy is that leaning more heavily into the discretionary things helps me stay plugged in and going. Have to enjoy the ride to want to stay on it.
Single, male, 30's.
I am permanently behind on PMs, it's not personal.
I had to triple check this. Monthly CC payments of $100k? You're spending $800k-$1.2mm per year after taxes and housing isn't even on that thing? Do you make $4mm per year? Dear Jesus
Array
no way it's CC payments. it's just payments from bank account. can be transfers to his broker account to buy stocks. probably withdrew everything in Jul 22, panic sold at the bottom cause the market was down. and then once market started going up, he started moving money back from bank account to broker account.
my bank account also shows payments $10k every month even though $4-5k of it is me moving money to my broker acc to buy stocks. and I could even create a payment of $100k within a month if I moved money back and forth 10 times.
Do you see yourself marrying and having kids eventually?
Most certainly. I hope to, and a meaningful portion of my work on myself has been in preparation for this. This made me think of a longer comment I wrote on the 'Then and Now' series from the beginning of the pandemic.
I have seen that many of your comments are about women and money. Is there something specific here you're asking?
I am permanently behind on PMs, it's not personal.
Oh he rich rich.
Array
.
If you don't see yourself becoming partner, you will never become partner.
"If you always put limits on everything you do, physical or anything else, it will spread into your work and into your life. There are no limits. There are only plateaus, and you must not stay there, you must go beyond them." - Bruce Lee
Never really understood why spending like that is a flex. Everybody has a different idea of how they want to live their life, and what a "comfortable" lifestyle is.
For me, even in NYC, I'm able to live fairly well on less than $1,000 per month. Of course this doesn't include rent, but even with this budget I'm able to go out once in a while, afford a nice gym membership, buy my family/friends small gifts, and get decent clothes for myself.
I try to avoid the hedonistic treadmill of lifestyle inflation as much as possible, but I can also understand the folks that have the "spend more to make more" mantra.
You and me both. Also in NYC, I quickly learned how big of a disparity there is between good restaurants and expensive restaurants. At the latter, half the time I felt like I was paying for a nice tablecloth with mediocre food.
Array
I spend about $200k-$250k a year. $60-70k in housing and the rest is discretionary / family.
I run my budgeting numbers every month, just to see how close I am to early retirement without accounting for any inheritance proceeds.
My main apartment mortgage, escrow and common charge is 120k. My other apartments have renters that almost cover the mortgage, so negative outflow is 15k. So total housing costs per annum of 135k.
Childcare costs 55k. Groceries cost 20k. Vacations and airfare cost 20k. Car and garage costs 25k. Nice dinners cost 20k a year. Fancy crap like a suit or electronics or jewelry is about 10k a year.
Then there are always some unexpected expenses that pop up. I always budget 15k for that.
So total is about 300k a year, all after-tax money.
Spending summary:
$45,000 annual mortgage
$20,000 on food (favorite hobby is eating out)
$6,500 on daycare for my best pal golden retriever
$7,500ish on travel
$5,000-6,000 on splurges for myself or wife
$10,000ish miscellaneous (car insurance, dog food, random little stuff like this)
Total annual spend: $95,000
Income summary:
$150,000 from dayjob
$100,000 from side hustle/hobby
Total annual pre-tax income: $250,000
What's the side hustle/hobby? Curious to hear your story on that if you're willing
I'll message you
Spent $75k in rent and discretionary spending in 2022. Per month on average I spent, $1730 on rent, $377 on groceries, $400 on large purchases (macbook, TV etc), $700 at bars, $500 at restaurants, $700 on recurring charges (includes $450 car payment, netflix etc), $115 on clothes, $440 on travel (ubers, lyfts, hotels for weddings), $720 on vacations, and $40 on utilities. I save ~$6k per month with a pre-tax income of ~$250k. Not married but have a GF and we eat out a lot, also clearly I enjoy drinking
Per month:
$4k in rent (1br in a doorman building and live alone) - I don't plan on living in a place this expensive again when my lease is up
~$1.2k for a personal trainer/workout classes
~$200 on groceries
~$500-$1k on going out (dinner, bars, etc)
~$500 on lunch/snacks at the office (4x week in office)
~$200 on random items (streaming, etc.)
Then probably $5-$10k on vacations for the entire year
Annual estimates:
Mortgage + property taxes + home insurance = ~$40,000
Groceries + eating out = ~$12,000
Random vacations = ~$10,000
Random purchases that aren't house related = ~$3,600
Tuition + health insurance for the son = ~$11,500
Utilities and other bills like internet = ~$5,500
This isn't all out of my pocket. My wife foots some of the bills although our income is growing further apart with time so I foot most (ex. I pay for ~65% of the mortgage line item, almost 100% of the vacation line item). Rough estimates but I think this covers things pretty well. Did some quick math and I probably personally pay for ~$60k of this ~$83k total.
Array
Live in Philadelphia (is that a tier 1 or 2 city?) up for debate
Rent $900
Utilities $80
Car pmt and parking garage: $700
Groceries/everything else: $800 - 1,200
Save about $1,000-1,300 each month post tax
Used to live in Philly about 10 years ago, where are you living with that rent? Asking because I paid a bit under $1K in an 'ok' area near Center City with a doorman (crappy amenities otherwise but the apartment itself was spacious, had something like 850-900 sq feet to myself).
To answer OP, live in a MCOL area paying around $2.7-3K monthly as a MBA student. High end depends on how much I go out socially.
I live in a townhouse in Logan Square that isn't professionally managed. Landlord is lawyer that owns this to make an extra few bucks. Also I don't live by myself, I have two roommates. Just signed a lease in Rittenhouse for a studio for $975 and only have to pay the electric bill which I'm stoked about. The building is for sure tired but can't beat the price and location
5k on learning (books, language, BJJ)
<30k on mortgage, taxes, insurance & utilities (smaller house in suburbs of T3/maybe T2 city)
20-30k travel (excl. gas which is a lot bc I drive 20-25k miles a year and both cars take premium)
probably 10-15k on food & booze (incl. restaurants)
3k on car but soon to be 12k most likely (old paid off one is dying)
<1k on clothes unless I buy a suit
Live in NYC, spend around 3k a month i want to say.
Rent+utilities is about 1300 a month.
I also spend about 400 bucks a month on a car (don't use it in NYC)
I spend a good amount on uber eats (eating out in general)/lyft rides.
Ok dude, I will. thanks
"If you always put limits on everything you do, physical or anything else, it will spread into your work and into your life. There are no limits. There are only plateaus, and you must not stay there, you must go beyond them." - Bruce Lee
Depend on situation i'm in. It will maybe be 100 of dollars or just 50, there are various situations
T3 city and I don't spend much, maybe ~$3500 - $4000 a month between us.
But then I have random BS fees that I don't think should really count but I guess are real. Like my US visa cost is about ~$10k a year, and my healthcare will be ~$20k this year, maybe more.
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