What job has the best Comp / Effort ratio?
Asking for a friend... how does one get real rich without too much exertion? Other than, like, marrying rich or something.
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MD in bond syndicate / capital markets at a BB is a pretty chill gig. Our MDs in that group probably clip $1mm a year and are always playing golf/ leaving by 6:00 to go to happy hour with investors
I'd like to point to the fact by the time you get to MD level, you don't really want to go to happy hours everyday, or even 2 times a week. I know people in client facing positions like this and they get super unhealthy. BUT leaving by 6pm is pretty good deal
loan sales (leveraged loan sales). 8 or 9-5, when u leave, work is over. u just BB chat all day or go to happy hours to network w other loan sales ppl, and 1 of the guys is either texting or on WSO half the day bc he’s bored and isn’t overworked
Loool.
Im a loan trader (buyside) and was going to say my job/path is pretty fking great.
My boss clips north of 1mm (good years probably 1.5) Comes in at 9 leaves by 5 everyday. 4 on Fridays. And on Fridays he takes us out for an hour and a half lunch (complete with 2 beers)
Dude doesnt work on Fridays in the summer. Guy is killing it
Holy shit, can you elaborate more on your job mate? What do you do exactly and what was your career path?
Sure. Let me be clear though, my path is not the same as my bosses and I will never clear near that amount. He is head PM for some accts and also head trader. My absolute best outcome would be taking over all trading once he calls it quits.
I work at the asset management arm of a large Lifeco as a trader for the high yield group. I trade loans, but also backup for HY bonds. We manage insurance acct money, mutual funds and CLOs.
Its a gravy job for sure. Basically how it plays out is that the ins company needs a floating rate group to match some floating rate ins products it sells. That pays our salary. With the infrastructure in place (analysts, trading) the incremental cost to manage CLOs is negligible. Just on management fees (managers usually invest across the stack in their own deals) you are looking at 35-50 bps per 500mm deal. And you issue a few of those per year. That pays the bonus
What is your background and the background of others in your seat?
My background is absolutley nothing special.
Non target. Good, but not 4.0 student. Networked into a PWM role out of school. Worked there for a year before getting a job at a top AM in risk/MO. Was there a few years and kept networking like a mofo. Had an internal offer for a trading role on the IG desk (also cushy) but they lowballed the fuck out of me. Networked into this role.
Having a great attitude, a good personality and an open mind on where you career can take you goes a long way. Also reading the hell out of this site to understand the industry and job functions go a long way for a non target. People notice that.
We dont recruit UG and my team is small on the desk so hard to give a good common background. Id say most desks hire from the sellside. You also get guys who move internally from MO->TA->Trader.
For credit analysts we recruit from levfin groups at BBs
Is this still a good path for someone starting their career?
Absolutely. It is the one area of AM that hasnt felt a ton of pain on fee compression.
COVID will also be good for the business as a bunch of shitty managers have jumped in chasing fees with garbage portfolios geared at gaming CLO test metrics. They will get crushed and not come back.
One thing is there arent a ton of seats. If you can find one its really a great place to be
Mutual funds. The top PMs at places like Fidelity/Wellington/etc basically just need to slightly outperform their benchmark and they can make disgusting amounts of money. Know a PM at one of those places and he worked ~20 hours a week on average and made ~$20M his best years. Getting there is very difficult, but once you're there its an awesome gig
What about PMs in index funds such as Vanguard/State Street? Are they able to make a lot given the fund’s low cost strategy?
I think they make a lot less, but not positive. Lower fees generally leads to lower comp, but I don’t know anyone at a Vanguard/Blackrock/etc so can’t say for sure
Would the path entail 2 years of banking then switch to a MF and climb the ladder from analyst to PM?
They mostly hire post MBA, what you do pre-MBA doesn't really matter as much. Best path is probably some sort of buyside equities gig (either right out of school or post banking), but can do really anything that leads to an M7 and then get in from there.
Corporate banking is great. I’m not rich but put in 30 hours a week and clear $160k as an Associate.
30 hours? what bank are you at?
I don't think many people that go into a job with this attitude end up being rich...
Maybe not rich, but definitely comfortable... which isn’t so bad.
Totally agree, personally, I think more people should strive for comfortable. It was more-so in response to 'how does one get rich without too much exertion'.
Coverage bankers who aren't in the weeds on execution seem to have the best job on the street. Clear path to partner and are pretty much relationship focused
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